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Author Topic: What turns you off about DF?  (Read 179250 times)

Mickey Blue

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1590 on: November 05, 2011, 11:12:07 pm »

The military. It used to be easy to put dwarves in the military, make squads, and move them around, and toggle their military-status on and off. Now it's overcomplicated and too much hassle.

I know the military is a big issue for lots of people but (and if you haven't played in a while as you indicate below) its pretty good now IMO.  I use the military as my only line of defense (no walls, no traps, etc) and I find it far nicer to be able to have different squads with different specific equipment, etc.  Much nicer (though to be fair more complex) than the previous version.

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The infinite enemies who attack over and over and over and over until you finally lose, or until you wall yourself in and never come out again. The only way to stop them is to generate a world where they do not exist, or to use an adventurer or adventurers to wipe out their civilizations.

If you mean sieges you can turn those off in the raws, if you mean just general monsters I guess I must not notice them as much.  Though I do play with huge amounts of enemies so to each their own.

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Unkillable forgotten beasts. Do these still appear or are they all HP based now? I quit playing while these were around, but they were only one of the reasons, and it's mainly the military and infinite enemies that are keeping me from coming back.

Those are, so far as I know, gone.  There are still very powerful ones (but then that's the point) but I'm pretty sure the invincible ones (usually made of some mineral) are gone.  Really my beef with FBs are the super weak ones. I hate all the epicness of one showing up then some random dwarf punches it and it dies (usually the 'blob' ones, if anything you'd imagine they'd be harder cause they would be able to reform but it seems to treat them as a bubble that can be popped).

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The inability to use wagons for caravans anymore (unless you build on an existing road?).

Not sure what exactly you mean by this one, there are still caravans and yes there are no wagons but I've never noticed a major issue as a result.  Again though, to each their own.
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Shadowlord

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1591 on: November 05, 2011, 11:31:24 pm »

If you mean sieges you can turn those off in the raws, if you mean just general monsters I guess I must not notice them as much.  Though I do play with huge amounts of enemies so to each their own.
The problem with that was that it disabled all enemies entering the map, including kobolds, dragons, hydras, colossi, etc, although I don't know if it affects underground critters.

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Unkillable forgotten beasts. Do these still appear or are they all HP based now? I quit playing while these were around, but they were only one of the reasons, and it's mainly the military and infinite enemies that are keeping me from coming back.

Those are, so far as I know, gone.  There are still very powerful ones (but then that's the point) but I'm pretty sure the invincible ones (usually made of some mineral) are gone.  Really my beef with FBs are the super weak ones. I hate all the epicness of one showing up then some random dwarf punches it and it dies (usually the 'blob' ones, if anything you'd imagine they'd be harder cause they would be able to reform but it seems to treat them as a bubble that can be popped).
Good to hear.

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The inability to use wagons for caravans anymore (unless you build on an existing road?).

Not sure what exactly you mean by this one, there are still caravans and yes there are no wagons but I've never noticed a major issue as a result.  Again though, to each their own.
Potential trade per year is way down due to the lack of wagons. That isn't a major problem for me, though the inability to have cities connect roads to you was an issue for certain other people.

The RSI-inducing trade interface was an annoyance to me, to the point that I mostly stopped trading and started colonizing sites that had everything I needed.
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Waparius

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1592 on: November 06, 2011, 12:19:47 am »

It may have been mentioned before, but the fact that you can't tell the mood, skills and enabled labours of all of your dwarves on the units screen is incredibly frustrating, especially since dwarves may show up with unassigned labours or get them deactivated for whatever reason.
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zwei

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1593 on: November 06, 2011, 03:01:02 am »

The infinite enemies who attack over and over and over and over until you finally lose, or until you wall yourself in and never come out again. The only way to stop them is to generate a world where they do not exist, or to use an adventurer or adventurers to wipe out their civilizations.

Or set invaders to NO in the init. lol

Well, that works, but people usually prefer lowered rate of invasions over no invasions at all.

When you get to the point where sieges arrive before you are done with cleanup from previous...

Squidpalace

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1594 on: November 06, 2011, 06:25:58 am »


Well, that works, but people usually prefer lowered rate of invasions over no invasions at all.

When you get to the point where sieges arrive before you are done with cleanup from previous...

Turn on when you want a siege. Turn off when you don't want any. I know it's not as good as there being the exact right amount, but I find there are too few if anything, or that it is highly sporadic. Obviously Toady can't make it perfect for everyone.
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Angel Of Death

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1595 on: November 06, 2011, 06:32:16 am »

If invasions are too hard for you to handle, do what I do and set invaders off while you build up defences.
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shadus

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1596 on: November 07, 2011, 12:53:21 am »

I think that the main problem is that you get too many dwarfs showing up through immigration.f'ing migrant dwarves.

There ftfy.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2011, 12:56:56 am by shadus »
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Johuotar

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1597 on: November 07, 2011, 05:24:52 am »

DF got a lot easier after I noticed that I can resize the screen and use tab to hide the minimap. After that I had a lot of trouble with farming, because the way buckets can be used to irrigate farmplots is so weird and unintuitive. Understanding the difference between constructing chair in workshop and "building" it took a little time too and was very frustrating. Understanding z-levels and designating mining cause a lot of trouble for my friend some time ago when he tried DF.
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dr_random

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1598 on: November 07, 2011, 07:19:00 am »

After a couple of years, the "u"nits overview gets cluttered for me. Finding a particular dorf is difficult. Same goes for the militry screen. The font and names are too long and are cut off on my screens. Ever wanted to engrave a memorial slab for a particular dwarf in a high-risk environment? Excuse me, are these GOBLIN names?
This is a issue in the trading dialogue, too. Finding particular objects is also tricky. I'd love to see some sorting being implemented.
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Mickey Blue

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1599 on: November 07, 2011, 10:37:44 am »

I've actually found a lot of people don't get the whole "z level" thing and sometimes its easier just to tell them to ignore that part and find them a nice spot where there are mountains to drill into horizontally (basically simulating the old version without the quirks of the old version).  That way they can work on wrapping their minds around the graphics, the interface, basic survival (Farming, etc) and once they are comfortable with the game itself then they can move on to dealing with the "3D" aspect.

I do find it funny cause I was able to grasp the Z-Level deal pretty fast, however there are many who have problems with it.
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Slappy Moose

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1600 on: November 07, 2011, 03:44:43 pm »

Bugs. That was what turned me off personally, anyway. I don't mind the graphics at all, I actually think it gives the game a really nice style.

Really the only thing that has ever made me stop playing is bugs: when my hospitals don't work and all my dwarves are stuck in bed, my military dwarves refuse to use bolts or adhere to their training/patrolling schedules, etc. Also nobles: I fucking hate dealing with their bullshit, and I really like having big forts so I have to deal with a lot of them.
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Aspgren

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1601 on: November 07, 2011, 04:08:43 pm »

What turned me off from the beginning was... well it was that I saw a screenshot and quickly dismissed it as some boring dungeoncrawl a la nethack.

Then I learned a little more about it and here I am. :)
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moki

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1602 on: November 07, 2011, 04:40:36 pm »

Bugs. That was what turned me off personally, anyway.

Features! Features!  ;)

Yeah, some of those are pretty bad, but Toady's steadily working on the most pressing ones.
Personally, I found the difficulty of organizing all your dwarves when there are more than 20 very annoying. Then I found Dwarf Therapist and learned to love the game again.

The graphics or the lack thereof are scaring many new players, but after playing a while I found them the best solution for a game like this. Proper 3d graphics just wouldn't make sense, even if they were possible.
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Alastar

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1603 on: November 07, 2011, 07:28:08 pm »

What puts me off is a scattered and inconsistent interface (can't do every task where it would be natural, not even the cursor keys are consistent), and the difficulty of doing some tasks that ought to be simple (tainted buckets...).
A lot of information is annoying to access - filtering lists, e.g. ignoring ex-ceatures in the creature list, would be nice for a start.

I think ASCII graphics and throwback-to-the-80ies interface were the right choice... only the former sports the finest implementation I have ever seen with many pleasant details, and the latter appears quite rough.

Some of the outright bugs can be annoying, but others merely add to the charm and still others can be fun to struggle against. In general, the outright bugs bug me less than the sense I'm struggling against an interface that manages to be surprisingly powerful at other times.
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Sutremaine

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1604 on: November 07, 2011, 08:21:04 pm »

Potential trade per year is way down due to the lack of wagons.
It's not. Pack animals have vastly increased carrying capacities since .31, so the weight of goods you get from an animal caravan now is roughly the same as the weight you'd get from an old wagon caravan.
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