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Author Topic: DF Overhaul - Insects  (Read 4371 times)

Enemy post

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #105 on: November 29, 2019, 12:16:38 am »

I like 2. You could also get rid of their population numbers and biomes to ensure they never spawn without player intervention.

I also strongly support the idea of making more non-playable civs, for variety. Right now, the world tends to be a bit empty with only harvestmen and ants around.

I'd suggest not doing 5, just because my experience making sentient robot pets has taught me to avoid those whenever possible.

I also think 1 isn't a good idea, since it lowers variety and many players will be confused and frustrated if their non-black ant/harvestman citizens can't gain skills. I promise this will be the case even if you clearly explain it in the mod description and any help files you include.

I also wanted to suggest making the difference between intelligent and non-intelligent bugs being whether or not they are social.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2019, 03:09:09 am by Enemy post »
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brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #106 on: November 29, 2019, 01:59:33 pm »

I like 2. You could also get rid of their population numbers and biomes to ensure they never spawn without player intervention.

Good point. I'll do this.

I also strongly support the idea of making more non-playable civs, for variety. Right now, the world tends to be a bit empty with only harvestmen and ants around.

I also wanted to suggest making the difference between intelligent and non-intelligent bugs being whether or not they are social.

It looks likes the social bugs are ants, termites and some bees/wasps. I could add three more entities with multiple insects that could be chosen for the civ.

So, entity:

1. Black Ant (playable)
2. Harvestmen (playable)
3. Ants, possible creatures:
army ant
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
weaver ant
4. Bees/Wasps, possible creatures:
honey bee
mason bee
mining bee
wasp
yellow jacket
etc.
5. Termites, possible creatures:
dry wood termite
damp wood termite
cone head termite

Have you encountered any underground creatures by the way? I haven't seen any yet and I want to make sure they aren't broken.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2019, 04:49:59 am by brolol.404 »
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Enemy post

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #107 on: November 29, 2019, 02:14:36 pm »

I hadn't checked, I've only played Adventure mode so far.
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brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #108 on: November 30, 2019, 06:18:02 am »

I hadn't checked, I've only played Adventure mode so far.
Oh ok. Once I finish adding all of the npc entities, I can send you an updated version if you want.

brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #109 on: November 30, 2019, 06:28:47 am »

These are the civs (and intelligent races) at release, but I will make an intelligent copy of all creatures for adventure mode.

1 black ants
2 harvestmen
3 other detailed cave civs (not-playable), possible races:
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
bumblebee
yellow jacket
dry wood termite
damp wood termite
cone head termite
4 other tribal civs (not playable), possible races:
army ant
weaver ant
executioner wasp
honey bee
paper wasp

brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #110 on: November 30, 2019, 07:01:41 am »

I also plan to make a simple creature tile for all of the civilized races (ant, harvestmen, bee, wasp, termite) and a creature tile for the ant drone and ant queen for easy identification in game.

Lurksquatch

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #111 on: November 30, 2019, 09:21:25 am »

These are the civs (and intelligent races) at release, but I will make an intelligent copy of all creatures for adventure mode.

1 black ants
2 harvestmen
3 other detailed cave civs (not-playable), possible races:
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
bumblebee
yellow jacket
dry wood termite
damp wood termite
cone head termite
4 other tribal civs (not playable), possible races:
army ant
weaver ant
executioner wasp
honey bee
paper wasp

For the detailed cave civs, I think having at least one kind of termite makes sense. They tend to compete with ants anyway, with some having developed specific weapons for fighting off ants (including soldiers with actual glue-guns for heads) that would make them interesting to deal with.

Bullet Ants could be interesting, as would yellow jackets. I'm not sure how a flying civ would work in game, but it would be "fun" to try and fight them lol. Maybe leafcutter ants to round out the three, since they're the ones that actually practice fungus farming in real life?

As for the tribal civs, I think executioner wasps are a must, if only for the name lol. Army ants would be interesting, though I'm not sure how you'd replicate their "roving through the forest in millions strong columns eating everything they come across" behavior. Maybe they could be a goblin analog, instead?

Can I interest you in tent caterpillars? They're probably not social enough to count for a full on civ, but they might do the trick for a cave civ.

Can I also interest you in Ambrosia Beetles, which I just found out about today and are considered to be the oldest farming creatures on Earth? Again, they might not count for a full civ (though they do have distinct queens and workers), but a cave civ might fit.

On the subject of beetles, have you heard of ironclad beetles? They might make for a good addition, maybe to savage biomes? They're herbivores, but their exoskeleton is so tough people have to use powerdrills to punch through them. I can see them as large, neigh-invulnerable food thieves, simply waltzing into your nest and taking what they want.

EDIT: Thinking about it some more, maybe savage biomes include insects that are, well, "savage": particularly large, dangerous or weird bugs that wouldn't make sense in cave environments. Atlas moths, Hercules beetles, queen Alexandra birdwing butterflies (might just call them birdwing butterflies), goliath birdeaters, stalk-eye flies, scorpionflies, etc. Just the really big, scary things that don't really live in caves that you probably don't want to mess with as an ant. Some of them might break the 20 billion mark, but I can think you can exceed that with size multipliers, or you could fudge the numbers a bit.

Here are some examples just in case you were interested. I know you've been trying to figure out savage biomes, hope this helps.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2019, 09:40:49 am by Lurksquatch »
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brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #112 on: November 30, 2019, 01:23:28 pm »

Here are the graphic tiles:

worker/drone/queen ants:


harvestmen


bees


wasps


termites


For the detailed cave civs, I think having at least one kind of termite makes sense. They tend to compete with ants anyway, with some having developed specific weapons for fighting off ants (including soldiers with actual glue-guns for heads) that would make them interesting to deal with.

Bullet Ants could be interesting, as would yellow jackets. I'm not sure how a flying civ would work in game, but it would be "fun" to try and fight them lol. Maybe leafcutter ants to round out the three, since they're the ones that actually practice fungus farming in real life?

As for the tribal civs, I think executioner wasps are a must, if only for the name lol. Army ants would be interesting, though I'm not sure how you'd replicate their "roving through the forest in millions strong columns eating everything they come across" behavior. Maybe they could be a goblin analog, instead?

I probably should have explained this better. I was planning on adding all of those races as civs, but I will only have 4 entities. So, during worldgen the game will create 1 black ant civ, 1 harvestmen civ, 1 random civ from the other detailed cave civ list, 1 random civ from the other tribal civ list and then repeat that (possibly choosing different civs from those lists). So, every world will at least have black ants, harvestmen and a few other civilized and tribal races from those lists.

1 black ants

2 harvestmen

3 other detailed cave civs (not-playable):
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
bumblebee
yellow jacket
dry wood termite
damp wood termite
cone head termite

4 other tribal civs (not playable):
army ant
weaver ant
executioner wasp
honey bee
paper wasp

I will have to look into glue gun heads for the termites. I'm not sure how I could simulate that, but possibly a paralysis syndrome.

I was debating on how to handle army ants. I don't want to make any dark fortress civs, because that would add demons, hell and "slade" towers into the world. I read that army ants don't really nest anywhere. They just roam so either a tribal civ or just a large cluster of wild animals would probably make the most sense.

Can I interest you in tent caterpillars? They're probably not social enough to count for a full on civ, but they might do the trick for a cave civ.

I can add tent catipillars, but they would probably have to be a tribal civ because their nests are silk tents in trees and there is no way for me to replicate that using the settlement types in game.

Can I also interest you in Ambrosia Beetles, which I just found out about today and are considered to be the oldest farming creatures on Earth? Again, they might not count for a full civ (though they do have distinct queens and workers), but a cave civ might fit.

I will add ambrosia beetles. If I make them an intelligent civ though they will probably be in the cave detailed group so that they arnt as common as the two main civs.

On the subject of beetles, have you heard of ironclad beetles? They might make for a good addition, maybe to savage biomes? They're herbivores, but their exoskeleton is so tough people have to use powerdrills to punch through them. I can see them as large, neigh-invulnerable food thieves, simply waltzing into your nest and taking what they want.

This is a really cool idea. I will add ironclad beetles as really tough food thieves. I will probably have to create a new chitin material for them.

EDIT: Thinking about it some more, maybe savage biomes include insects that are, well, "savage": particularly large, dangerous or weird bugs that wouldn't make sense in cave environments. Atlas moths, Hercules beetles, queen Alexandra birdwing butterflies (might just call them birdwing butterflies), goliath birdeaters, stalk-eye flies, scorpionflies, etc. Just the really big, scary things that don't really live in caves that you probably don't want to mess with as an ant. Some of them might break the 20 billion mark, but I can think you can exceed that with size multipliers, or you could fudge the numbers a bit.

Here are some examples just in case you were interested. I know you've been trying to figure out savage biomes, hope this helps.

Very cool ideas. I will go through these later. thanks! :)

Enemy post

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #113 on: November 30, 2019, 02:03:50 pm »

Why not forest retreats for army ants? Those don't have actual buildings.
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brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #114 on: November 30, 2019, 03:55:42 pm »

Why not forest retreats for army ants? Those don't have actual buildings.

I thought about adding forest retreats for some of the civs, but I'm not sure how it will work with the "trees" in this mod. I might just get huge grass plants that wind around in strange patterns, but I can test it.

brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #115 on: December 01, 2019, 10:33:09 am »

I made a sprite for the beetles/roaches (tile 003).



and I remade the spider sprite (tile 018)



I may make a few simple sprites like these to represent each type of bug (beetle, spider, moth, etc.)

I finished adding all of the intelligent (social) and civilized creatures and all of the non-intelligent bees and wasps. I will go back to working on the spiders and beetles again.

brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #116 on: December 02, 2019, 09:29:23 am »

After adding the civilized races, I realized that most of these can be fort mode playable. So, I am going to make the following races playable in fortress mode:

black ant
harvestmen
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
yellow jacket
formosan termite

For now, the following races will be intelligent, but will only be found in the wild:

army ant
weaver ant
bumblebee
honey bee
executioner wasp
paper wasp
dampwood termite
drywood termite
tent caterpillar
ambrosia beetle

The following bees/wasps will not be intelligent (as they are not social) and will act as wild animals

carpenter bee
leafcutter bee
mason bee
mining bee
orchid bee
cicada killer (semi-megabeast)
cow killer wasp/ velvet ant
hornet (semi-megabeast)
mud dauber
potter wasp
tarantula hawk (semi-megabeast)

Let me know what you guys think :) I

If I am ever missing/forgetting something (like a previous recommendation) feel free to remind me. I am trying to keep track of everything, but sometimes things get lost and I forget lol

justaguy3

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #117 on: December 02, 2019, 10:28:17 pm »

Is this playable yet? I read something earlier about a beta, is there any way you could post that here?

This is coming along very nicely, it looks like!
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brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #118 on: December 03, 2019, 06:01:01 am »

Is this playable yet? I read something earlier about a beta, is there any way you could post that here?

This is coming along very nicely, it looks like!

I'll update it and post the beta tonight :)

brolol.404

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Re: DF Overhaul - Insects
« Reply #119 on: December 03, 2019, 07:21:32 pm »

Here is the beta file:

Bug Fortress BETA v0.04

It is a complete package, so all you have to do is download it and play.

Let me know if there are any issues/bugs.

There is still a lot that needs to be added/fixed/changed, but it should be playable in fort and adventure mode.

EDIT: there is also a "bug fortress worldgen" in design new world that makes the world a region and removes werebeasts, titans, necromancers, the magma sea, hell, etc.

EDIT2: I havent had a lot of time to test this mod so any feedback would be appreciated. Screenshots/stories welcome too. :)
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 07:57:23 am by brolol.404 »
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