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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items  (Read 2090721 times)

DeKaFu

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5880 on: October 21, 2009, 03:03:53 pm »

I searched but I'm not sure whether this has been asked before. :/
Will it be possible to make a race where different castes have access to/use different equipment?

Basically I'm envisioning modding in a (non-playable) race to the game based on were-creatures. Since transformation isn't in, I could set up the creatures such that one cast is essentially human and the other are humanoid werebeasts, but they're considered the same species. For it to really work, though, I'd want the human-form caste to use weapons and armor and the animal-form caste to not use armor or weapons and attack by clawing/biting when you encounter them as enemies.

I still don't really fully understand castes. Will any of that be possible for this coming release?
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Quatch

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5881 on: October 21, 2009, 03:07:03 pm »

Whats a dwarf need a formation for? you've got two modes here: shoot from behind a rock wall with no actual melee access, or charge like a madman.

Formations might be useful with rifles, or the side benefits of shields (shieldwall), spears (squares), etc.
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SAVE THE PHILOSOPHER!
>>KillerClowns: It's faster to write "!!science!!" than any of the synonyms: "mad science", "dwarven science", or "crimes against the laws of god and man".
>>Orius: I plan my forts with some degree of paranoia.  It's kept me somewhat safe.

ArkDelgato

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5882 on: October 21, 2009, 03:12:44 pm »

Whats a dwarf need a formation for? you've got two modes here: shoot from behind a rock wall with no actual melee access, or charge like a madman.

Formations might be useful with rifles, or the side benefits of shields (shieldwall), spears (squares), etc.
Assuming traps get nerfed, there are repercussions to magma cannons and goblins get stronger, you could build a mixed group with a hammmer in from, two swords on his flank, three spears to defend the swords, two archers to slow the distant enemy defence, and a mace for the hell of it.
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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5883 on: October 21, 2009, 03:15:49 pm »

I searched but I'm not sure whether this has been asked before. :/
Will it be possible to make a race where different castes have access to/use different equipment?

Basically I'm envisioning modding in a (non-playable) race to the game based on were-creatures. Since transformation isn't in, I could set up the creatures such that one cast is essentially human and the other are humanoid werebeasts, but they're considered the same species. For it to really work, though, I'd want the human-form caste to use weapons and armor and the animal-form caste to not use armor or weapons and attack by clawing/biting when you encounter them as enemies.

I still don't really fully understand castes. Will any of that be possible for this coming release?

Yeah, assuming the EQUIPS tag is still around, you can just leave it out of the general creature definition, and then add it to only the human caste.  Or you could remove the werebeasts' GRASP body tags to prevent them from holding weapons.

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Quatch

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5884 on: October 21, 2009, 03:16:14 pm »

There doesn't seem to be any layout advantage beyond keeping ranged in back, which you can do with separate squads. Does it matter that your speardudes are to the left or right of your sworddudes? Making a melee box with ranged in the center, or a guard-liason with box formation would be awesome, and possibly the point here, but again, small benefit for lots of work?

Formations sounds more like army arc to me.
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SAVE THE PHILOSOPHER!
>>KillerClowns: It's faster to write "!!science!!" than any of the synonyms: "mad science", "dwarven science", or "crimes against the laws of god and man".
>>Orius: I plan my forts with some degree of paranoia.  It's kept me somewhat safe.

sweitx

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5885 on: October 21, 2009, 03:32:53 pm »

There doesn't seem to be any layout advantage beyond keeping ranged in back, which you can do with separate squads. Does it matter that your speardudes are to the left or right of your sworddudes? Making a melee box with ranged in the center, or a guard-liason with box formation would be awesome, and possibly the point here, but again, small benefit for lots of work?

Formations sounds more like army arc to me.

I think it's more of a user control issue.  In general you want all units within a formation to move at the same pace (namely, match the slowest unit).  So you might want to have a crossbowdwarf squad that is formed up such that they're either behind or surrounded by sworddwarf in the same squad, and another squad of melee dwarf acting as quick response unit.
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The toad is having a nice relaxing swim.
The goblin mounted on his back, however, is drowning.

dragon0421

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5886 on: October 21, 2009, 06:28:21 pm »

I'm seeing a lot of green in those feature lists :)

Perhaps it is taboo to ask this, but is the next patch coming out in the near future? I'm holding off on playing DF until the next version is released because certain 40d limitations are bugging me too much, and they'll be fixed in this next version.
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Eduren

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5887 on: October 21, 2009, 06:32:27 pm »

We really need a standard response for these kinds of things. :P

Toady has said multiple times that he will release by the end of the year, even if it means cutting features.
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I don't know.  Duke wants me to stop playing mafia.
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Toady One

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5888 on: October 21, 2009, 06:41:53 pm »

Ha ha, I've actually had to correct multiple times that I didn't say anything absolute about releasing by the end of the year.  It's a goal, but one that doesn't seem particularly easy to reach, even if I cut what I can cut.
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Eduren

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5889 on: October 21, 2009, 06:47:38 pm »

Oh, sorry then.

No pressure. Release it when you are ready.
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I don't know.  Duke wants me to stop playing mafia.
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kiffer.geo

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5890 on: October 21, 2009, 08:01:12 pm »

edit. Well that got cleared up quick...
 
« Last Edit: October 21, 2009, 08:12:20 pm by kiffer.geo »
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Toady One

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5891 on: October 21, 2009, 08:08:33 pm »

He he he, I'm assuming you're referring to the little conversation I deleted before it managed to be reported.
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kiffer.geo

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5892 on: October 21, 2009, 08:15:43 pm »

I was indeed.

Toady, hammers made of light but strong metals will now not be very effective right? Do the decorative spikes count for damage from a weapon?
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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5893 on: October 21, 2009, 08:28:38 pm »

Toady, hammers made of light but strong metals will now not be very effective right?

Yes:

Quote from: Toady One
In terms of adamantine weapons, the edge and shear properties mean it will be able to slice through steel for example quite easily, even though the low density means that it won't be effective in bludeoning weapons.

Do the decorative spikes count for damage from a weapon?

Not yet (I don't have a quote for that, but it sounds like item improvements have been left alone as much as possible for this release).  He's historically been positive about the idea though.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2009, 08:31:33 pm by Footkerchief »
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G-Flex

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #5894 on: October 21, 2009, 08:43:16 pm »

Keep in mind that heavier doesn't always mean better for bludgeoning items. Yeah, heavier weapons (including sharp or pointy ones) do more damage to a person with a given swing speed, but there's a reason why most swords and even hammers used in wars are historically a lot lighter than you think. You actually need to be able to handle the thing, and in addition to that, if a hammer (or sword, or axe) is too heavy, you won't be able to swing it very fast, or very well at all for that matter. So an aluminum hammer isn't necessarily the best idea, but neither is a lead one.
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