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Author Topic: Lifevis - A realtime 3D interface for DF - Now with more Speed!  (Read 71281 times)

Neonivek

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #45 on: September 21, 2008, 04:08:22 pm »

I am guessing once this project is done... The tiles will have different colors and textures so that a Mudstone wall won't look like a Microline wall and will not look like a natural mudstone wall and will not look like a smoothed natural mudstone wall and will not look like a smooth microline wall?
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Mithaldu

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #46 on: September 21, 2008, 04:54:08 pm »

That's the idea. :)


Ah, totally missed that, thanks for the explanation. :D
vvvv
« Last Edit: September 21, 2008, 05:06:17 pm by Mithaldu »
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Dadamh

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #47 on: September 21, 2008, 05:02:48 pm »

I agree with the guy with the spathi cypher.
Huh?

It was a reference to the guy above that comment.  "Huffi Muffi Guffi", under his avatar, is a reference to an old videogame.
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Dadamh

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #48 on: September 22, 2008, 04:58:31 pm »

Also, as an aside, I wasn't meaning to denigrate your work by calling it a proof of concept.  It's impressive to say the least; as I haven't seen any other realtime displays anywhere.
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Mithaldu

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #49 on: September 22, 2008, 06:11:26 pm »

Thanks for clarification, i was honestly more assumed, but i can understand where the impression comes from. :)

Today i have something new to show.

As i mentioned on the last page i was working on a toolchain to convert wavefront objects. At first i tried to get the landscape to show up properly and then i wanted to move to texturing. Turned out that things like ramps required a MASSIVE effort of analyzing and a zillion different representation depending on the surroundings.

On the other hand, i couldn't lean back and use convenient, but slow and large libraries that i could point at pre-built model files, since the actual process of converting the model files into 3d data on the gfx card cache is rather slow, but happens a lot while the viewer updates from DF.

So i had to take a middle step to not go insane. I found a slim and free 3d editor (Wings 3D), that could export into a text format (Wavefront Object), which i then ran through a perl script that generates the low level OpenGL instructions.

The first test ramp i inserted went absolutely fine, so i went looking for a bigger pre-built model to insert. In the following video, the engine renders 30000+ polygons at 30 fps without even hitching. Additionally i have proven that i can easily create models in a 3d modelling application and directly inject them into the viewer without any kind of performance loss.

And now the video. :D

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v16023678hb23TCjA
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Tamren

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #50 on: September 23, 2008, 01:09:06 am »

Heh, why the ice cube?
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Mithaldu

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #51 on: September 26, 2008, 11:45:30 am »

It was literally the smallest model that was still complex, that i could find. Everything else stomped in with 50000 polys and such.

In other news, work progresses nicely.

The modelling system is now completely functional and nicely working as well as comes with some provisions that will allow for later optimizations or tweaking of models, while still keeping manual changes to models squarely in the 3d editor and not in the text editor. Also, to make things a tad easier, the generator now automatically rotates the models as many times as needed, so one only has to model 1 basic ramp to the north to also cover the east, west and south.
I'm not sure if Sinoth will be able to port this to C++, as i'm using some syntax sugar of perl here, but it sure as hell makes development move a lot faster for me.

The above things enabled me to tackle something that's been a problem in 3Dwarf for a while: Ramps. Due to the incredible complexity of ramps, there are at LEAST 256 possible physical representations of them, and that's only taking into account the situation on the same 2D layer.
Thanks to the modelling system and the auto-rotation, i only needed to create 16 ramp models to cover 90% of all possible situations and 100% of the 256 above. Additionally i found a neat way to use bitmask comparisons to select the correct ramp out of the available ones, instead of crafting a huge, unmaintainable if tree. Lastly, after playing around with it for a day, i found a way of encoding the surroundings of each type of ramp in its name without creating massive textual monsters.
I'm fairly sure you'll see this in 3Dwarf down the line.
[Detail 1] [Detail 2]


Lastly, i finished the texturing system today, which works quite fast, despite using multiple smaller textures instead of one large texture with offsets. The way i'm doing this uses a really simple human-readable mapping of a spreadsheet via constants which allows me to simply write down the texture name i want next to a tile, paste it into my IDE and it'll use that. Adding textures also becomes as easy as adding 3 lines that mention the name of the texture.
[Water] [Detail] [The Hand]


This is, if it even is, of limited use to 3Dwarf, however it makes it possible for me to move on towards extracting and playing with memory data to see if i can get the textures to be more detailed. This means veins, varied ground tiles, glass, etc.

Next up is also display of creatures and then experiments to see how much i can do with the designation/occupancy flags posted earlier by Toady.


At this point i also need to thank some people: The goons over in SHSC were extremely helpful and made it possible for me to figure things out with which i'd been stuck on this for quite some time.


And for anyone who wants to play around with it, download is here:
http://dwarvis.googlecode.com/
« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 05:33:24 am by Mithaldu »
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Fleeb

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #52 on: September 26, 2008, 12:07:19 pm »

This is awesome. Keep up the good work.
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Janus

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #53 on: September 26, 2008, 01:06:17 pm »

Wow, that is indeed awesome.
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Mithaldu

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #54 on: September 26, 2008, 05:00:43 pm »

Thanks to poking from the goons i bring another present today:

I've added remote control capability. (shift +) cursor keys get sent on to DF, k and space as well. I'll add more once i've slept.

Download is here: http://dwarvis.googlecode.com/svn/latest_downloads/lifevis.rar
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Tamren

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #55 on: September 27, 2008, 03:33:18 pm »

Due to the incredible complexity of ramps, there are at LEAST 256 possible physical representations of them, and that's only taking into account the situation on the same 2D layer.

I think were going to need a few more  ;D




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Mithaldu

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #56 on: September 27, 2008, 05:19:00 pm »

3 things:

1. That's 3Dwarf, Sinoth is programming that. I'm programming lifevis and experimenting in it to find stuff Sinoth can use. So far he hasn't incorporated *anything* in it from lifevis.

2. Can you upload a save (including the WHOLE df directory please) of that somewhere so i can see how it holds up in lifevis?

3. I just updated lifevis:
It has now complete remote control capability for DF in that it pipes *ANY* keyboard input directly to DF. There's also a lifevis.cfg file in the prog sub-directory now.

Download: http://dwarvis.googlecode.com/
« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 05:33:41 am by Mithaldu »
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Narushima

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #57 on: September 27, 2008, 06:35:02 pm »

Great work you're doing there, man. Keep it up !

Tamren

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #58 on: September 27, 2008, 07:07:43 pm »

Its going to be interesting how the visualizers will handle complex multi-level slopes. Right now you can make a perfect pyramid, but rotate that pyramid a couple degrees and you will lose the perfectly flat faces. Its a limitation of the system because everything is based on cube shaped spaces.

For my startship the outer hull looks like that even with the ramps simply because the terrain follows a curve and slope that the ramps simply can't handle with thier 45 degree shape. It makes sense for crafted terrain to be boxy, but natural terrain like hills would be much more rounded. The problem with that of course is that the polygon count would go through the roof and rabbit punch your pc.

Anyhow I can upload the saves for both of those games, the game is older from version 40c. 3dwarf was part of the directory so I left it in there. Problem is this package is 100 megs. I heard that we had a file upload server for DF stuff but 100 megs would be far too much for that. Any suggestions?
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Spoggerific

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Re: 3Dwarf beautification project
« Reply #59 on: September 27, 2008, 07:09:23 pm »

Perhaps you could only upload the region folder, and not your Dwarf Fortress folder. That would certainly chop off a decent amount of data... unless the region alone is 100 MB.

If so, I recommend shrinking it via .zip or .rar. Then you can go to somewhere like http://www.rapidshare.com and upload it there.
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