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Author Topic: Lots of candy {Spoiler}  (Read 3913 times)

tristankamp

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Lots of candy {Spoiler}
« on: May 09, 2020, 09:12:59 am »

I found this map yesterday. Its a 1:1000 find i think. Standard world paremeters, no funky raws or anything.
1. Candy at 87, stretching down all the way. most of them solid to 33.
2. Limonite in dolomite, combined with very high magma allows really awesome steel production.
3. Tetrahedite and native silver i think.
4. 99% flat 5x5 embark in a single biome. (only a slight hole in top left corner)
5. Heavy forest.
6. AT LEAST 6 veins of candy, might very well be more.
7. >4000 minable candy without triggering clowns.
8. >8000 minable candy if clowns are killed ( easy if you know the trick)
9. Only a light 1 layer aquifer.

I hope people will want this, i surely would. i have another world with Magnetite, but ive only encountered this ammount of adamantine twice in my life.
I have an unmbarked file of the map, and an image to show where to embark if people want it.
One last note; all veins so far are solid through the sea, so they can be fully mined ( sea not blocking digging down through them)
This is the adamantine at level 87:
https://imgur.com/C84332F
This is how flat the 5x5 is:
https://imgur.com/BOeZbxL
this is the magma sea at 80:
https://imgur.com/weM04IB
this is where to embark
https://imgur.com/MN2MS6h

I dont know how to share the map, but as said, i have an unembarked file. If you guys want it, just tell me how to send it to you.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2020, 03:22:05 pm by tristankamp »
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TheyreAllGullyDorfs

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2020, 09:38:27 am »

You have a lot of spoilers that might pollute curious young minds and spoil what would otherwise be one of the most shocking gut watering moments of the game I.E. The circus coming to town if you eat too much candy.
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anewaname

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2020, 10:30:30 am »

You could post the save at http://dffd.bay12games.com/ and put the link to the save in this post. The "pregenerated worlds" section seems right for this.
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Sarmatian123

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2020, 12:20:59 pm »

These days all I fetch from deep is precious magma. Coin trade trick fixes any metal, I judge to have too little.
The exchange ratio for metal is not fair. It could be sometimes 1.5:1 and is sometimes 1:0.33. I think it should be 1:1 always. Even adamantine. 1:1 would mean no cheating with metal in DF any more. No 1.5:1 ratio or 5000:1 like with 1 coin. I do not understand why metal has to be suffering some loss in processing. It is metal. There are processes to purify metals.
Still what hits me is, what to do with the constantly growing metal bar stockpile?
When I get few items of master quality, then suddenly there is no point in adding any ornaments to them.
I have stockpile of tetrahydrite and no need to smelt it or use it for any thing.
I was thinking, how about doing some really nice things for sale to merchant caravan, but there is no point. The coin mechanics is at fault. There is no Dwarven bank, which would keep balance. There is no vault to store precious gold, silver and adamantine bars. There are no wages to be payed. There is no... economy. Economy has to be part of world generation and, because it is such a problematic thing to implement, it will not be implemented for a long long long time.
Some people do some additional weapons and armor for adventuring though.
It could be fun to send own merchant caravan to other sites with own made goods, but what the point.
So, my quantum stockpile of various metal bars just growing with each merchant caravan visit.
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Fleeting Frames

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2020, 02:07:33 pm »

@Sarmatian123: I guess you could mod in bank as custom workshop? Add in reactions to convert 100 of thing to thing token (say, a tool item with no use) and back, and thus reduce the clutter while still having the resources as needed.

Doesn't really get around the problem of "what do I do with all this tetra", though. Lag/clutter is one thing, but lack of use is another; at best you could use an adventurer to transport it in nested minecarts to your next embark location to kickstart metal industry after you retire the current fortress. You could make giant billion statue of your fortress symbol, I guess.

(PS: In an existing game, you'd need to use dfhack to add in new things. Here's an example with display cases for 43→44 transition. Warmist also did dfhack-based custom smelting reaction that does have 1:1 results in all cases.)

Sarmatian123

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2020, 02:27:10 am »

@Sarmatian123: I guess you could mod in bank as custom workshop? Add in reactions to convert 100 of thing to thing token (say, a tool item with no use) and back, and thus reduce the clutter while still having the resources as needed.

I have clutter with logs (7761), stones (19321), blocks (948/26759), ammunition (17319) and plants (14379) and out of those the 3 first generate lag, when browsing the values in z-stockpile menu. Bars I have so far mere 5511 of which 3781 are metal bars. So problem with clutter is not so huge actually. Each caravan adds only 100 bars yearly to stockpile more or less. So this is a problem I let be for now.

Though your solution combined with "bank" process in smelter making "gold bars [25]" out of 25 gold bars passed my thought. I could add such a process into smelter in vanilla save by sacrificing slot of some "dumb" process. Though can you imagine Dwarf dragging "copper bars [645]"? The weight lol. Also, I am not sure, if crafting process will not consume whole fussed stack.

Currently I am making claystone mechanisms and diorite tables amass to remove some stones. Everything non-master gets atom smashed and the rest ends with caravan. I am puzzled how to solve lag from 26759 blocks already placed in construction. Should I forbid them? Hide them? Actually I can not for some reason even turn f:forbid on 19964 granite blocks from z-menu.

It seems, everywhere, there are involved stacks of items instead of single items, the lag impact on game is lesser.

Shouldn't connected with each other x constructed same material type blocks to be considered just 1 single item of that block [ "x" ] ? Map rewrite will be soon. I hope Toady will fix this lag from constructed blocks then.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2020, 02:30:44 am by Sarmatian123 »
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delphonso

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2020, 07:36:57 am »

You have a lot of spoilers that might pollute curious young minds and spoil what would otherwise be one of the most shocking gut watering moments of the game I.E. The circus coming to town if you eat too much candy.

Right. The candy/circus thing isn't just for fun, it's self censoring to leave a nice surprise for new players or those who don't dig too deep. I played for two years before finding adamantine myself. I wasn't on forums/in chatrooms though.

A bit humorous to put the spoiler in the title, tristankamp.

Fleeting Frames

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2020, 09:23:27 am »

@Sarmatian123: Tested in few ways with dfhack, and it will consume whole stack yeah. Some things (such as making adamantine wafers, or decorating with ash) will respect material larger-than-normal sizes,  but most things that don't naturally occur in stacks don't. Hence the suggestion of using tokens.

Though at the point of 7,7k logs, I'd bring out the ballista to erase trees without additional logs and then pave the embark. Not like you need more wood at that point.

You can "temporarily" (until deconstruction) remove the blocks in constructions with cleanconstr dfhack command, but I think you don't use it.

Sarmatian123

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2020, 02:25:21 pm »

@Sarmatian123: Tested in few ways with dfhack, and it will consume whole stack yeah. Some things (such as making adamantine wafers, or decorating with ash) will respect material larger-than-normal sizes,  but most things that don't naturally occur in stacks don't. Hence the suggestion of using tokens.

Though at the point of 7,7k logs, I'd bring out the ballista to erase trees without additional logs and then pave the embark. Not like you need more wood at that point.

You can "temporarily" (until deconstruction) remove the blocks in constructions with cleanconstr dfhack command, but I think you don't use it.

Thanks for info!
So there need to be 2 processes for metal bars. Also, as Dwarves can pick a fussed stack, the token makes more sense indeed. Coins could be tokens. Only one issue, when steel coin [12500] will be slowly dragged by a sticky-finger Dwarf to his room... :D

I kind of fixed surface now, so the only logs incoming from caves. Cave trees grow in such precarious places... Just 1x1 tile in a form of a ledge in side of a deep deep hole is enough for tree to spring with all downward slopes in mid-air and cave spider webs. So annoying. If construction wasn't so heavily consuming blocks already, I would try to just wall those caves in and out. However now I just wall entrances (leaving just cave traps 1x1x10 corridors leading into the map) and basically dig everything and smooth everything... and it looks like a job for next 100 years of game play. A small cave entrance is 19 levels high and I see some holes going down for 50 levels already. Cave system in mountains is just porous holes on side of another porous holes, which are growing from each other and then having some platforms between them and it goes down on and on. Dangerous to dig, specially that all my Dwarves live on surface now. They will sometimes stand on top whatever they dig or deconstruct. Deadly to them, annoying to me. Plus 2 forgotten lurking somewhere in deep. I have 60 professional military to take care of  Fun!. Too few for clowns, but enough for forgotten and other randoms.
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tristankamp

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2020, 04:37:18 am »

should i delete the tread? im sorry i spoiled it. I just wanted to share an awesome map, but it seems you guys are content with your own :)
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Superdorf

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2020, 06:03:37 am »

Nah. Is a nice embark!  :D

Could alter the title to "Lots of candy {spoiler}" or some such, if you like. Nice and ambiguous.
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ltprifti

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2020, 05:19:40 pm »


These days all I fetch from deep is precious magma. Coin trade trick fixes any metal, I judge to have too little.
The exchange ratio for metal is not fair. It could be sometimes 1.5:1 and is sometimes 1:0.33. I think it should be 1:1 always. Even adamantine. 1:1 would mean no cheating with metal in DF any more. No 1.5:1 ratio or 5000:1 like with 1 coin. I do not understand why metal has to be suffering some loss in processing. It is metal. There are processes to purify metals.
Still what hits me is, what to do with the constantly growing metal bar stockpile?
When I get few items of master quality, then suddenly there is no point in adding any ornaments to them.
I have stockpile of tetrahydrite and no need to smelt it or use it for any thing.
I was thinking, how about doing some really nice things for sale to merchant caravan, but there is no point. The coin mechanics is at fault. There is no Dwarven bank, which would keep balance. There is no vault to store precious gold, silver and adamantine bars. There are no wages to be payed. There is no... economy. Economy has to be part of world generation and, because it is such a problematic thing to implement, it will not be implemented for a long long long time.
Some people do some additional weapons and armor for adventuring though.
It could be fun to send own merchant caravan to other sites with own made goods, but what the point.
So, my quantum stockpile of various metal bars just growing with each merchant caravan visit.

You don't make vaults for your best shit?
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xzaxza

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2020, 07:15:30 pm »

should i delete the tread? im sorry i spoiled it. I just wanted to share an awesome map, but it seems you guys are content with your own :)
did you upload it yet?
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Sarmatian123

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Re: Lots of candy / adamantine
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2020, 08:42:02 am »

should i delete the tread? im sorry i spoiled it. I just wanted to share an awesome map, but it seems you guys are content with your own :)
did you upload it yet?
You wanted to play his map? I think he forgot to upload his save to file depot.
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tristankamp

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Re: Lots of candy {Spoiler}
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2020, 12:22:39 pm »

i thought i corrupted the file; but i was wrong. im uploading it right now :D

Also, the mineable Adamantine is 4000, not 2000. 
I will tell the depth possible for the different pillars if you want to hear.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2020, 02:40:02 pm by tristankamp »
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