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[Ioric Kittencuddler]

Now that I've gotten your attention, do you think it's likely we'll get some way to tell the sex of a character in adventure mode without getting attacked by them now that marriage and childbirth are going to be more prevalent?

Just having a male or female symbol somewhere on the screen you get when you look at a character would work fine.

[Cthulhu]

I've always wanted this, because I'm a solo roleplayer at heart, and it always bugs me when I've imagined a character as a certain sex for a long time, then it suddenly becomes apparent that they're not that.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

If we're (and by "we" I mean Toady and Threetoe) is really going for simulationism in the game then prejudice is a must.  We can have varying prejudices in the different civilizations.  In one, women could be practically slaves, in another the positions would be reversed.  Then my heroic warrior could free the women from the first kingdom and the men from the second, and make a new Utopian nation where people were decent to each other most of the time!

[Impending Doom]

And their oppressors join together into a dystopian society where everyone treats everybody else like crap.  

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

And then once I've made certain to establish that people should not be enslaved and treated like crap based on sex then we can conquer their pitiful society and make them our slaves!

[Reign on your Parade]

I've got to ask, was this EXACT title necessary? Couldn't you have just said "GENDER!"

[Puzzlemaker]

quote:Originally posted by Reign on your Parade:
<STRONG>I've got to ask, was this EXACT title necessary? Couldn't you have just said "GENDER!"</STRONG>

It got my attention.

[penguinofhonor]

Only words have gender. People and animals have sexes.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

quote:Originally posted by Reign on your Parade:
<STRONG>I've got to ask, was this EXACT title necessary? Couldn't you have just said "GENDER!"</STRONG>

It got your attention didn't it?  If you don't like the title you can post in the other thread I made in the suggestion forum because I was worried people would avoid this thread thinking it was a porn spam or something.  

Anyway, neither word would be used in the game.  Just a little icon like they have in dwarf mode.

[Guy]

My professor gave this discussion last week.  According to him, sex is your physical/biological configuration; covering male, female, sexless, and hermaphrodite.  Gender is a cultural construction applied to you; basically how masculine and feminine you are.  This was in my HCI class by the way...

On topic, I don't think even Dwarf Fortress needs that exact detail for sex-specific body parts, though there is the argument for males getting kicked in the crotch.  Plus, Ioric Kittencuddler's suggestions on gender roles are definitely a must.  Imagine starting as an adventuring woman in a highly sexist society.

Also, I'm pretty sure people have brought up the subject of gender specific clothing.  This also can differ between cultures.  I probably brought it up, though it was probably because I wanted women to wear bras so that my female adventurer's lack of bra had some significance.   :roll:

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

I thought there already was gender specific clothing...  Hm.

Then again I seem to remember starting a female wrestler in a hot climate once that only had a loincloth and sandals.  I thought the society was just less prudish about women's clothing at the time, and quite enjoyed the image of my character running around bare chested strangling her foes with her massive... upper body strength.  

Now don't forget, sexism means discriminating based on sex, not discriminating based on being female.

I've mentioned this ambiguous sex thing before though, and the last time I don't think I got a reply from Toady, but someone else said it wasn't really important.  Well I think now, it is.  I'd like to see what Toady has to say about it because getting the acknowledgment of people I admire makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

[Kagus]

Kinda funny that this thread (and yes, the title does grab one's attention.  At least it doesn't grab anything else) popped up not long after I posted a thread about making gender-specific bodyparts in the modding forum.

Couldn't help myself.  I added breast attacks.

*You smite the giant mole in the head with your left breast!
*It is broken!

And no, clothing isn't gender-specific, if the countless male dwarves showing up wearing dresses, skirts and thongs are any indication.

And automatically assuming that sexism is biased against women is just plain old bigotry.  You should be ashamed of yourself.

[Stromko]

Yes, the title did get attention, and wasn't even all that misleading. Well done!

As far as dresses go and skirts go, I figured that it's a cultural distinction. These 'dresses' might be called something else, like robes or vestments or whatever, but due to their specific cut, are, in fact, dresses. Thus, the interface says they're dresses, but they're actually masculine garments! Like kilts!

Actually that's all very silly, it actually would be better if clothes were gender-specific, that way it'd mean something when your buff barbarian dons a pearl-encrusted dress or a skirt with an image sewn into it of a mole striking down a dwarf.

Also, if male dwarves only wore specific kinds of skirts, say, a new piece called a Kilt, then we can put together bands of kilt-wearing berzerkers and that's sweet. Or, someday, we could probably force them to wear masterwork spider-silk summer dresses.

I would think we're a very long way off until entities start =caring= what they or another entity are wearing, however, and until then, it's all a bit pointless, just foundation for the future and hilarity for the player.

"This image is a rendition of one by Duduk Kikud. It shows a dwarf surrounded by dwarves. The dwarf is raising a kilt. The kilt is named Chilledcrab the Rainy Rawness."

[ February 04, 2008: Message edited by: Stromko ]

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

Did anyone else immediately think that the dwarf was wearing the kilt while raising it when first reading this?

[ERoberts]

Maybe I am a sexist pig, but not being able to immeadiately tell the gentder of my dwarves has always bugged me. I have even been known to tag them with a (m) or (f) using the nickname function.