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Author Topic: I like anime, do you like anime?  (Read 2065126 times)

Cruxador

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32040 on: August 04, 2019, 03:31:01 am »

English does not have an honorific for use with older siblings, like it does between "Dad" and "Father", where the latter has more implied honorific, and less "familial only" implication.

We dont go "Older sister, will you help me?"  We go "Hey sis, will you help me?" or worse (From a japanese perspective) we use a first name, "Hey [name of sister], will you help me?"

As such, the use of onee-sama is lost to English speakers. Likewise would be "imouto".  The closest we have is "onee-san", "sister".

Regardless, "sissy" is not the right word to use. That would be more appropriate a replacement for imouto, not onee-sama, nor onee-san.  "sis" would be OK for onee-san, but not for onee-sama. English lacks an appropriate term. We would instead use the first name when addressing such persons.
Right, so the appropriate sub would be to use the character's name, since that makes sense in the English context. Since it can't be translated, let those who want the absolute most faithful version and would understand the untranslated version simply follow along by using their ears. The honorifics can rarely be conveyed, so just let it be aside from where it's reasonably possible to do otherwise.


Quote
But my own translation WTF came from seeing the translation subtitles for Kiki's delivery service.  Early in the movie, just after she moves into the bakery, she tells her cat Jiji that unless they want to eat pancakes all the time they need to get work. Jiji mentions that he likes pancakes-- and this is where the translation gets odd;  The actual dialog spoken says something to the effect of "Not everyday, everyday, everyday!" while the translated text says "I'll get fat, fat, fat!" (and the dialog was changed in the english dub to reflect the translation)

That happened several years ago, but it stuck with me.  How do they get "fat" (debu) out of "everyday" (mainichi) ?? The world may never know.
They were intentionally localizing rather than merely translating. Which can be fine for some audiences. It makes sense in a dub, but less so in a sub in my opinion; it's making assumptions of the preferences of your viewers and someone who goes for sub is more likely to want a faithful rendition.
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Reelya

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32041 on: August 04, 2019, 04:10:56 am »

I'll just mention my favorite mis-translation again. A car racing OVA from the late 1980s, a wealthy girl called Josephine Polniac. The subbers decide her name must be Josephine Polly Nyack, of the illustrious Nyack family.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2019, 04:15:19 am by Reelya »
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Tack

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32042 on: August 04, 2019, 01:50:44 pm »

I’m personally a proponent of partial translation. Just leave it as onee-sama. We have google.
If that’s not feasible, “honoured sister” or “dear sister” works. I particularly like ‘my dear sister’ because it fits with the stalker vibe.

But yeah. Sissy is just terrible.
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Cruxador

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32043 on: August 04, 2019, 03:36:10 pm »

I’m personally a proponent of partial translation. Just leave it as onee-sama. We have google.
We also have ears. Unless you're deaf or regularly watch without sound for whatever reason (in which case you're missing out, sound direction is one area where anime is worlds ahead of anything in the west on an even remotely comparable budget) there's no need for anything untranslated to be in subs.
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But yeah. Sissy is just terrible.
On this, I believe, we are all agreed.
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Karnewarrior

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32044 on: August 04, 2019, 04:22:27 pm »

I’m personally a proponent of partial translation. Just leave it as onee-sama. We have google.
If that’s not feasible, “honoured sister” or “dear sister” works. I particularly like ‘my dear sister’ because it fits with the stalker vibe.

But yeah. Sissy is just terrible.
I like "Honoured Sister" as well, especially since it keeps the pompousness of the -Sama. Exaggerated a bit, but perfect translations are rare.

Onee-san I think I would translate as just "sister", elder optional. Onee or Nee would be "sis".
Sissy is right out.
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NRDL

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32045 on: August 05, 2019, 01:45:48 am »

I'm really enjoying the Kengan Asura anime so far. The CGI honestly doesn't bother me, the fight scenes so far have been very visually dynamic and engaging, the voice acting is pretty damn good. Loving the manga as much as I do, I'm hoping that the series continues till the end without dropping in quality.

Also, of COURSE Kiryu Setsuna's voiced by the same voice actor as Hisoka from HunterxHunter. It's the same fucking character motivation, now that I think about it.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32046 on: August 05, 2019, 02:12:15 am »

I'm really enjoying the Kengan Asura anime so far. The CGI honestly doesn't bother me, the fight scenes so far have been very visually dynamic and engaging, the voice acting is pretty damn good. Loving the manga as much as I do, I'm hoping that the series continues till the end without dropping in quality.

Also, of COURSE Kiryu Setsuna's voiced by the same voice actor as Hisoka from HunterxHunter. It's the same fucking character motivation, now that I think about it.

I actually just finished the 12 episodes on Netflix and wanted to gush about it. Basically, it's Baki! It's just Baki. The art style is like if Keisuke Itagaki did 3D models. The main character is even very similar to Baki, one of the first people he fights is a Russian Kickboxer (in Baki, it was a Mongolian Boxer, so very similar), then the next guy advertises his "vice-like grip" (though he's nothing like Hanayama otherwise), and the similarities only rack up from there. I'm not complaining, I love this shit, pour it on my face Kengan Ashura; because the Baki manga is updating too slowly for my taste.

I'm hoping that the show updates soon, ending right in the middle of the first round of the tournament arc (another old shonen trope that I love) just makes me crave more. The plot is going at breakneck speed, but there seems to be a lot more story, and many more character to add to what promises to be a very impressively large roster of fighters, so I'm really looking forward to seeing how it develops, and if it develops its own personality or if it is content living in the shadow of Baki as a very good imitator.
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scriver

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32047 on: August 05, 2019, 05:25:02 am »

I’m personally a proponent of partial translation. Just leave it as onee-sama. We have google.
If that’s not feasible, “honoured sister” or “dear sister” works. I particularly like ‘my dear sister’ because it fits with the stalker vibe.

But yeah. Sissy is just terrible.
I like "Honoured Sister" as well, especially since it keeps the pompousness of the -Sama. Exaggerated a bit, but perfect translations are rare.

Onee-san I think I would translate as just "sister", elder optional. Onee or Nee would be "sis".
Sissy is right out.

What about Most Beloved Sister?
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NRDL

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32048 on: August 05, 2019, 05:36:32 am »

I'm really looking forward to seeing how it develops, and if it develops its own personality or if it is content living in the shadow of Baki as a very good imitator.

As somebody who's finished the manga, it's better than Baki. The only thing Baki's got going for it is the father-son relationship with Baki and Yujiro, a greater sense of wackiness and more epic scale in the strength of its martial artists.

Kengan Asura is so much more well EXECUTED in terms of a martial arts world. And it absolutely
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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JoshuaFH

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32049 on: August 05, 2019, 01:20:14 pm »

That's what I'm concerned about, that it's not as wacky as Baki. Baki just has an enormous number of very memorable moments stemming from how weird its unafraid to be; whereas with KA I'm afraid that its so concerned with bustling from fight to fight to fight that nothing ever gets a chance to stand out in the viewers' mind as being special or extraordinary. It runs the risk of being "Yeah that was a pretty good battle anime I guess." and I'll maybe forget everything but the most important bits; whereas with Baki there's scenes that are easy to remember and remain in my memory just because of how off-the-wall and unexpected and fun they are, and this extends even to relatively unimportant scenes.

Of course, I'm not casting judgment on KA just yet, I need to know how the rest of the story pans out first!
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Tack

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32050 on: August 05, 2019, 03:12:58 pm »

There's no need for anything untranslated to be in subs.
... ?
I don't speak Japanese well enough.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 03:19:16 pm by Tack »
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Il Palazzo

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32051 on: August 05, 2019, 06:07:26 pm »

There's no need for anything untranslated to be in subs.
... ?
I don't speak Japanese well enough.
Your poor comprehension of the spoken language is an obstacle in reading fully translated subs?
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Tack

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32052 on: August 05, 2019, 08:30:54 pm »

What does that have to do with being able to hear? Now i’m even more confused
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32053 on: August 05, 2019, 08:58:03 pm »

I am also confused as to why one would need untranslated subs in undubbed content. Maybe we are confused about whether we are talking dubs/subs?
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Cruxador

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32054 on: August 05, 2019, 10:27:47 pm »

There's no need for anything untranslated to be in subs.
... ?
I don't speak Japanese well enough.
Your poor comprehension of the spoken language is an obstacle in reading fully translated subs?
I reckon he means that he doesn't comprehend it well enough to pick out the phrases he in principle does know (in this case onee-sama) without it written in the sub. Which actually seems like a legitimate argument, although it in turn begs the question of how many people are in that relatively small window of language comprehension where they know a term in romaji but miss it (consistently, in the case of something that would be frequently repeated like onee-sama) in speech. I still think that's a small enough portion of the audience, given how intelligible TV-accent Japanese is (I could potentially lean the other direction on, say, Danish) but it's a reasonable position.

Either that or he forgot the context somewhere along the way in that exchange, or we were somehow not on the same page to begin with. So in that case:
What does that have to do with being able to hear? Now i’m even more confused
If you can hear the original (not dubbed) audio, then you can hear the dialog in its untranslated form. This makes the untranslated text in subs redundant, and therefore, for many/most viewers, pointless. Il Palazzo is requesting clarification (possibly sarcastically, it's not always easy to tell in text) about how [lack of] ability to comprehend spoken dialog in the original language relates to your ability to enjoy a sub that does not include romaji transliteration of the dialog. More broadly, it can be interpreted as questioning what this has to do with the topic at hand in general (that is, allowing you to clarify that in fact your statement pertained to something else that had been said, or to characterize the point to which you were responding differently), which is implicit in the fact that he restated the point he perceived you to be responding to.

Spoiler: completely unrelated (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 10:35:51 pm by Cruxador »
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