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Author Topic: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!  (Read 5627 times)

Naturegirl1999

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #165 on: December 26, 2019, 12:02:21 pm »

FallacyofUrist hasn't been active since two days ago. I don't think we'll get a response before day end. Still, better to lynch someone uncertain than someone known to me to be town (i.e. myself).

Naturegirl1999: if you believe FoU is suspicious, why aren't you voting for him this close to the day ending?
Fair point
FallacyofUrist
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Persus13

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #166 on: December 26, 2019, 12:05:39 pm »

NQT: What time zone is 10:40 PM on the 26th of December? Or at least, how far of is that?

I was going to vote Fallacy to break the tie until I could get a more coherent post together, but Naturegirl ninja'd me.
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Persus13

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #167 on: December 26, 2019, 01:17:29 pm »

I'm not sure when day is ending, so I'm going to push my thoughts out there and leave this here for now. My main takeaway is that Fallacy seems to be playing a different game than anyone else, Deus Asmoth seems to be trying to get Tea lynched instead of hunting scum, and dolores is the only other person who actually paid attention to the info we got from Superdorf. I'd prefer a Deus Asmoth lynch today over a FallacyofUrist one, but I could see them being buddies.

ICT
Have you read your Role PM now?
Yes. It changed nothing. I'd like to hear you speculate on why I performed no night action.
I'd like to hear you not try to encourage a bunch of WIFOM.

Deus Asmoth: Slight scum. Posts are few and not particularly content-filled. States that this is their personal playstyle, but it remains that it hasn't been very effective town play.
You've played with Deus Asmoth before, right?

It would have literally no effect on my decision.
That's a lie you tell to yourself. All of us are vulnerable to the sunk cost fallacy, and knowing that town has to put in more work to win, town is also less likely to throw all that work away than scum. That work is what I mean when I say someone is invested in the game.
Why is the Sunken Cost Fallacy more applicable to town than scum. I don't have a scumread on dolores, but I could easily see someone invested in the game as a scum player coming back to post.

Persus13: Earlier you said that a town vig is a powerful tool in the right hands. Is Shadowclaw a bad town vig or scum trying to hide behind idiocy? Is there a valid reason a town vig would ever use a random-target kill, outside of something like being outnumbered by scum already? (This keeping in mind that in this game, random-target abilities can also hit the user.)
I think if Shadowclaw was scum, he'd fakeclaim something more safe, like not taking a Night action in a game that doesn't seem to have investigative roles. Shadowclaw also doesn't have a random kill, he has a random prime, and while that's foolish to use in a game with two, possibly three primes, on its own its not to bad. The thing I find most suspicious is Shadowclaw claiming he was relying on Tric not being primeable, as that can't be true. Otherwise Shadow seems pretty town.

Shadowclaw:
This is clearly an anti-town move, and my rationale is probably that the ones voted that user off have the potential to have collaborated with you, I donít know if their is a mafia sub-chat even more so itís time to reveal my role.
Most Mafia games I've been on this forum have had a quicktopic for the Mafia to chat in, as well as a quicktopic for dead players to chat in. Knowing NQT, this game will be no different.

Anyways we probably have 2 or 3 Scum players out of the 7 (I donít think 4 Scum out of 9, seems exactly fair...) and this is the most critical moment in this game since once we reach the point that their are equal or more scum players, than they can tie-lock and kill each night. So if their is three scum players, if the lynch comes out to town, unless their is another vigilante to even the odds the scum practically win, unless their is 2 of them.
I'm inclined to agree with you that we may have 2 or 3 scum here.

In addition, we actually know almost all, if not all of the roles in the game right now thanks to Superdorf. Besides your prime, there's an infect and another prime, possibly even a third prime, some or all of which could be town, although some or all could be fairly useless abilities. The main issue is we don't know the alignment of the person with the other Prime/Ignite, and that person now knows that there's two more people they can ignite tonight, which could be catastrophic for town as much as it could be for scum.

Deus Asmoth
As you say later, you're not dolores, so why are you putting words in her mouth? She never said that it was against the rules to post here after requesting a replacement. And in spite of your attempts to claim credit for baiting her into posting, most of that post wasn't directed at you at all. The fact that you're presenting it as such- and that dolores was more than willing to allow you to do so- is probably the scummiest thing in this game as of yet.
This is literally denying reality. I remember reading dolores challenging NQT to ban them for posting while out, because that's super weird and not how Mafia games usually go. I think overall you have some good points in your dialogue with ICT, but this just feels too much like scum making up stuff and hoping it sticks for me to ignore.
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IcyTea31

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #168 on: December 26, 2019, 02:56:25 pm »

You've played with Deus Asmoth before, right?
Thanks for reminding me to check his past games. I've played with DA in a bastard game, in a game in which I got daykilled D1, and a game in which I was scum. I think the first two are too odd to establish a pattern, but in that last game, he was town and scumhunted pretty well, though with a very concise style unlike the one he's using in this game. It was over a year ago, so noting the different playstyle isn't particularly useful. Hell, I've changed my playstyle for almost every game I've joined thus far.

Quote
Why is the Sunken Cost Fallacy more applicable to town than scum. I don't have a scumread on dolores, but I could easily see someone invested in the game as a scum player coming back to post.
In leaving the game, a scum player loses a bunch of shameful lies. In leaving the game, a town player loses bunch of done detective work they're probably proud of. The sunk cost fallacy is more applicable to town than scum, simply because town have sunk more cost into the game, especially someone like dolores who prides herself in playing an active daygame as town.

Quote
I think if Shadowclaw was scum, he'd fakeclaim something more safe, like not taking a Night action in a game that doesn't seem to have investigative roles.
Are you so sure about that? Shadowclaw seems to be proud of their "hail mary" that according to them is a pro-town move.

Do you have a full readlist you could drop? You mention some of your reads, but collating the most important of your thoughts to a single place would help me for later.
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notquitethere

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #169 on: December 26, 2019, 03:52:28 pm »

The deadline is GMT. However it now turns out I'm staying with some family tonight so the day is extended another 12 hours until 10.40AM GMT 27th.
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dolores

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - D2 - Sock-related Massacre
« Reply #170 on: December 26, 2019, 04:40:32 pm »

I'd prefer a Deus Asmoth lynch today over a FallacyofUrist one, but I could see them being buddies.
I'm assuming they are. There's work that I could do (and should) to give myself a better perspective on DA that I haven't done yet, but FoU's posted like four lines since I made my case on D1 and none of them were redeeming.
I don't have a full grasp on how scummy (or not scummy) DA is because I haven't gone as indepth on his posts as FoU, in part because there are more of them.
I started writing basically a reads list below this so I'll format it as one:
Spoiler: Reads (click to show/hide)
Shadowclaw:
This is clearly an anti-town move, and my rationale is probably that the ones voted that user off have the potential to have collaborated with you, I donít know if their is a mafia sub-chat even more so itís time to reveal my role.
Most Mafia games I've been on this forum have had a quicktopic for the Mafia to chat in, as well as a quicktopic for dead players to chat in. Knowing NQT, this game will be no different.
There's a persistence to things like this that makes me think Shadowclaw isn't putting it on. It's something you could be easily coached to do (by DA), but I can't see an FoU-Shadowclaw scumteam having much coaching.

In addition, we actually know almost all, if not all of the roles in the game right now thanks to Superdorf. Besides your prime, there's an infect and another prime, possibly even a third prime, some or all of which could be town, although some or all could be fairly useless abilities. The main issue is we don't know the alignment of the person with the other Prime/Ignite, and that person now knows that there's two more people they can ignite tonight, which could be catastrophic for town as much as it could be for scum.
The infect has me really worried, if for no other reason than because nobody has claimed it. It's always possible that ICT was softclaiming it earlier, but that's a casket of wine I'm happy to let age till D3 if I ever have to open it.
Deus Asmoth
This is literally denying reality. I remember reading dolores challenging NQT to ban them for posting while out, because that's super weird and not how Mafia games usually go. I think overall you have some good points in your dialogue with ICT, but this just feels too much like scum making up stuff and hoping it sticks for me to ignore.
For reference, that was directed at Meph. Back when I came back from doll I still had the cookie on my phone and reported my own post with an explanation (to get doll banned) but Toady never did anything and Meph supposedly didn't see it. Getting banned, technically or socially, has no impact on the posts I had already made up to that point, and it wasn't even that likely. I trust NQT a lot though, so I was pretty concerned about the modkill (which I would say was the 'right' thing to do, if maybe bad for subforum activity).
Anyway, the fact that you have to qualify that not all of what DA is posting is fabricated bullshit is key to why I'm lynching FoU first over DA.
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notquitethere

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Day 1 - 1 replacement needed
« Reply #171 on: December 27, 2019, 06:51:54 am »

End of D2

Urist only had one llama wool sock. "I just prefer odd socks!" he cried as they dragged him before the hammerer.

"You're missing a sock, the murderer is missing a sock, therefore you are the murderer," said the hammerer before caving Urist's head in.

Afterwards, they reflected on the syllogism and realised it didn't logically follow. From that day the mistake in the reasoning 'if X has a Y, and Z has a Y then X = Z' was to be known as the Fallacy of Urist.


D2 Votes
Persus13
Dolores
FallacyofUrist - Dolores, Naturegirl1999, Icytea31 [3]
Deus Asmoth - Persus13 [1]
Naturegirl1999
Shadowclaw777
Icytea31 - Shadowclaw777, Deus Asmoth [2]

FallacyofUrist was lynched. FallacyofUrist was town.

Spoiler: FallacyofUrist (click to show/hide)



It's night. Please send your actions as soon as you can. If you don't want to act, please let me know. Night ends when all actions are in in, or in 24 hours: 28th December 11.50AM GMT
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notquitethere

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - N3, Game Over Already
« Reply #172 on: December 27, 2019, 05:38:12 pm »

End of N2

Vampire necromancer assassins and members of the secret 1331 Club, Persus13 and Icytea31 stalked down the corridors of the fortress cackling to themselves about their plans. Icy had managed to steal some pardons from a noble and had pardoned his ally (the other pardon was accidentally made out to the elf-loving Nature Girl, but no matter, they'd get her in time). As they were walking and talking, Persus was aggrieved to see a huge vent of magma shoot out of a grate and melt Icy completely.

At the far end of the fortress, Shadowclaw was enacting his master plan. He had set up a series of grates to magma tunnels to the lever before him and all he had to do was wait and pull it. Unfortunately, he had completely forgotten which sluice gate was attached to the lever and to make matters worse, unbeknownst to him, the Urist of the Fallacy had also linked up the lever to some vents above various bedrooms. So when it came time to pull, not only did he destroy Icytea31, but also Dolores and Deus Asmoth were destroyed in their beds by several tons of molten rock landing on them and their dearest possessions.

This was particularly unfortunate for poor Deus, as he was cuddling up to a fresh pardon for himself and was sleeping quite soundly. Dolores had just finished crafting a masterwork adamantine breastplate for Persus13 and was quite satisfied with helping who he mistakenly thought to be a loyal dwarf.

After this mayhem occurred, Persus flew into a mad tantrum and bashed Shadowclaw into the fine lever he was operating, leaving bits of the dwarf across the beautiful mechanisms. The only survivors at this stage were Persus and Naturegirl (who had rather slept through the whole debacle) and while they naturally tried to put the blame on one another, they had both letters of pardoning to save them.

And so Persus merely waited until Nature Girl collapsed out of exhaustion (as there was no way she was sleeping now she knew who the killer definitely was), not having to sleep himself being a vampire after all. After sinking his teeth into her neck he decided now would be a fine time to try Adventure Mode.


Shadowclaw777 was killed. Shadowclaw was town.
DeusAsmoth was ignited. DeusAsmoth was town.
Icytea31 was ignited. Icytea31 was mafia.
Dolores was ignited. Dolores was town.

Spoiler: Shadowclaw (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: DeusAsmoth (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Icytea31 (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Dolores (click to show/hide)

D3
All players have been pardoned.

N3
Persus13 kills Naturegirl1999.

Naturegirl1999 was town.

Spoiler: Naturegirl1999 (click to show/hide)

Persus13 was Mafia. The Mafia win!

Spoiler: Persus13 (click to show/hide)
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notquitethere

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #173 on: December 27, 2019, 05:46:43 pm »

Thanks everyone for playing and thanks too to the spectators. Sorry it was short and sweet and very deadly!

Here's the Spectator Chat / Deadchat.

Here's the mafia chat.

Spoiler: D1 Actions (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N1 actions (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: N2 actions (click to show/hide)

As you can see, town arsonist probably can't be considered a particularly pro-town role, so town were unlucky I included two of them, though the town doctor could have prevented some of the ignitions, and one town player (unfortunately lynched d1) was immune to arson.
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Shadowclaw777

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #174 on: December 27, 2019, 08:23:57 pm »

I guess it’s time for closing statements

Could I have played better?, isn’t that obvious I was just mainly lazy and had difficulty of making statement on the shit I wanted to say. My guess was on IceyTea and Dolores being scum buddies after this post since IceyTea was obviously going for the easy to lynch people so I was very suspicious, if you try to get people to lynch for the edge lord or rather the most awkward townies then how is town going to counteract that? I believed Persus could of Scum, that user was my third guess on who was mafia well no I’m flat out lying IceyTea kinda made me think Deus was being suspicious , and I get of let town by saying I was a a vigilante. Maybe another thing is that I have trust issues, and IceyTea seems like the back traitor type especially after previous forum games. I wonder if Bay12 Mafia ever experienced neutral roles like Jester or Executioner , or maybe something like a Ammesiac (One wants to be lynched, the other has to get someone lynched, the amnesiac gets to choose town or scum with their tole ability)

The only serious questions is probably directed at @Dolores, how you know that IceyTea was definitely town by your thinking?, I feel that user was just doing suspect things since the game started and when he started leading conversation, I knew someone was most likely up that why I tried to bring it up. (Fallacy if active could of helped me since I was a fellow town arsonist)
« Last Edit: December 27, 2019, 08:26:10 pm by Shadowclaw777 »
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Superdorf

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #175 on: December 27, 2019, 08:34:58 pm »

Well played all!

Now then. I'm muchly curious-- IcyTea-- did you really refrain from reading your role all through that day, or was that a lie to help placate us?

Deus Asmoth

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #176 on: December 27, 2019, 08:50:31 pm »

Well that's a shame. Apologies for missing the end of the day, but eh. I'm kind of surprised that the scum team wasn't dolores-ICT, but that would have been a bit overt.
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Shakerag

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #177 on: December 27, 2019, 10:05:51 pm »

Well played all!

Now then. I'm muchly curious-- IcyTea-- did you really refrain from reading your role all through that day, or was that a lie to help placate us?

It's a valid tactic.  I think Toaster would do that regularly.
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IcyTea31

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #178 on: December 28, 2019, 02:09:50 am »

Thanks for the game, all. This was the first time I earnestly tried the power wolf strategy, and I'm surprised how well it worked on certain players, even if a good fraction saw right through it.

Now then. I'm muchly curious-- IcyTea-- did you really refrain from reading your role all through that day, or was that a lie to help placate us?
I read it right before I voted for you for the first time.

Could I have played better?, isnít that obvious I was just mainly lazy and had difficulty of making statement on the shit I wanted to say.
It's all a matter of practice. The daygame is really about making clear and honest (or seemingly honest) statements. Look how other players break their arguments to small pieces by inserting quotes of the person they're responding to, and how different players type in different tones at different times. This is a game of communication, so ultimately the main advice I can give you is just that: communicate!

And don't worry, I'm not actually personally mad at you for carelessly using your ability. I was overplaying it for the sake of the game.
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IcyTea31

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Re: Proc Gen Mafia 3 - Game Over - Mafia Win!
« Reply #179 on: December 28, 2019, 02:15:33 am »

Persus13: what was that breadcrumb you mentioned in an early message in mafiachat?
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