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Author Topic: Museum III, adventure succession game (DF 0.47.05)  (Read 407782 times)

Eric Blank

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2310 on: September 20, 2022, 01:58:47 am »

Which is a lot. Like, an excessive amount of gameplay.

I'm interested in how worldgens of the same seed progress. In any of them does the necromancer apocalypse never occur? One in which Cog never decides to go full psycho? And if so, the Hands of Planesgifts never exist? Or better, what other races of experiments are created instead, and are they similar or totally different to Orid Xem Prime? How procedurally generated creatures are produced is fascinating
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Lurker Z

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2311 on: September 20, 2022, 02:32:23 am »

Which is a lot. Like, an excessive amount of gameplay.

I'm interested in how worldgens of the same seed progress. In any of them does the necromancer apocalypse never occur? One in which Cog never decides to go full psycho? And if so, the Hands of Planesgifts never exist? Or better, what other races of experiments are created instead, and are they similar or totally different to Orid Xem Prime? How procedurally generated creatures are produced is fascinating

Cog and Oddom definitely rampage regardless. All dwarven civs but the Walled Dye... well, die. The Walled Dye miraculously survives even when Oddom wins. The elven civilization is always dead, which begs the question on how they survived in our world.

There are definitely different necromancer experiments names than in Orid Xem Prime. The history breaks down not later than the second century. For example, Asmel Avuzadas doesn't exist in the world Oddom Thobmunèst Arban Nitig‎ exists, though granted that world deviates the greatest in my experiments. Even in this highly deviated world where Oddom starts a different named group, has much different actions than canon and thus a lot less success, Oddom gets the same slab as in canon from the same deity as in canon. All the creatures from ATBT exist, though some gain different epithets (poor Egu gets some really lame ones).



And since the subject is ongoing, we return to Galka "Tunnelglazes" Gujegcango. Why is she always generated in the place of our Omon Obin's Law-Giver? I don't know. The only answer I can come to is that it's because I put reveal history on, which brings me back to how Galka's presence has doomed our chance of getting an unhidden complete clone of Orid Xem. Changing so historical characters don't get culled lead to almost different worlds altogether, like Oddom Thobmunèst Arban Nitig‎'s, while keeping the historical figures culled at least allowed Oddom to form the Scholarly Manors and to continue her path almost identical largely into the 2nd century.



I'm more fascinated in what "culling" implies. From first view, it seems that creatures who didn't reach nobles are simply erased, even if they created creatures who became Law-Givers. But WHEN are they erased? If after they die, it shouldn't change anything. Yet it does. Why? Are their interactions erased too? What the hell is happening and what really is this culling?

I've noticed in the unculled historical figures, some of the culled ones reach Law-Giver. So why were they culled? Why didn't they reach Law-Giver in canon? So many unknowns... I wouldn't be surprised if this was outright unintentional emergent behavior.



Quote
0108-01-01 In 108, Cog died of old age.
Well... I stand corrected... Now who got that slab? XD

Quote
0053-09-15 In 53, late autumn, (15th of Timber) Cog became obsessed with her own mortality and sought to extend her life by any means.

0064-06-08 In 64, late summer, (8th of Galena) Cog began worshipping the dwarf deity Tarem.

Holy mother of Armok, she never got the slab.

Holy mother of Armok, she never got the slab!!!

Spoiler: Image (click to show/hide)

Well, this guy was useless. He was a pretty decent fellow in our timeline. I put the goal in because maybe not wanting to rule the world made him stagnate? But he didn't do anything else in 700 years... he just... shut down...



Ok, what the hell?...

Spoiler: Image (click to show/hide)



I narrowed down the timeline split in Oddom Thobmunèst Arban Nitig's world to the year 58, where a goblin just outright had different named children than the one in the original timeline.

Still, these alternate timelines are great tools to recovered purged creatures from canon.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 09:21:11 am by Lurker Z »
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Bralbaard

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2312 on: September 20, 2022, 03:29:27 pm »

I've noticed that pausing in the middle of worldgen causes things to diverge. Pausing makes sites realize they're unoccupied, among other things.
I don't think I did that, but we have all the time in the world to test theories.


You probably did not do that, but I might have when I  generated the museum world, and it will be hard/impossible to recreate the effect.
I can't even seem to generate the same seed without crashing in df 47.04
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Lurker Z

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2313 on: September 20, 2022, 04:36:58 pm »

Uploaded on DFFD: https://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=16085

How I did it:
* I took a fresh download of DF47.04 (thanks for confirming that was the version you originally used, Bralbaard).
* I took the oldest save uploaded for the Museum, Bralbaard's himself at turn 1 end.
* I copied all raws in the DF47.04 folder and told it to replace all.
* I added the seed in the data/init folder as explained in the DF wiki, so you'll find it as the first "type" of world to be generated.
* The theory was that I didn't have to fumble around with what Bralbaard may or may not have modified when, as far as I know, the game makes a copy of the raws it uses to generate the game in the save file.

Other notes:
* For this bundle, I modified creatures from being hidden. I suspect this is one of the reasons the game drifts earlier in its creation, but if Bralbaard paused generation... well that might explain it too. Creatures are set to culled.
* Modifying creatures to not be culled created the Arban Nitig timeline, which goes off the rails much faster than when I had them culled, as early as the year 58.

Enjoy your infinitely diverse Orid Xem(s)!
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kesperan

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2314 on: September 20, 2022, 05:21:11 pm »

"Moldath IV", Prologue, Turn 91

6th Granite 899 - Northmanor the Unholy Cathedral

Kodor Anvilhearth was a singularly average dwarf who had lived his entire life in Northmanor, the Unholy Cathedral. As a steadfast member of the Cult of Ramparts, he fully believed in the groups central ethos - something that ordinary dwarves of the Walled Dye might find strange, if not abhorrent. Kodor sat quietly in the Black Vault of Despair, the dusty library which formed part of the central tower of the fortress. The blackened bronze bookcases groaned under the weight of tomes both new and ancient. His wandering gaze was focused as the old scholar politely coughed.

Catten Eldersbasesments was a necromancer, an acolyte who had travelled from that well-known site of necromantic knowledge, Ancientlibrary, some years ago. He had come to the cult late in life, but was fully committed nonetheless and his experience of the dark arts had provided some unique insight to the brethren.

"You see, Kodor..." he began. A speech Kodor had heard many times.

"It might shock you to learn that Orid Xem is not the only world in all of creation. Unnumbered planets of every shape and size burst across the cosmos, in each their own dimension." He paused and chuckled. "Almost as if playthings of some great intelligence. You have heard of Armok, have you not?"

Kodor's brown furrowed. Catten was insulting him. Every dwarven child knew of the legend of the first God, the God of Gods, Armok. The Blood God. But few of them actually believed Armok existed. They had their own Gods, and by Tithleth, they knew those were real. You only had to look at the cursed werebeasts, the vampires, or the necromancers themselves. Curses and divine knowledge were the boon of the Gods of Orid Xem. Fickle, capricious, and very real. But Armok? Who could say.

Catten claimed of course that he had evidence. And that is what brought him to Northmanor. He was above all a scholar, a man of science who belived in what he could touch and taste and feel, and with every fibre in his being he believed in the tenet of the Cult of Ramparts.

"Does it not strike you as strange, then, that every civilisation on this planet has a God of Death? We, of course, praise mighty Tithleth, the matron of time, the ender of weakness. We know she formed the bronze slab Shedimostar many hundreds of years ago, and granted her secret to the infamous Oddom Girdergrove. Oddom was a cruel and ambitious dwarf who sought to subjugate others of course, but one cannot say she was anything but successful in recruiting souls to Tithleth's banner...." his line of thought meandered like the trail of smoke from his pipe.
"But other dwarves share a strikingly similar entity in their own pantheon. Have you ever had chance to speak with our guest, King Atir?"

Kodor's brow furrowed harder. This time Catten's story had taken a tangent that he hadn't heard before, and he was slightly unnerved by the manic twinkle in the necromancers cold pale eyes.

Atir Lobsterseals was certainly a curiosity. He claimed to be the King of Morul Kan. But everyone knows they were wiped out seven centuries ago, by a huge dragon. Apparently nobody told him, as he turned up with a trade caravan 17 years ago. No memory of the past, or where he came from. Catten presumed of course that he had travelled here from another plane of existence. One of his mirror worlds. He felt it was the tangible truth that he needed to complete his theory.

Catten droned on, as Kodor's thoughts wandered once more. The dwarves of Morul Kan worship a being known as Midor, a great and powerful god, who while not credited with the gift of secrets to mortal races was the primogenitor of one of only two known angelic vaults. The Doom of Midor, a huge archangel wreathed in flame had been struck down many decades before by a foolhardy and very very lucky adventurer.

"Twelve!" shouted Catten, disrupting the younger dwarf's reverie. "Twelve secrets... that is the missing key."

"The Cult of Ramparts believe in a Death God for which there is not a shred of evidence, or so they think... Dishmab Northmanor the Mute Saffron Soot. His deeds as outlandish as they come. Did you know they believe he was touched twice by an evil cloud of twisting death and yet survived stronger? Did you know he was betrayed, and tossed into the lava lake at the centre of his world, and swam to the surface to enact his revenge? Did you know he walked the surface of hell and slew all he saw? Well of course you do, for why else have we built this place? Northmanor, glory of Dishmab.... Rampart. The Cult. Don't you see? We have proof! This death God is not a facet of the others, like Midor, or Tarem, or Sut the Tomb of Quests or any of the lesser human deities. He was once a mortal dwarf, twisted into death incarnate by fate itself."

Catten was rambling now. He felt that Dishmab was real, as they all did, but the necromancer clearly thought Dishmab could actually manifest in this reality.

"The twelve secrets. That is the key. Each secret born from a slab, and each slab a breath of the power of creation from a God of Orid Xem. That is what is needed to bring Dishmab to us. This is why we build this tower." the scholar concluded.

"He calls himself Moldath Mournsaints, and from what I have learned of him, he is not from this world." he continued, after a long pause. "And he is the vessel into which Dishmab will be poured. I have studied this strange dwarf for many years. Painstaking research, following his journeys, his travels to the castle they call Boltspumpkin..."

Kodor shifted uncomfortably in his seat. This was all new territory and he was very much regretting volunteering to help the old man.

"Moldath himself manifested into existence on Orid Xem. In a cave, far to the south. His arms chained with steel. Mournsaints the Fire Ruler of Rewards, in his own utterance. He had with him a small creature, a bat, which he called Dishmab. Moldath believed that he was not, in fact a dwarf, but an amulet. An amulet! And what is an amulet if not a magical focus?!"

The old man was clearly insane. How could a dwarf be an amulet? What did any of this mean? And more importantly, what did it have to do with Kodor Anvilhearth?

"And do you know what I have learned about this Moldath? He yearns for the secrets. That is the key. Twelve secrets, twelve fragments of the key. When the key is complete, will it not unlock the amulet? Will it not open the way for our own God of Death to be born anew? And do you know how many of the secrets he has found? Eleven."

A chill trickled down Kodor's spine. Surely this was all nonsense, wasn't it? The scholar had a look of complete seriousness, his face granite. "Which do you think is the final secret he needs, young Kodor?"

"Shedimostar" Kodor found himself murmering.

"Now you see what you must do. The tower is complete. We have fashioned it for the liking of Moldath Mournsaints, with golden crafts, and rooms for his treasures and trinkets. He must be lured here. And we must complete the prophecy. We must find the Twelth Secret. Dark forces rail against us. They tell of another, seeking the secrets. A devil twisted in the shape of a scorpion. He must not succeed. He must not unite the secrets before Moldath, or all is ruin."

"Why have you summoned me here, scholar?" the recruit finally spoke, his mouth strangely dry.

"Because we know where Moldath is. And we have discovered why he is there, more importantly. He cannot leave. He is bound by something stronger than magic - an oath, to a dwarf long dead, by the name of Kikrost. He is their broker, their manager. And everytime he tries to leave he is brought back by his oath. You, young dwarf, are tasked with breaking the oath. Return Moldath Mournsaints to Northmanor and you will have played your part. As we speak, our agents scour the earth looking for Shedimostar. It was lost, long before you were born. They search old Heroicgem, long in ruin, and they travel the breadth of the Plain Hill. This is not your task."

The necromancer planted his hand firmly on Kodor's shoulder. "Go now. To the place they call Clearmasters. And release the Blind Sadist from his oath."
« Last Edit: August 15, 2023, 02:11:13 pm by kesperan »
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Lurker Z

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2315 on: September 20, 2022, 05:41:04 pm »

6th Granite 899 - Northmanor the Unholy Cathedral

The necromancer planted his hand firmly on Kodor's shoulder. "Go now. To the place they call Clearmasters. And release the Blind Sadist from his oath."
Wow, how my spur-of-the-moment incomplete build that accidentally attracted an immortal eldritch abomination from across time and space has become a crucial place in Orid Xem's destiny by sheer circumstances.

Kikrost must be shouting profanities from the heavens. He invented taint-free immortality, gave it freely to everyone, his immortal meat-shields... I mean subjects all deserted him and then he got killed, even if he would have lived forever otherwise. Then he's witnessing these mad-balls doing mad pseudo-science and blaming him for that weird curse that keeps calling back Moldath to Clearmasters. What a time to be (un)dead.

I love how our actions on the world intersect in the weirdest of ways. I can't wait to read the rest of it.
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AvolitionBrit

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2316 on: September 20, 2022, 06:13:41 pm »

Moldath's ardent followers are certainly getting there. The twelve secret, i don't even know if Moldath got it. Im curious if he has become the one necromancer to rule them all.
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kesperan

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2317 on: September 20, 2022, 06:21:19 pm »

Thanks for the kind words of encouragement :)

I have about 45 images saved, and a long-assed story to write. I haven't found the secret, but that wasn't my main focus for this turn, so I don't know why Moldath has been deleted from LV.
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Quantum Drop

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2318 on: September 20, 2022, 06:36:46 pm »

Save is up: https://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=16086

There's a new human-controlled fortress on the map by the name of Abyssdeeps and no new museum submission. I would like to request another turn; good luck to whoever's on next.
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I am ambushed by humans, and for a change, they do not drop dead immediately. I bash the master with my ladle, and he is propelled away. While in mid-air, he dies of old age.

kesperan

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2319 on: September 20, 2022, 07:27:40 pm »

Well, looks like Moldath was King of the Walled Dye for three weeks. How annoying. :|

Looking through LV now... more ghouls! Yay!

Good luck on your turn Maloy.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2022, 06:28:39 am by kesperan »
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Bralbaard

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2320 on: September 21, 2022, 01:32:24 pm »

Should have the save up tomorrow evening; apologies for running overtime on this turn. In the meantime, Orid Xem has apparently decided it's time for another change:



Yeah, I think that might have been Moldath. The roc feather didn't fare too well in my turn. The age change only seems to pop up in Fort mode for some reason.


I have occasionaly seen the game recognize an age-changing event right away, but most of the time it does not. If it fails to do so it seems to check for the correct age each time the year changes. Most of the time that will be in fortress mode.

I've finally updated the map. The Mountain of Hatred, Onionbunions, Abyssdeeps, and Urnways have been added to the map. 
Maloy has downloaded the save.
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Maloy

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2321 on: September 22, 2022, 08:00:59 am »

I report the good news that my character bears no bugs.

He started still wearing all his gear with no weird behaviors
I love all the adventures Mirailei got up to while I was inbetween turns although I can't seem to open up the save on legends viewer. If someone can could you drop that info for later?

THUS far all the lands I'm in are incredibly peaceful and you guys have done a thorough job genociding anything that might cause trouble in the world lol

Lurker Z

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2322 on: September 22, 2022, 08:11:03 am »

If you've never worked Legends Viewer before, it's not as easy as using the save the game gives you. You need:
* A copy of the save with no active fortress of adventurer. PLEASE use a copy of the save and not the save you're running, otherwise you might get issues.
* In that copy, go to Legends Mode.
* There are two ways to do this:
** Way 1:
*** If you don't have the LNP bundle, you might want to get it.
*** In the DFhack console, type
Code: [Select]
exportlegends info** Way 2:
*** In Legends mode, press the letter
Code: [Select]
x*** Note that I haven't tried this, I only used DFhack console, so I'm not sure what you'll get
* In the Dwarf Fortress folder, you'll find a folder named something like "legends-Museum III - Turn 86-00890-01-16"
* Now open Legends Viewer
* Click the first "..." icon
* Browse to the folder that is named like "legends-Museum III - Turn 86-00890-01-16"
* Select any of the two XML files you find there (as far as I know, Legends Viewer is smart enough to take the files it needs from the folder)
* Wait for Legends Viewer to load the save (this may take at least a minute or more, depending on your computer)
* Enjoy browsing.
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AvolitionBrit

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2323 on: September 22, 2022, 08:12:21 am »

There was a bug a while ago with legends viewer with claiming Vaults so make sure your using 1.20.08 of legends viewer as well. The musuem save wont work on older versions of the legends viewer.

Glad to hear no bugs on your character
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Quantum Drop

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Re: Museum III, adventure succession game
« Reply #2324 on: September 22, 2022, 08:14:43 am »

Good to hear there’s no bugs with your character, Maloy. I will advise that you use the dfhack method of getting a legends viewer file, though, as the standard legends mode xml tends to be missing a fair bit of detail when loaded into LV.
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I am ambushed by humans, and for a change, they do not drop dead immediately. I bash the master with my ladle, and he is propelled away. While in mid-air, he dies of old age.
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