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Author Topic: Smallhands - it's like a tiny home but filled with ghouls  (Read 145017 times)

nogoodnames

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #150 on: March 22, 2020, 09:23:32 pm »

Ah! I think I have a better solution. Copying the spine body part but removing [PREVENTS_PARENT_COLLAPSE] and giving that to echidnas will allow them to be pulped while in ball form.

I inserted that change into an old backup save and Olon smashed Roastedscaled within seconds!

So, shall we end our immortal echidna problem forever? They've certainly added character to the fort, but I think they've outstayed their welcome. What's you opinion, mko?
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Laterigrade

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #151 on: March 23, 2020, 01:45:36 am »

I think that if it’s getting it down to 10 FPS on a fort specifically designed to avoid that, we should probably do it; the problem will continue forever if we don’t fix it because the damn things can’t be killed.
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delphonso

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #152 on: March 23, 2020, 05:02:13 am »

Laterigrade is right. I vote do it.

mko

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #153 on: March 23, 2020, 07:08:55 am »

Ah! I think I have a better solution. Copying the spine body part but removing [PREVENTS_PARENT_COLLAPSE] and giving that to echidnas will allow them to be pulped while in ball form.

I inserted that change into an old backup save and Olon smashed Roastedscaled within seconds!

So, shall we end our immortal echidna problem forever? They've certainly added character to the fort, but I think they've outstayed their welcome. What's you opinion, mko?
I would treat it as workaround for a blatant bug and do it. DF being DF, it is a poor idea to wait for a version with bugfix.

But is it also going to affect also living echidnas? Is it viable to remove "curled into a ball" mechanism? Looking at https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Body_token it is typically found on spines.

But it is better to have no echidnas at all than this absurd.
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King Zultan

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #154 on: March 23, 2020, 07:15:59 am »

I also support the ability to kill then echidnas.
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auzewasright

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #155 on: March 23, 2020, 07:50:49 am »

I vote against, though I believe we should at least delete this one echidna that is lagging the fort. Personally, I don’t think we should modify things except for the purpose of increasing FPS.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 07:57:13 am by auzewasright »
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nogoodnames

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #156 on: March 23, 2020, 09:34:13 am »

Alright, looks like the consensus is to go ahead with the mod.

But is it also going to affect also living echidnas? Is it viable to remove "curled into a ball" mechanism? Looking at https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Body_token it is typically found on spines.

It will effect both living and undead echidnas. Removing their curling ability doesn't fix the already broken echidnas, they still behave as if curled up. What seems to be happening is that curling up prevents any damage except to the root upper body part, which can't be pulped until the spine is destroyed. These things have literally had their flesh completely liquefied, but are still held together because the spine can't be damaged. With my change, they're still able to curl up but are vulnerable to lethal damage.

The only side-effect is that it might make echidnas slightly more vulnerable to upper body damage in general. I think that's reasonable though, given their size.

For anyone who wants to know the details this, is what I'm doing:

I haven't touched hedgehogs, but they're subject to the same bug.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 10:32:50 am by nogoodnames »
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Salmeuk

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #157 on: March 23, 2020, 12:16:22 pm »

What seems to be happening is that curling up prevents any damage except to the root upper body part, which can't be pulped until the spine is destroyed. These things have literally had their flesh completely liquefied, but are still held together because the spine can't be damaged.

My god! The image of a little ball of pink flesh wriggling around, trying to die, but nothing can finish the job. . *shudders*
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auzewasright

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #158 on: March 23, 2020, 02:54:53 pm »

Sounds good, though I will admit I’ll miss invulnerable echidnas (not that there is anything stopping somebody in the future from editing it back...), if only because I was looking forward to using them against demons in the future. For an IC reason, I guess maybe something about how echidnas have been weakened thanks to Roastedscaled being banished?

Edit: Someone should probably edit the wiki to note that echidnas are nearly invulnerable when curled up.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 03:03:19 pm by auzewasright »
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nogoodnames

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #159 on: March 23, 2020, 08:52:58 pm »

===+ Journal of the Undying Overseer – Winter 104 +===


2nd Moonstone

I suddenly feel… lighter, somehow. As if a great weight has been lifted from the world. Perhaps it is a sign from the gods that our prayers have finally been answered.

Even the surface has become more peaceful. The zombies have stopped fighting whatever was out there. Now if only they would start moving into the traps.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)


15th Moonstone

The zombies stumble around on the surface without going anywhere in particular. It seems like the closest group are gradually moving in, but it’s impossible to be sure. I may have a plan to rile them up, but we’ll need to make some preparations first.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

One upside to our situation is that we finally have some downtime for the migrants to get to know one another. Just the other day I saw Ast telling the tale of our queen’s coronation on the eve of battle. Little things like that should help keep morale up.


21st Moonstone

The main entrance has been sealed with some hatch covers for additional protection. Now let’s see if this gets the zombies moving again.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Well it got one of them moving, at least. We’ll have to coax him out of there, but he can’t get in thanks to the hatches. Experiment unsuccessful.

The only other option would be to open up the main labyrinth. Its intended entrance is closer to the main body of zombies, but it was never completed. It has many stone-fall traps already, but I doubt it can handle the entire siege. We’d have to do some significant work to make it viable.


21st Opal

Over this past year I have been feeling more and more like my old self. I may never again be able to truly relate to the living, but perhaps I don’t need to. I have my own role to play here.

Tradition dictates that citizenship ends upon death. My case is special, but I realize that I have seen myself as separate from the rest of the fortress since my resurrection. I think it’s time to change that. By my authority as overseer, I officially restore my status as a citizen of The Mint Sack and member of The Little Pick.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It’s as if that little moment of self-realization ignited a chain reaction across my mind. The mental block that has kept my daily work restricted to the same old patterns has vanished. I feel ready to take on any role our people require of me.

The most obvious application for my undead might is defense. I do not tire, I do not bleed, and I can shrug off injuries that would cripple or kill a normal dwarf. With a full suit of steel, I would be practically invincible. For now, I will train with Moldath. Perhaps one day our strength will be enough to turn back the tide of our enemies and take the fight to them. When the time is right for revenge, I would gladly lead the charge against the tower of Sinewsabres.


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Superdorf

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #160 on: March 23, 2020, 08:57:00 pm »

Aw man, a year or two of residency and intelligent undead petition for citizenship? That's amazing.  :D
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delphonso

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #161 on: March 23, 2020, 09:14:00 pm »

Very very cool. I'd heard about this from other forts. Wasn't sure if you'd last long enough to see it.

nogoodnames

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #162 on: March 23, 2020, 09:20:02 pm »

Yeah, I'm pretty glad he didn't die to that ghoul soldier after getting so close. It's a shame about Olon though. Properly equipped, she could probably take on this siege alone.
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Salmeuk

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #163 on: March 24, 2020, 10:17:20 pm »

The most obvious application for my undead might is defense. I do not tire, I do not bleed, and I can shrug off injuries that would cripple or kill a normal dwarf. With a full suit of steel, I would be practically invincible. For now, I will train with Moldath. Perhaps one day our strength will be enough to turn back the tide of our enemies and take the fight to them. When the time is right for revenge, I would gladly lead the charge against the tower of Sinewsabres.

Oh man this fort has gotten so grimdark I can't even - an undead overseer? With full citizenship? Amazing!

« Last Edit: March 24, 2020, 10:19:00 pm by Salmeuk »
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nogoodnames

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Re: Smallhands - a small fort for small computers (small overseers wanted!)
« Reply #164 on: March 25, 2020, 08:23:07 am »

===+ Journal of the Undying Overseer – Final Entry +===


1st Granite, 155

Spring has arrived here in the Desert of Furs, ushering in the new year. In some ways, our situation is not much different from what it was a year ago. We once again find our handful of survivors trapped underground by an army of the undead.

But it would be foolish to assume we have made no progress. With nine fully capable dwarves, we are in a much safer and more productive situation. We reclaimed the centre of the fortress and have gone a long way towards cleaning up after the disaster two years ago.

Our efforts for these past few months have been focused on memorializing the many dwarves we lost. A coffin and slab have been constructed for each of the dead. About half of the slabs have been engraved and the coffins are being moved into a chamber behind the memorial hall.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

In addition to the slab, an event from each dwarf’s life is being engraved on the wall. Unfortunately, for many of these dwarves the most memorable event in their life is being stomped to death by a zombie camel.

The zombies still shuffle around, avoiding our traps. I would say they are just too mindless to realize they can get to us, but they’re being led by ghouls and even a few living commanders. Clearly their goal here is to starve us out or at least cut off our contact with the outside world, but why Smallhands? Are we such a threat that they can devote entire armies to keeping us down?

Well, maybe we will be. My training with Moldath is going well. I’ve picked up an axe and learned some minor skill with it. I had learned a few things about fighting thanks to my time battling the zombies alongside Olon, but I’d never touched a weapon before. Salmeuk is forging two sets of bronze armour for us. Just the minimum for full coverage, we still need to be a bit frugal with our wood supply.

We’ve also constructed an archery range for Ast to practice in. Bolts won’t be much use against zombies, but we’ve still got the goblins to the south. I’m sure they’ll take interest in us eventually.

Since the zombies aren’t moving in, I’ve locked up the door to the cage trap hall and released everyone from the emergency burrow. It’d be just our luck for them to suddenly charge in and overwhelm the traps during a moment of inattention. I was also getting tired of dwarves complaining that the burrow is stopping them from collecting some extremely important object that they absolutely need to store away now. Never mind that said object is on the surface and they aren’t allowed to pick it up anyway.

Our wood supply is much better than it was previously. Even with charcoal making, we’ve still got a full pile of the stuff from replacing those aquifer walls. I’ve also noticed that some new fungal trees are growing in the walled off section of the cavern.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

That should satisfy our needs for a while. The rest of the caverns are still too dangerous to enter. That giant lizard has been tearing through everything that wanders past, turning the whole level into a bloodbath. I do wonder if the human ghoul we captured would be able to handle it. She’s caged up in our general temple for now.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Aside from our difficulties in amassing wood, we’re quite well stocked here. I haven’t been ordering new meals to be made, but there are plenty of ones from before the fall that are still edible. We’re only growing plump helmets and pigtails at the moment, so drink variety is less than ideal, but not awful.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yes, I think we are in a good position. Smallhands is the safest and most prosperous it’s been for the past two years. The undead couldn’t destroy us when we were at our weakest, and they won’t be able to now.


I took on the position of overseer because I was the one who could survive in an impossible situation. I was the one who could make the necessary decisions for the good of the fortress, unclouded by emotion. The memorials to Laterigrade and Olon attest to that fact.

But that’s not what we need right now. Dwarves need inspiration, something to look forward to beyond mere survival. I can’t give them that. This undead form is a thing of stasis. The future belongs to the living.

And so, I step down as overseer. I will remain to assist the next one, tirelessly performing whatever duties are required of me. I know I leave the fortress in good (and small) hands.

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