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Author Topic: Republics and Theocracies?  (Read 2863 times)

Bjorn

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Republics and Theocracies?
« on: June 01, 2022, 10:04:27 am »
Hey there guys, I wanted to ask you if some mod ideas I had in my head are possible.

On Republics
I wanted to make a Republican government in DF, with an elected President, elected senators, elected representatives, and Land_holders representing Presidents [Dukes] (who would govern subordinate republics), Governors (who would govern States) and a Judge (who would govern Counties), all of them also elective except for Judge which would be appointed by the President of the union.

Specific questions on Republics:
1) Can LAND_HOLDERS have succession by ELECTED?
2) Can positions have the same name (even if different tags)? (like the civ level President and the subordinate presidents [Dukes])?

On Theocracies
Here I wanted to make it a pretty top down system but that also had some bottom up effect. Basically you'd have a Patriarch that is ELECTED at first (in case there is no valid candidates) but has SUCCESSION by Position pointing to 7 Cardinals (so one would randomly be picked). Here's the kicker, I wanted to make that these cardinals had SUCCESSION by position pointing to a [SITE] level position called Bishop, to see if they might randomly pick a bishop from the site level to inherit the cardinalship. The site level Bishop would be picked by Appointed by position NUNCIO, being something like a legate that picks the bishop and would be equivalent to a permanent expedition leader position that exists soley to appoint the Bishop. The Bishop chooses priests number:as needed. The priests though would have succession by position: Deacon. The deacon would be chosen also by the Bishop number:as needed. I would like it if it was possible to make them all celibates by reason of their positions, but I doubt that is possible.

Specific questions for theocracies:
1) Can I make a Succession:by_position from the civ level pointing to a site level position?
2) Can I make position bearors celibates? (even a hacky solution is perfectly valid if it can be implemented)
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IndigoFenix

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2022, 11:14:04 am »
Most of this is possible, with a few caveats:

It is not possible for a unit in a non-SITE position to be raised to a SITE position, or vice-versa.

NUMBER:AS_NEEDED has some interesting rules to it but pretty much exclusive for military command chains.  When a site constructs an army (for either defense or to invade another site), it first determines how many soldiers will be recruited, and then constructs the army's hierarchy from the bottom-up, assigning as few leaders as it can get away with that are able to handle the amount of soldiers it wants to field.  AS_NEEDED for non-military positions will do nothing.
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Bjorn

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2022, 01:24:47 pm »
Quote from: IndigoFenix on June 01, 2022, 11:14:04 am
Most of this is possible, with a few caveats:

It is not possible for a unit in a non-SITE position to be raised to a SITE position, or vice-versa.

NUMBER:AS_NEEDED has some interesting rules to it but pretty much exclusive for military command chains.  When a site constructs an army (for either defense or to invade another site), it first determines how many soldiers will be recruited, and then constructs the army's hierarchy from the bottom-up, assigning as few leaders as it can get away with that are able to handle the amount of soldiers it wants to field.  AS_NEEDED for non-military positions will do nothing.

Sad that I can't use succession between site and non-site positions :/ But I know how I can circumvent that, per se. I'll make Bishops, Priests and Deacons with number:as_needed also at the Civ level and have them have the same succession structure then I'll make the cardinals have this civ level bishop as succession by position. lol Might get confusing when the patriarch moves to the fortress, but I can roleplay that these are bishops with titular dioceses that are part of the Patriarch's entourage.

My main doubt now is how number:as_needed will interact with succession:by_position.
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Bjorn

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2022, 07:40:03 pm »
For some reason Legends Viewer is now crashing whenever I try to look into human civs (the civs I changed to Republics with Theocratic elements to it). I basically made them Republics with a parallel hierarchy of priests that are just part of the civ. So both descriptions I used in the OP are for the same civ. Does anyone here have any idea what I'm doing wrong?

Here's the civ:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Bjorn

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2022, 09:53:41 pm »
After hours of debugging I found the error. It was something stupid (as these sorts of things usually are). I put two colons instead of one at the secretary of defense ([NAME::secretary of defense])

EDIT: Didn't solve the problem. But I at least know the problem is specifically somewhere in the Secretary of Defense. Oh well.

EDIT2: Now I think I found out the problem. There was no plural in the NAME tag.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2022, 09:59:21 pm by Bjorn »
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newtyrol

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2022, 11:29:43 pm »
Custom governments seems like a pretty interesting new direction to take for a human faction. Seems like it would be interesting to interact with in fort mode.
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hedgerow

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2022, 12:59:11 am »
You want to make a theocracy?

You're the first person who's ever told me they wanted to make a theocracy.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2022, 05:57:23 am »
Tried a HRE structure once, however i couldnt get the [ELECTED] to cause the Emperor to abdict properly to one of his elector land holders from [POSITION:MONARCH] ruling for life but elsewise everything else went smoothly. Barring a few hardcoded caveats, hybrid governments are possible.

Dark towers are more interesting though because of the two layer nature of it. By tweaking it, you can make a co-independent monarch rule when the "Big Bad" much more competent leader passes way without refreshing the tag, which might lead to differences in performance, like LOTR orcs acting much worse without Sauron to lead them into battle directly.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2022, 05:29:59 pm »
Quote from: hedgerow on August 07, 2022, 12:59:11 am
You want to make a theocracy?

You're the first person who's ever told me they wanted to make a theocracy.

It's semi-common in the video game series Europa Universalis.
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Bjorn

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Re: Republics and Theocracies?
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2022, 08:04:54 pm »
Quote from: hedgerow on August 07, 2022, 12:59:11 am
You want to make a theocracy?

You're the first person who's ever told me they wanted to make a theocracy.

I find it fascinating to have a hybrid civ with different forms of hierarchy structures. In fact I think I'm going to make something of a constitutional monarchy setting next, with a Church Hierarchy, an elected parliament, a prime minister chosen from among the ministers of parliament and a king with nobles. Will be interesting to see how that interacts. Site level I'm not sure of yet though
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