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Author Topic: Siege 2.0  (Read 3584 times)

Osmosis Jones

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Siege 2.0
« on: August 14, 2008, 08:24:56 am »

Basically, a revision to the current sieges/megabeast/snatcher system, with a focus on modabillity.


Some of this is probably already planned for the army arc, but I just wanted to lay out an idea for the game mechanics.

Rather than the current system of sieges etc being pretty much a yes/no option, this would allow players to dictate when, where, how many and of what attacked your fort via the creation of specific event files in the raws.

Each event would be listed as a new raw entry, like a creature, and would be comprised of three parts; triggers, behaviour and fluff.

Triggers would be things like [WEALTH:#:#:#] (wealth lies between some value), [SEASONAL:#:#] (number of seasons between visits), [ETHICS:Y/N:#] (ethics clashes can trigger) and so on and so forth, with the final hash in each tag dictating whether it's an optional or required trigger (kill a hundred of some race AND their one king, kill a hundred of some race OR their one king).

Behaviours would deal with what race can trigger it, how many people will come if you do trigger it, whether they charge in or sneak, etc. Thus, players could make the event result in a single kobold thief, or a thousand angry dragons spewing FPS-death. Incidentally, these would not generally spawn a character etc out of nowhere, rather it would command an existing entity to leave their current locale and move toward the fortress, meaning events may occasionally occur sometime after they were triggered.

Fluff is basically what appears on the screen when the creature/s arrive or are discovered. The player can write text ranging from "For [civ name]!" to "You slaughtered my home, my race, my blood and kin. I will not rest 'til you lie bleeding and broken before me, so help me [character's god's] you will..." yada yada. Basically, it let's you create as much or as little atmosphere for the events as you wish. Incidentally, the []'s indicate tags that would tell the game to draw relevant information from the history folder etc.

While it would be a bit of a hassle to create too many of these things, it would be easy to trade them on the forum, allowing players to build up a library of the best events.

Here are some situations I thought of while typing this;
  • An elven champion, seeking to end your tree slaughtering ways, will arrive and call out your mayor/count/king (whoever is highest ranked) for a challenge. He will wait a short while for you to send out said dorf, before coming in after him.
  • A human prince (and his trusty page Jenkins) comes to slay you all for your repeated slaughter of his merchants, and brooking no argument charges straight through your front gate, slaying every dwarf he can find.
  • A pair of goblin brothers comes seeking revenge for their father, who was killed by a guard that recently migrated to your fort. After sneaking to the dwarf's quarters, they lay in ambush for their quarry's eventual return.
  • Envious of your fort's skyrocketing wealth and power, a noble back at the mountainhomes engages an assassin to slay your mayor. Arriving at your fort dressed as a peasant, he requests a meeting with your mayor, then stabs him in the face.

What say you?


TL:DR? Basically, modular scripting for sieges and other invader events that could be easily constructed and traded among forum goers.
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Granite26

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2008, 09:30:57 am »

nifty ideas, but it has nothing to do with sieges...

Osmosis Jones

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2008, 10:25:15 am »

nifty ideas, but it has nothing to do with sieges...


Uhhh...  ???

The idea concerns the entire sieging aspect, from what triggers them to how they behave...
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Granite26

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2008, 10:55:36 am »

I'm not trying to be nit-picky, these are good ideas for events, they just seem like a new catagory of events rather than a civ sending an army to invade you.

Dae

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2008, 02:15:51 pm »

Well, I understood it as a way to give more details to sieges and to mod in specific types of sieges/attacks.

Because, currently, when goblins siege you, it's more or less "Hey, guys, it's been almost 8 months since we've last been butchered at Fortressdiamond. I guess we should go back."
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Ascii Kid

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2008, 02:33:19 pm »

Would you see this as an extension or a filter to what's been mapped out already?  That is, say Angry Goblin tribe A sends an army overland, would that army be limited initally by these options, or would the attacks themselves, essentially drawing out seiges into limited raids from a standing army?
Does that make sense?
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Footkerchief

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2008, 03:18:36 pm »

Those would all be cool to see during gameplay, but I don't think you'll ever see them implemented as scripted events.  What Toady's working toward is having those kinds of events arise in an emergent (buzzword, I know) fashion from the player's interaction with the game world.
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Dae

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2008, 04:38:00 am »

Yeah, the son of the goblin macelord you killed last siege won't probably give a speech (or he could, as when your adventurer talks to a powerful enemy) but he'd be there, leading the attack. It isn't needed for the game to explain it.
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Granite26

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2008, 08:34:28 am »

Well, there's already a casus belli, why not have them announce it? 

Rephrase:  There's already plans to include a reason for the attacks despite right now the fact is that goblin sieges happen automagickally.  When entities attack you for a reason, it would be nice for it to announce that reason.  (The Goblins of BurnedToast have grown tired of your continued existence / want your stuff / need to expand / wish to enslave your populace / think that wig looks silly on you.  They have sent troops to enforce their displeasure/wraith with force!)

Osmosis Jones

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2008, 09:33:24 am »

The whole fluff segment is pretty much optional. You can have them announce their reasons or no. Basically, I came up with this idea as an alternative/addition to the current megabeast system for single adventurer style characters (hence all the examples being one or two character stories), it's just that as I was writing it, I figured it would extend well to covering sieges etc. As such, I figured it would be a bit nicer to have something more than just "Humie McHumie is here to kill you!"

Incidentally, I see this as complementing Toady's goal of procedurally generated sieges. The individual events will still arise procedurally as part of the game world, this just allows the player to set at what point the thing tips into an actual aggressive reaction, as well as what said reaction actually entails.
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Granite26

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Re: Siege 2.0
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2008, 10:36:22 am »

OK, well back it up a step then.

What we get now are:

  • Megabeasts
  • Traders
  • Migrants
  • Ambushes
  • Thiefs
  • Snatchers
  • Sieges
  • Animal Spawns



Animal Spawns should be staying about the same.

Traders, Sieges and Migrants should be moving the diplomacy/war sections, as should ambushes as we see them now.  (Should = based on my understanding of what the plan is)



Snatchers should continue to come from Snatcher Civs, and form a cassus belli.

Thieves, (at least Kobolds) the same.



This leaves us with Megabeasts.  What if we took out 'Megabeasts' and added events.  Possible events would include Megabeasts (drawn from existing, active, maurading megabeasts), Raids (made up of extant or generated groups of raiders), Monster swarms (from chasms or rivers or just a bunch of zombies enter from the south), Elite Thieves (pretty much 'civ'-less, and possibly from world gen.)  Bandits (again, there's some stuff in the bloats about bandit groups.), Challengers (I'm thinking uber-elites from other civs)

Your idea to add events as raws would then be extremely useful.  Raids, Bandits, Monster Swarms could all use the siege code to spawn attackers.  You'd be able to define a group of monsters as a wave, along with the message it used, and a rarity.  (That way you wouldn't get 1 zombie or 200 wyverns)  Also where they come from. (Requires a river or magma or something)