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Author Topic: I like anime, do you like anime?  (Read 2065185 times)

Reelya

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32055 on: August 06, 2019, 04:01:14 am »

I am also confused as to why one would need untranslated subs in undubbed content. Maybe we are confused about whether we are talking dubs/subs?

It means why write "Dunamisdeos-san" in the subs when you could write "Mr Dunamisdeos".

However, the counter-argument is that honorifics are culturally specific, and translating culturally specific things into what are only very loose approximations always messes things up. Like, you wouldn't translate "ninja" to "spy", even though technically, ninja is untranslated. We could just write "futon" as "mattress" too, and "samurai" as "warrior" or "swordsman". So, as you can see, dictating that everything must be translated to the nearest equivalent is equally fucking stupid.

So, the point has to be that we leave things untranslated when the non-translated version is more accurate and commonly known, for a very subjective line of what "commonly known" is. For example, onigiri become "rice balls" (or "jelly donuts" if you prefer) because the name onigiri is less commonly known in the English speaking world, but sushi doesn't become "fish rolls" because the name sushi is already commonly known. So, for our "full translation dammit!" demand we get upset if they don't translate onigiri to "rice balls" but equally we would get upset if they do translate sushi to "fish rolls". So, no, there is no actual set of rules we can apply here, it's always subjective.

Honorifics are therefore middle-ground, because they're culturally specific, and that's where those works are set, and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to pick them up.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 04:30:22 am by Reelya »
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scriver

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32056 on: August 06, 2019, 04:28:49 am »

I think in Swedish "Mr." is mostly translated as "Mr." and not it's actual equivalent ("Herr"), but we also don't use titles any more so it's not exactly the same situation.

Otherwise I am 100% in favour of everything having to be translated. The sillier the outcome the better.
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Reelya

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32057 on: August 06, 2019, 04:32:05 am »

I think in Swedish "Mr." is mostly translated as "Mr." and not it's actual equivalent ("Herr"), but we also don't use titles any more so it's not exactly the same situation.

Otherwise I am 100% in favour of everything having to be translated. The sillier the outcome the better.

san, sama work differently. San can mean miss, mr or mrs depend on context. The main justification for preserving honorifics is to convey culturally-specific information about the setting, and the fact that the system doesn't really overlay well into English, hence the stupid "sissy" thing from the last page.

Onee-sama means "honored older sister"
« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 04:34:05 am by Reelya »
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Arx

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32058 on: August 06, 2019, 05:09:44 am »

Ah, but with the additional cultural input that in Japan it's still common to refer to an older female friend as "sister", which is no longer the case in the West :P

Clearly, there's no way to accurately translate anything. As a result, I move that nothing ever be translated, and all anime fans be mandated to learn both the Japanese language and culture. This is obviously the only reasonable solution.
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Flying Dice

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32059 on: August 06, 2019, 05:53:11 am »

Yep, if you translate honorifics you'll end up with a lot of situations where bad subs think people are related when they aren't. Pretty much the only one that works is the lightly-thuggish usage of 'aniki' -> 'bro' since there's actual equivalency there.

Chinese is far worse since there are so many contexts where non-blood relations are referred to as uncle/aunt/grandma/grandpa/sister/brother.
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scriver

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32060 on: August 06, 2019, 06:29:57 am »

Related, I just had the idea of for a great animu: tantzerfaust, in which old lady-anthropomorphized-tanks battle evil mecha, then have tea parties
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Karnewarrior

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32061 on: August 06, 2019, 12:50:47 pm »

Related, I just had the idea of for a great animu: tantzerfaust, in which old lady-anthropomorphized-tanks battle evil mecha, then have tea parties
I'll do you one better: Puella Magi Beavis & Butthead Magica.
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Frumple

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32062 on: August 06, 2019, 05:48:46 pm »

I am also confused as to why one would need untranslated subs in undubbed content. Maybe we are confused about whether we are talking dubs/subs?
that's actually kinda' helpful for learning a language, tbh

Having both the spoken word and their written form going at the same time can be pretty nice when you're starting to pick things up, et al.

But you're kinda' just talking normal captions at that point instead of sub/dub stuff, heh.
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Cruxador

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32063 on: August 06, 2019, 08:24:15 pm »

So, the point has to be that we leave things untranslated when the non-translated version is more accurate and commonly known, for a very subjective line of what "commonly known" is. For example, onigiri become "rice balls" (or "jelly donuts" if you prefer) because the name onigiri is less commonly known in the English speaking world, but sushi doesn't become "fish rolls" because the name sushi is already commonly known. So, for our "full translation dammit!" demand we get upset if they don't translate onigiri to "rice balls" but equally we would get upset if they do translate sushi to "fish rolls". So, no, there is no actual set of rules we can apply here, it's always subjective.
You're talking about loan words here, though. The English for ninja is ninja and the English for sushi is sushi. This is beyond people recognizing the word, which would be more like say, recognizing amigo from Spanish - even if it's recognized, it would only actually be used in abnormal situations, but translating it would still be right.

Also, Japanese sushi doesn't usually take the form of a roll, although it definitely exists in Japan its dominance is specific to western sushi.
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Iduno

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32064 on: August 07, 2019, 09:52:38 am »

I'm watching Read or Die, and got to the part in episode 19 where we learn Junior was named that by Joker. Which is a real missed opportunity. Name him Pip. It's more British, it's a literary reference, and
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Reelya

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32065 on: August 07, 2019, 07:10:31 pm »

Ugh, this stuff is just getting weird. I went to the main Horriblesubs website and got redirected to an interpol warning about blocked domains because of CP. Thanks Australia. I went there to see which TV cartoons are airing, then the implication is I'm a pedo for looking at that site!

Considering that 100% of HorribleSubs content is just streams from CrunchyRoll and Funimation this is clearly BS, and it's likely that someone in the industry decided it was more effective to claim HS is a pedo site as a way to get it blocked rather than prove they've infringing copyright.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2019, 07:13:43 pm by Reelya »
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George_Chickens

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32066 on: August 08, 2019, 02:56:10 am »

Ugh, this stuff is just getting weird. I went to the main Horriblesubs website and got redirected to an interpol warning about blocked domains because of CP. Thanks Australia. I went there to see which TV cartoons are airing, then the implication is I'm a pedo for looking at that site!

Considering that 100% of HorribleSubs content is just streams from CrunchyRoll and Funimation this is clearly BS, and it's likely that someone in the industry decided it was more effective to claim HS is a pedo site as a way to get it blocked rather than prove they've infringing copyright.
You're with Optus or Telstra, right? They've gone into a big moral panic about, uh, basically anything. Liveleak is blocked, several archiving sites are blocked, multiple forums and other communities too. For me it's just blocked as a piracy site
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Reelya

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32067 on: August 08, 2019, 07:15:32 am »

I'm using Vodafone actually. Really thinking of just paying for a VPN now, because too many sites don't work anymore. The ironic thing is that nyaa.si and horriblesubs are now blocked, along with a ton of anime streaming sites such as kissanime, yet thepiratebay.org and katcr.co are totally unblocked on this service. There's no rhyme or reason to any of this. Why are the two major pirates sites still up while niche anime sites are blocked?
« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 07:18:45 am by Reelya »
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Frumple

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32068 on: August 08, 2019, 07:21:47 am »

Whoever's doing the decision making is a raging xenophobe, I guess? Foreign culture = devil, rampant copyright infringement = meh.
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Tack

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Re: I like anime, do you like anime?
« Reply #32069 on: August 08, 2019, 07:58:29 am »

I know iinet doesn't block half as much stuff. But yeah, the major ISP's in Australia are nannying hard.
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