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Author Topic: Figuring out the world-gen parameters  (Read 39177 times)

LumenPlacidum

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Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« on: July 14, 2008, 12:25:51 pm »

Well, I think we should work out what all these parameters are and how they're used.  Of course, maybe everyone else just knows how these things work, in which case you should tell me  :P

There are three types of criteria: History criteria which affect the way history is done after world-gen, Rejection criteria that are used to reject maps that don't conform to them, and Creation criteria which affect the way the map is initially made before rejections happen.  I will color code them as I figure out which is which.

Anyway:
Random Seeds: the specific list of random numbers used, as usual, but this time you can separate seeds for different aspects of world-gen.
End Year: I haven't gotten to an end year.  I assume that if other conditions aren't met, the world-gen will stop at this time.
Population Cap After Civ Creation: Maximum number of civilized creatures in the entire world.  This seems to count megabeasts as well.
Percentage Beasts Dead for Stoppage: Once this percentage of megabeasts are dead, the world-gen stops and you can start playing.  This seems to happen pretty fast.  If you play using mods that make megabeasts more prevalent, you run the risk of them totally wiping out civilization.
Year to Begin Checking Megabeast Percentage: The percentage referred to is the parameter above.  Once this year rolls around it starts checking to see what percentage has died so that the generator can see when to stop world creation due to this factor.
Cull Unimportant Historical Figures: Not sure how this works
Reveal All Historical Events: Allows you to see everything in the Legends screen.
Minimum Elevation: The minimum elevation in some hard scale.  It would seem that only elevations of a low enough altitude are allowed to be ocean tiles.  Someone should try to find out exactly what that altitude is.
Maximum Elevation: The maximum elevation in tiles.  Related to minimum elevation, above.  The higher elevations are used to determine mountains and hills.
Elevation X-Variance:  This parameter controls how much variability there is in elevation across the X-axis.  If the parameter is high, then there will be a great deal of noise in elevation as you move east-west.
Elevation Y-Variance: Same as above, but in the Y-direction.
Minimum Rainfall: Sets the minimum (possible?) rainfall value in the world.  I don't know if it's guaranteed that this value will exist somewhere in the world.  This is used to create biome information.  Areas with high rainfall tend to turn into either forest or marsh, depending on drainage.
Maximum Rainfall: Same as above but the highest (possible?) value.  This is used to create biome information
Rainfall X-Variance: Like elevation variance, this determines how variable the rainfall levels are as you travel East/West.
Rainfall Y-Variance: Similar to above but in the other direction.
Minimum Temperature: Again, the minimum (possible?) temperature that may be reached.  This is used to create biome information.  It's entirely possible that the map generator selects one of its "polar" latitudes and sets it to be the extreme temperature, then sets the other to be the opposite, then proceeds from there.  This needs to be looked into.
Maximum Temperature: The maximum (possible?) such temperature.  This is used to create biome information
Temperature X-Variance: As rainfall variance, but with the variability of temperature regions.
Temperature Y-Variance: As above.
Minimum Drainage: Minimum amount of ground drainage for water.  This is used to create biome information.  Drainage determines how much rainfall the ground can absorb.  Areas with low drainage will tend to form marshlands and lakes.  High drainage will create forests and deserts.
Maximum Drainage: Maximum amount of ground drainage for water.  This is used to create biome information.
Drainage X-Variance: As rainfall variance, but for ground drainage.
Drainage Y-Variance: As rainfall variance, but for ground drainage.
Minimum Volcanism: Seems to be regional information indicating where you can find magma.  This value sets the minimum level of this.
Maximum Volcanism: As above, but the maximum.
Volcanism X-Variance: The variance variables indicate that volcanism is a region used like rainfall, temperature, and drainage.  I don't think this affects biome.
Volcanism Y-Variance: As above.
Minimum Savagery: The minimum level of wildlife activity possible.  This is used to create biome information.
Maximum Savagery: The maximum level of wildlife activity possible.  This is used to create biome information.
Savagery X-Variance: Savagery happens in regions, like other biome information.  This is the typical variance stat.
Savagery Y-Variance: As above.
Elevation Mesh Size: Used to determine the basic paintbrush size of elevations?  It seems that smaller sizes would make for more variability in a smaller amount of space.
  Elevation Weighted Ranges: Allows you to set weight preferences for the varying elevation heights.  If you want most of the land to be low-lying with a few sudden jutting mountains with steep cliff faces, you could set a pretty high weight on the low level elevations, a pretty low weight on very high elevations, and almost no weight at all on the middle elevations.  These meshes and weights are exceptionally powerful tools for the creation of your world.  Note that the numbers do NOT have to add up to any particular amount.  If you have a 0-20 weight of 6 and a 80-100 weight of 2, then you will tend to have three times as many areas of 0-20 elevation than 80-100.
Rain Mesh Size: Just like elevations above, since rainfall is a region, just like elevations.
  Rain Weighted Ranges: Just as above, allows the fine control of what levels of rainfall happen in what percentages.
Drainage Mesh Size: Just like elevations above, since drainage is a region, just like elevations.
  Drainage Weighted Ranges: Just as above, allows the fine control of what levels of drainage happen in what percentages.
Savagery Mesh Size: Just like elevations above, since savagery is a region, just like elevations.
  Savagery Weighted Ranges: Just as above, allows the fine control of what levels of savagery happen in what percentages.
Temperature Mesh Size: Just like elevations above, since temperature is a region, just like elevations.
  Temperature Weighted Ranges: Just as above, allows the fine control of what levels of temperature happen in what percentages.
Volcanism Mesh Size: Just like elevations above, since volcanism is a region, just like elevations.
  Volcanism Weighted Ranges: Just as above, allows the fine control of what levels of volcanism happen in what percentages.
Minimum Mountain Peak Number: Sets the minimum number of named mountain peaks.  This is a rejection criterion, and setting this to be too high is a major cause of map rejects if you have only small mountain regions.
Minimum Edge Oceans: Sets the minimum number of world map edges that have oceans leading off of them.  This is probably used to determine the water level on the map in elevations.
Minimum Volcano Number: Sets the minimum number of named volcanic peaks like mountains above.  Extreme values have no detrimental effect.
Desired Good Square Count in Small/Medium/Large Subregions: Not exactly sure what this is measuring.  Seems that if you have higher numbers, then you'll have more good-aligned regions.  However, it seems like this is probably a good way to always cause the map to be rejected (if there are too few tiles in a region to get this number, for example.  No idea.
Desired Evil Square Count in Small/Medium/Large Subregions: Same as above, but for evil places.
Minimum Initial <TERRAIN TYPE> Square Count: Sets the absolute minimum number of <TERRAIN TYPE> tiles on the map, pre-erosion.  If the number is too few for any one of these, the map will be rejected and things will start over.  This is a fairly powerful tool and is very closely related to the mesh sizes and weights if you use them.  Remember that as you change the meshes, you also have to change these since your ratios will be very different!
Minimum Initial <TERRAIN TYPE> Region Count: Sets the absolute minimum number of <TERRAIN TYPE> regions on the map at the start, pre-erosion.  If the number is too few for any one of these, the map will be rejected and things will start over.  Regions are the contiguous clusters of one terrain type.  If you set this to be large, then aside from generating tons and tons of rejects, you'll get a map that's got a very broken appearance.
Minimum Final <TERRAIN TYPE> Region Count: Sets the absolute minimum number of <TERRAIN TYPE> tiles on the map, post-erosion.  If the number is too few for any one of these, the map will be rejected and things will start over.  The difference between this and the above trait is dependent on what terrain type it is.  Mountains get eaten and fractured by rivers and erosion.  So, you should probably expect to GAIN mountain regions after erosion.  Marshes tend to grow as rivers and lakes cut away at other terrains, so they become more contiguous and reach around other barriers.  You should expect to LOSE marsh regions after erosion.
Erosion Cycle Count: Tells the world-generator how long the world has to erode its tall peaks down to mountainsides.  The higher this number, the less jagged the world will be (I think).  It seems like a very powerful parameter.  If you use the maximum number, your mountains will dissolve before your eyes into plains.
Minimum River Start Locations (Pre-Erosion): Minimum number of river headwaters locations before erosion takes place.  If you want fewer rivers, then lower this number.  It doesn't seem to have any effect on the number of brooks except to make them longer so that they reach a river.  Be careful.  While this is not a rejection criterion, it can very easily make a map uninhabitable.
Minimum River Start Locations (Post-Erosion): Same as above, but sets the minimum for after erosion which may destroy some of the previous ones.  I believe the map actually fills in more rivers if it doesn't meet this number, hence its being a creation criterion.
Periodically Erode Extreme Cliffs: Allows the very tall cliffs to sometimes be eroded.  Not sure how this happens, exactly.
Do Orographic Precipitation and Rain Shadows: Toggle that allows terrain height to affect rainfall.  For example, moist air coming from the ocean blows over the land.  As the terrain gets higher, it forces the moist air up, causing it to rain on the seaward side of a mountain.  Eventually, all the rain has fallen if the mountain is tall enough.  So, when the breeze goes over the top, there's no moisture left to fall on the other side, creating a rain-shadow.  This should create a tendency for more extreme rainfall in regions, creating more forests, deserts, marshlands, and grasslands.
Maximum Number of Subregions: I don't know what the difference is between a region and subregion, so I don't know.  However, if your map is very fractured with terrain types, then this needs to be set very high.
Maximum Natural Cave Size: Maximum size of the caves encountered.  The fact that this says natural cave probably indicates that these are the circular ones found in mountains.  This size is probably their diameter in tiles.  Having larger caves has been suggested to increase the lifespan of megabeasts.
Number of Mountain Caves: Number of the natural caves above.  Having more mountain caves has been suggested to increase the lifespan of megabeasts.
Number of Non-Mountain Caves: Number of the caves delved by creatures around which many quests are based?  Having more non-mountain caves has been suggested to increase the lifespan of megabeasts.
Make Caves Visible:  This toggle allows you to see the caves on the world map without having gotten a mission to go there.
Playable Civilization Required: Probably causes world-gen to fail if no civ is marked as playable.  Interestingly, this does NOT prevent the only playable civs from being killed off.
Minimum Number of <REGION-QUALITY> Squares: Sets the minimum possible number of squares of certain ranges of each of the region qualities, such as elevation, rain, drainage, volcanism, savagery, and temperature.  These need to be changed to reflect your regional meshes and weights.  These are responsible for a HUGE number of map rejections.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2008, 10:14:30 am by LumenPlacidum »
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Decimator

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2008, 01:01:33 pm »

Minimum Volcanism:  Setting this to anything other than zero appears to cause infinite rejects.
Minimum Volcano Number: Setting this to its maximum has no detrimental effect that I could tell.  Volcanoes everywhere!
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 01:29:23 pm by Decimator »
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Dame de la Licorne

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2008, 01:05:04 pm »

This should probably go into the wiki.
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Sheezy

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2008, 01:08:57 pm »

Extremely gay, I cant create my hell world?
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LumenPlacidum

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2008, 01:11:00 pm »

I just successfully created some parameters with a minimum volcanism of 40
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Sheezy

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2008, 01:12:51 pm »

Is there a way to turn off rejects?
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Calenth

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2008, 01:16:11 pm »

looking at the log file, it looks like there's a bad problem with "[blank] not evenly distributed" causing rejects, where [blank] is savagery, rainfall, whatever.
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Decimator

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2008, 01:16:27 pm »

Oh?  I wasn't able to get minimum volcanism working,  I'll have to try it again when I get home.
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Zai

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2008, 01:25:42 pm »

Quote
Minimum Volcanism:  Setting this to anything other than zero appears to cause infinite rejects.

As Lumen said, this is not true. I was able to put it above zero to get a successful world with only 4 rejections. I set it at either 15 or 25.
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Killy

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2008, 01:31:17 pm »

Minimum Volcano Number: For a medium size world i got infinite(100k) rejects for setting this to max(200). but 150 works well(up to 1k rejects but then "Volcanoes everywhere!").Perhaps on a Normal sized World 200 is ok.

Desired Good/Evil Square Count in Small/Medium/Large Subregions: You can set this number fairly high(2000/4000/8000 for a medium world) and get a very evil/good world, but setting this too high causes a reject on init of world history. (Message:
 No controllable entity definitions available.)

Min/Max Temperature: Sets the temperature of you north/south "pole". Again setting this too extreme leads to rejects(message:Not enough entity placement locations). this way you create a pocket world with a scorching south and one freezing tile in the north.

Minimum Savagery:even very low numbers can cause infinite rejects([blank] not evenly distributed), the larger the world the more likely it will not work as you have more diversity in a large world.

I haven't tested the other minimum [blank] options. But i think they work similar.

« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 01:35:15 pm by Killy »
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LumenPlacidum

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2008, 01:37:37 pm »

for distribution of parameter issues, then I think you can just select more appropriate limits at the very end of the parameters.  If you want, you can completely turn off checking for them by 'n'ullifying the parameter
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Zonk

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2008, 01:42:48 pm »

To remove/reduce rejects, Nullify the various "Minimum ..."parameters.

Also, I officially suggest someone created a DF wiki page for discussing world paramaters AND posting pre-made sets of them to play with, so we can have some fan-made parameters for a jungle world, desert world and so on.
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Asheron

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2008, 02:05:15 pm »

I don't have that much problems with the min volcano number. A bit more rejects then normally, but ah well. It's worth it.

I wouldn't tinker to much with max and min temperatures though. I've made different more than just hellish worlds. As in, everyone burns to death.
I even had my seven starting dwarves die out of dehydration after they fell unconcious in their beds! >_>
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 02:07:00 pm by Asheron »
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Decimator

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2008, 02:11:00 pm »

I even had my seven starting dwarves die out of dehydration after they fell unconcious in their beds! >_>

That's not because of the worldgen:
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=20488.0
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 Kogan McHauler: We were able to get a few pieces from some encrusted trinkets. Hopefully, thats al-Oh CRAP we don't have any fuel!
 Urist McMood: That won't be a problem...
 *Starts bending metal with his bare hands*

Jingles

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Re: Figuring out the world-gen parameters
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2008, 02:20:02 pm »

I've tried increasing the amount of caves and it seems to help the monster survival rate slightly (by five or ten years), Im still getting stopped at at around year 80-100 by which point 60% of the little blighters are dead.  On the plus side there are 26 GCS's lurking around the latest world.
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