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Author Topic: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids  (Read 2167 times)

Secretdorf

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2021, 02:38:05 am »

I’m not sure a messenger would be a great investigator
Then a messenger-withagoodbrain probably. I mean it's not that difficult he just has to ask around for a clue.
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Fluffe9911

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2021, 03:07:10 am »

Hey if we are lucky maybe our messenger dual enrolled in the same class as our spymaster (do we even have a spymaster?) joking aside we should probably keep things simple for now for the poor guy. There is still a decent chance he may not make it back even with all our caution and asking him to stop to talk with generally disgruntled peasants greatly increases the chance we see his head on a pike soon assuming we even see him again.
Edit: So yeah -1 to the send him to investigate suggestion
« Last Edit: July 20, 2021, 04:00:28 am by Fluffe9911 »
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King Zultan

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #17 on: July 20, 2021, 03:54:19 am »

Do the intervention
+1 but also in the meantime send a second diplomat on horseback to try to make it to the Sennar Sultanate alive preferably taking the safest route possible even if it takes longer should anything go wrong on his trip he is to turn around and report back with what happened rather then try to force his way threw.
+1
+1. We aren't sending our whole army so we can at least expect that Darfur will take some time to prepare for an attack. Then we can ask kanembornu to help us if that happens. Also ask the new man sent to sennar to first investigate about the matter in local populace as casually as possible.
+1
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MaxTheFox

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #18 on: July 20, 2021, 06:37:29 am »

Hey if we are lucky maybe our messenger dual enrolled in the same class as our spymaster (do we even have a spymaster?) joking aside we should probably keep things simple for now for the poor guy. There is still a decent chance he may not make it back even with all our caution and asking him to stop to talk with generally disgruntled peasants greatly increases the chance we see his head on a pike soon assuming we even see him again.
Edit: So yeah -1 to the send him to investigate suggestion
No spymaster yet. I should have put that as an issue. I'll wait a bit on updating since discussion is going on still.
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MaxTheFox

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #19 on: July 20, 2021, 07:39:08 am »

Mini-update on the military, you know, things that should be known even without a precise headcount. I literally couldn't find precise population statistics for the Sultanate so I'll use the population count from Victoria 2 (GFM mod), which was presumably based on some census made after colonization (it was colonized by France IRL), and then say some percentage of said population (downscaled since this is an earlier age than Vicky) are potential levies. Best I can probably get, same result as just spending 2 hours looking for said census. According to Vicky, in 1836 it had 71.4K population. Eyeballing it (pretty sure it had low population growth over those 200 years), I'll say in 1635 it had ~50-60K population. Now let's assume that 5 or 6% would be levies in a non-emergency situation. This is an era before the administrative capacity for accurate censuses so keep that in mind.

reserch

A quick calculation, comprising of a headcount of the small standing army and a ballpark estimation of the amount of peasants that could be drafted into levies without causing a famine is done as the Sultan's advisors discuss the possibility of intervention with him and with each other. This could be inaccurate.
Spoiler: The Army (click to show/hide)

You can keep discussing.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2021, 07:44:53 am by MaxTheFox »
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Secretdorf

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #20 on: July 20, 2021, 10:56:34 am »

Hey if we are lucky maybe our messenger dual enrolled in the same class as our spymaster (do we even have a spymaster?) joking aside we should probably keep things simple for now for the poor guy. There is still a decent chance he may not make it back even with all our caution and asking him to stop to talk with generally disgruntled peasants greatly increases the chance we see his head on a pike soon assuming we even see him again.
Edit: So yeah -1 to the send him to investigate suggestion
So what if he goes to some public place(something like bar) and pretend to be a trader from Arabia and starts discussion about our sultanate and asks the people about the Sennar kingdom's relation with them. If the king did anything bad to the previous guy, we can ask him more boldly about the situation (or if it wasn't his fault, then make friendship with him).

Also, I propose we should send horsemen(maybe 200-300 but maybe change some with desert nomads as we can't risk our own defense) since they'll be less prone to hit-and-run tactics and have more fighting experience than those rebels. In case, they win they should bring some of the european firearms of the rebels.
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Fluffe9911

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #21 on: July 20, 2021, 02:45:21 pm »

Look if we are going to do that I would like it to be a different guy. I just really dont want to sidetrack Rasul the 2nd from contacting the other kingdom and using a different guy increases the odds for both parties making it back alive since it halfs the amount of potentially risky shite they gotta do.
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KittyTac

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #22 on: July 21, 2021, 01:22:06 am »

PTW.
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Secretdorf

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #23 on: July 21, 2021, 10:57:58 am »

Look if we are going to do that I would like it to be a different guy. I just really dont want to sidetrack Rasul the 2nd from contacting the other kingdom and using a different guy increases the odds for both parties making it back alive since it halfs the amount of potentially risky shite they gotta do.
Yes, this sounds more reasonable to me, I probably misunderstood you earlier so +1 to this.

Also, we should get a spymaster(choose someone we can trust for this job like someone from our family or someone from our adventuring life) as it will solve most of our issues or make it easier to solve them(you know information is half the war).
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Fluffe9911

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #24 on: July 21, 2021, 03:52:44 pm »

+1 to getting a trustworthy spymaster
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King Zultan

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2021, 01:57:11 am »

Also +1 to spymaster.
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The Lawyer opens a briefcase. It's full of lemons, the justice fruit only lawyers may touch.
Make sure not to step on any errant blood stains before we find our LIFE EXTINGUSHER.
but anyway, if you'll excuse me, I need to commit sebbaku.
Quote from: Leodanny
Can I have the sword when you’re done?

TheSteppeWolf

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2021, 08:23:48 am »

Look if we are going to do that I would like it to be a different guy. I just really dont want to sidetrack Rasul the 2nd from contacting the other kingdom and using a different guy increases the odds for both parties making it back alive since it halfs the amount of potentially risky shite they gotta do.
Yes, this sounds more reasonable to me, I probably misunderstood you earlier so +1 to this.

Also, we should get a spymaster(choose someone we can trust for this job like someone from our family or someone from our adventuring life) as it will solve most of our issues or make it easier to solve them(you know information is half the war).
+1.

Also, send a spy to the Kono rebels, to, gauge their forces before sending an army, pretty sure it should be faster than a full blown army and we will have warning. See if the firearm rumors are true too. See if we can procure firearms in some way too (Ottoman Empire to the north, is at its height, surely they could trade).
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Naturegirl1999

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2021, 11:54:05 am »

Look if we are going to do that I would like it to be a different guy. I just really dont want to sidetrack Rasul the 2nd from contacting the other kingdom and using a different guy increases the odds for both parties making it back alive since it halfs the amount of potentially risky shite they gotta do.
Yes, this sounds more reasonable to me, I probably misunderstood you earlier so +1 to this.

Also, we should get a spymaster(choose someone we can trust for this job like someone from our family or someone from our adventuring life) as it will solve most of our issues or make it easier to solve them(you know information is half the war).
+1.

Also, send a spy to the Kono rebels, to, gauge their forces before sending an army, pretty sure it should be faster than a full blown army and we will have warning. See if the firearm rumors are true too. See if we can procure firearms in some way too (Ottoman Empire to the north, is at its height, surely they could trade).
I’m not sure we have a spy yet
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MaxTheFox

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #28 on: July 26, 2021, 01:15:11 am »

Updating today, sorry had a depressive episode.
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MaxTheFox

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Re: [SG] Heirs of the Abbasids
« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2021, 09:08:20 am »

After the news of the diplomat's sudden disappearance, a second diplomat is sent to Sennar. He returns without a hitch and informs both rulers of each other and establishes relations. In addition, a companion is sent to investigate the first diplomat's sudden disappearance.
After asking in a local tavern, it turns out that the diplomat, Abdul, was mugged and killed by some bandits in the streets of the capital of Sennar-- which is also named Sennar-- at night. Such is the reality of travel into far-away lands in our times.
The sultan contemplates sending an infiltrator into the Kono Kingdom but there are no formally-trained spies. Information gathered would be unreliable, and thus harmful to any hostile actions taken. A small detachment of a hundred horsemen and one-hundred-and-a-half desert nomads is sent right into the frontlines of the Kanem-Kono War. After the battle, a scout tells the sultan of the battle.

((I don't really have a deterministic combat system but I will use d20 rolls to determine advantage for each attacker, adjusted for technology, organization, experience, etc.))
The small, agile army finally finds the tribal rebels just as they were marching through the semideserts of the underdeveloped Kanem hinterland towards a small town. The rebel army is unaware but due to the flat terrain notices the Sultan's army from far away (-2 to roll for rebels). The rebels are disorganized, but so are the horsemen as the assigned commander is inexperienced (no effect on roll). Some of the rebels have firearms, but most are equipped with spears and crude swords. In addition the rebels are inexperienced with using the firearms. (+1 to roll for rebels). The experience of the elite horsemen (professional) gives them an advantage over the rebels (medium) (+3 to roll for horsemen). The equipment of both is similar enough to not have an effect.


Rebel troops:
   Tribal warriors
      Equipment: iron and copper spears, primitive iron swords, light armor
      Experience: medium

Wadai troops:
   Horsemen
      Equipment: bows, spears, and light armor.
      Experience: professional.
   Desert nomads
      Equipment: bows, swords, and civilian clothes.
      Experience: medium (inter-tribal warfare).


RANGED PHASE
There are around 500 rebels in this particular army vs around 250 horsemen.
Rebel morale: medium vs Horsemen morale: high
The horsemen charge at the rebels, firing arrows and getting ready to joust them with spears and slash them with swords. The rebels shoot.
1d20-2+1 vs 1d20+3 = 17 vs 8
The gunfire, even if little in amount, scares the horses, thus hurting the morale of the horsemen and killing or critically wounding a few of them. The rebels put up their leather shields, deflecting a lot of the arrows, however many fall to the arrow-fire, and a few turn to flee.

MELEE PHASE 1
There are around 450 rebels in this particular army vs around 230 horsemen.
Rebel morale: medium vs Horsemen morale: medium
The horsemen regroup and charge, this time reaching the rebel army.
1d20-2 vs 1d20+3 = 14 vs 18
The melee portion of the battle is brutal. The horses trample many of the Kirdi rebels under their hooves. Their firearms are slow to reload and thus ineffective in this phase (firearm bonus negated). Their shields have difficulty blocking both arrows from above and melee. Despite this, the tribals fight ferociously, striking down many horsemen or knocking them from their steeds.

MELEE PHASE 2
There are around 260 rebels in this particular army vs around 190 horsemen.
Rebel morale: low vs Horsemen morale: medium
The battle continues, with the tribal rebels now a disorganized mass due to low morale (-2 to rebel roll).
1d20-4 vs 1d20+3 = 0 vs 22 (bruh)
The Kirdi warriors panic and flail wildly at the ruthless fighters of the Sultan's army as they die under the hooves, are hacked apart by the sabers, and are impaled by spears. It is a complete bloodbath, with only a few losses from the horsemen, most of the rebels massacred, and the survivors hastily retreating.
The battle ends in a near-total Wadai victory.

There remained around 20 rebels (fled) and around 190 horsemen.

The veterans of the battle brought back captured firearms! While guns are known around these places, they are very expensive and thus not feasible to use on the army scale. Having our wise men attempt to reverse-engineer some of those firearms might help us make them cheaper and not rely on trade. This was a risky battle, however. Our warriors got quite lucky. If the rebels had such luck, they would have won easily. To gain intel, a spymaster, Amjad Al-Noori, is recruited from a local Arab noble family. He is unambitious and thus unlikely to backstab the Abbasid dynasty...
In addition, now that the situation in the Sultanate is more-or-less stable, Abd al-Karim's two wives, Tharwa and Aaisha, ahve arrived into court, having previously resided in a village in west Darfur.
According to reports from Kanem diplomats, the war effort is going strong, especially with our help. Abd Al-Karim looks into some way to find more firearms while local production is not secured. A diplomat is sent to the nearest major Ottoman city, but that is a long trip across the Sahara over hostile tribal land...
Everything seemed fine, but a plot to start a rebellion in the southern provinces of Wadai was discovered by our new spymaster! A nobleman of mixed descent (Arab and Tunjur) had a letter of his "accidentally" opened by a freshly-recruited and, admittedly, slightly paranoid spy. The nobleman, named Talha, was cooperating with the chief of a nearby Ubangi (a people living in the western parts of Azande territory) tribe, to try to get the tribe to help him establish his own Emirate! Talha was immediately arrested but now there are fears of any potential supporters-- who else could be in his web...?


Spoiler: Issues (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: The Army (click to show/hide)
What does Abd al-Karim do?
« Last Edit: July 27, 2021, 09:34:47 am by MaxTheFox »
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Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless. What will you do on the day of reckoning, when disaster comes from afar?
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