Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 9 ... 14

Author Topic: Change temperature to Celsius  (Read 32705 times)

Kilo24

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #90 on: March 19, 2009, 12:37:32 pm »

It just converts them once per new object when reading in the information from the raws.  I doubt that it would be significant, compared to pathfinding or fluid dynamics.
Logged

Mel_Vixen

  • Bay Watcher
  • Hobby: accidently thread derailment
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #91 on: March 19, 2009, 12:47:11 pm »

It would be nanoseconds on the loading/worldgen screen.
Logged
[sarcasm] You know what? I love grammar Nazis! They give me that warm and fuzzy feeling. I am so ashamed of my bad english and that my first language is German. [/sarcasm]

Proud to be a Furry.

LegoLord

  • Bay Watcher
  • Can you see it now?
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #92 on: March 19, 2009, 03:36:26 pm »

I say we just let Toady decide to use whatever scale he wishes in the game.  Other then familiarity, there is no advantage in using one system over another.  Although I like the ideal of a temperature scale called Urist.

0 Urist - the temperature at which the mixture of 4 dwarven alcohol in equal amount freezes.
100 Urist - the temperature at which the same mixture above boils.

Dwarves will like any temperature between 0~100, said dwarves will have alcohol.
>:(
You did read the thread, right?  You're not the first person to have said this.  We are past using one scale.  We have established that the internal system could use the same scale it uses now, with the raws accepting multiple scales and translating them, and everyone would be happy.  As it stands, you don't actually see the specific temperatures while playing the game, and that's not likely to change.

@ Pilsu: 
Yeah, reading multiple formats from the raws would totally be the dog's knees.  I am in favor.

Only issue there is that it turns a "read an int from this tag" into "read a string from this tag and convert".  NBD.
Well, that only happens when opening DF.  The data/objects folder (which holds the creature data the game uses) would have the internal values.  Basically, it's the same as any old tag, just taking it up a level.
It wouldn't be doing that every second of playing the game, in other words.
Logged
"Oh look there is a dragon my clothes might burn let me take them off and only wear steel plate."
And this is how tinned food was invented.
Alternately: The Brick Testament. It's a really fun look at what the bible would look like if interpreted literally. With Legos.
Just so I remember

ToonyMan

  • Bay Watcher
  • having a bad vibration
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #93 on: March 19, 2009, 03:52:04 pm »

I would strongly recommend the ToonyMan Scale.



0 degres = like a popsicle dead
1 degree = alive
2 degree = crispy crunch dead



Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Logged

KrunkSplein

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #94 on: March 19, 2009, 04:48:43 pm »

I would just like to state, for the record, how absolutely absurd it is for there to be a 7-page discussion on what method of reporting temperature would be the best.  You're talking about a minor presentation issue, the 'solutions' of which require breaking save compatibility.

For Armok's sake, not everyone has temperature enabled, let alone cares enough about it to warrant the change!
Logged

Silverionmox

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #95 on: March 19, 2009, 04:52:32 pm »

It does matter for intensive modding, though. I'd deplore being necessitated to convert all temperatures to °F after researching and thinking with them in °C.
Logged
Dwarf Fortress cured my savescumming.

LegoLord

  • Bay Watcher
  • Can you see it now?
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #96 on: March 19, 2009, 04:53:44 pm »

You're talking about a minor presentation issue, the 'solutions' of which require breaking save compatibility.
The method I keep bringing up doesn't, which is why I keep angrily insisting on it when people suggest a save-breaking one.  It would only make any mods utilizing the feature incompatible with previous versions, which happens quite often.
Logged
"Oh look there is a dragon my clothes might burn let me take them off and only wear steel plate."
And this is how tinned food was invented.
Alternately: The Brick Testament. It's a really fun look at what the bible would look like if interpreted literally. With Legos.
Just so I remember

Random832

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #97 on: March 20, 2009, 09:18:41 am »

You're talking about a minor presentation issue, the 'solutions' of which require breaking save compatibility.

It's a modding issue, too, and no it doesn't (well, except for the proposals to change the internal unit to allow more range or more resolution - which is not the main focus of the thread). It doesn't even require breaking RAW compatibility, since no existing raws follow a temperature with a letter.

And guess what? Save compatibility is already being broken this release. If a save-breaking change is going to be made, now is the time.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2009, 09:21:26 am by Random832 »
Logged

PTTG??

  • Bay Watcher
  • Kringrus! Babak crulurg tingra!
    • View Profile
    • http://www.nowherepublishing.com
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #98 on: March 22, 2009, 12:16:40 am »

I would just like to state, for the record, how absolutely absurd it is for there to be a 7-page discussion on what method of reporting temperature would be the best.  You're talking about a minor presentation issue, the 'solutions' of which require breaking save compatibility.

For Armok's sake, not everyone has temperature enabled, let alone cares enough about it to warrant the change!

Well, remember, DF is in Alpha, so you can't expect it to be released and patched in the same way as a finished game. The DF we have today is only 28% complete, and will mutate quite a bit before it's done. Small changes like these will be essential to this process, and really do improve the game.
Logged
Space 'Murrica! United States of Space! (Stellaris Democratic Succession)

A thousand million pool balls made from precious metals, covered in beef stock.

inaluct

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #99 on: March 22, 2009, 01:03:47 am »

I'm throwing my endorsement in on this.
Logged

Noble Digger

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #100 on: March 22, 2009, 09:02:09 pm »

I can't help but feel that celsius would be the dumbest of the options.  A uint for Kelvin would be nice (or a float, or uint for 10ths of a kelvin or whatever).  Or Farenheit, which is more familiar to most Americans.  As the game is in English, there's more potential players familiar with that scale.  Plus, I'm selfish and don't like Celsius for anything except talking about water.
BAD BAD BAD!  The US's denial of the SI system to cling to the obsolete English system is one reason most of the world thinks the US is stupid.  America must abandon the English system, lest it fall into being a minor country of little importance.  And really, English is taught everwhere.  Making the game use Fahrenheit for modding would hurt more people than it would help.

@Appelgren:  We're talking about modding here and the actual values.  The game interface can continue the way it is.

Uh ohhhh... Don't forget...

MANY people in the USA use SI measurement for everything when it's important or official, and even among those who use the imperial system there are some things that metric\SI is just better for, and even rednecks will use it. The problem is that our official federal position is to use and teach the imperial system. The last time they tried to switch us all over to SI, there was too much ignorant fear that switching to the metric system would promote communism or something. People literally shot at the road signs which listed distances in KM. Between that, and laziness, and stubbornness, and the cost that would be involved for our millions of machine tool workers and other related jobs, the point is that most people alive today had nothing to do with any of it and use the SI system if they know what's good for them.

I want to remind you: "The US" is not a person. 350,000,000 or more live in this country and we don't like each other, work together very often, or agree about much of anything, please don't generalize about the population of this mongrel country thxu :)

As for the display of temperature? The game never displays temperature at all, the choice of units only matters to modders and to Toady, and honestly the small conversion required when adding a single new temperature value isn't a big deal compared to the work of changing all the stored values in the raws over to a new system (though this would be a 1-time deal) because it doesn't affect gameplay or presentation at all. If Toady decided to do so anyway, I would hope he would use kelvin, as it's the only absolute scale which would prevent modders from having to use negative temperature values. Negative values could and should be used for magic and other related temperature-sapping things imho.
Logged
quib·ble
1. To evade the truth or importance of an issue by raising trivial distinctions and objections.
2. To find fault or criticize for petty reasons; cavil.

eerr

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #101 on: March 23, 2009, 02:03:57 am »

the US will stick to the temprature adjusted for the people, by the people.
scientists can centigrade it up or farenheit boogey if they want.

but the facts are, fareight is alot more useful to non-technical pursuits like weather, ovens, and other low heat or high heat items.
Logged

Silverionmox

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #102 on: March 23, 2009, 02:28:42 am »

but the facts are, fareight is alot more useful to non-technical pursuits like weather, ovens, and other low heat or high heat items.
I don't see why. It's a matter of habit. Fahrenheit temperatures are meaningless for someone used to Celsius. While Celsius at least gives a clear clue about freezing/non-freezing.
Quote from: Noble Digger
Negative values could and should be used for magic and other related temperature-sapping things imho.
From a magical viewpoint, there should be two values: one of the actual temperature of the object, and one for the temperature difference it causes. That way you can have objects of a normal temperature that nevertheless suck heat out of the environment. Near 0 K objects would effectively cool their environs anyway in a realistic temperature system.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2009, 08:12:39 am by Silverionmox »
Logged
Dwarf Fortress cured my savescumming.

RAM

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #103 on: March 23, 2009, 02:47:27 am »

Celsius is superior for food preparation and weather, the freezing and boiling points of water are very relevant to those pursuits, Fahrenheit really has no absolute values with any relevance and if the finer scale of Fahrenheit is a significant advantage, then you should probably be going beyond integers anyway, for example: body temperature... I have no idea what is meant by low heat or high heat items.

Interesting idea, although I can't really see it coming up in many scenarios, perhaps the same effect could be achieved by having a flag that states that an entities temperature is not influenced by external forces...
Logged
Vote (1) for the Urist scale!
I shall be eternally happy. I shall be able to construct elf hunting giant mecha. Which can pour magma.
Urist has been forced to use a friend as fertilizer lately.
Read the First Post!

pndrev

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Change temperature to Celsius
« Reply #104 on: March 23, 2009, 03:30:38 am »

Celsius all the way. Or Kelvin, at least.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 9 ... 14