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Author Topic: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)  (Read 46903 times)

AncientEnemy

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Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« on: April 20, 2009, 01:19:12 pm »

This actually started out as something completely different (a repeater that didn't function) but it turned out to make one of my favorite things: LOTS OF MIST!

slightly harder to build than my mini-generator, but not much bigger (unless you want it to be, see below) and can be built virtually anywhere, because it goes -above- the room where you want the mist :D



you build it, you pond-fill the one tile with water (then shut the pond zone off), and turn it on. it moves the block of water around the system in a loop, creating mist during the split second when it falls down into the room below (the next pump in the loop sucks it up before it can spread out).

the statues (or etc) aren't completely necessary, but it prevents dwarves from standing where the water lands (which can lead to annoying 'dangerous terrain' cancellation spam, but might be a plus if you want to wash your dwarves). statues also hide the 'muddy' floor tile below. (they don't get muddy themselves, which is cool)

you can also remove the walls where the original 'pond' was (and stick in another statue there), although this means you'll have to rebuild them if you ever want to turn it off and restart it again (Although i can't think why you would :D)

You can also expand this design as much as you like, it just takes more power and more pumps (although it appears you can only have a maximum of 1 block of 7/7 water in the system. i tried starting it with two 6/7 blocks at opposite ends of the loop, and it overflowed the excess 5 water immediately). I just built an 8 pump version for a larger room, and my friend upon seeing it in action said "why not just build one of these that snakes around your entire fortress" to which i replied:



a video of the expanded version in action: http://mkv25.net/dfma/movie-1292-ubermistgenerator

[edit: i need to revamp this first post as the design has improved considerably (read the whole thread for the fleshing out), but in brief; the 'walled off pool' isn't necessary, you can fill the system after it's been turned on, nor are the statues (build paved road tiles out of blocks there instead, hides the mud and looks the same as a smoothed/built floor) also, your dwarves will learn swimming when they stand under the channels)
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 09:25:02 pm by AncientEnemy »
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Elvang

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2009, 01:27:40 pm »

I am so going to do one that snakes around my next fortress now...

How long has it been running? Any problems with evaporation?
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AncientEnemy

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2009, 01:33:53 pm »

it hasn't been running very long, but I don't think evaporation should be an issue. I'm not sure if water evaporates from heat when it's underground (as in 7/7 water becoming 6/7 water), but 'regular' evaporation shouldn't be an issue, because the water travels around as a single block, so it's never at 1/7 anywhere in the system. (that single 1 in the video is a leftover from that 'overflow' i was talking about from putting too much in to begin with, the system doesn't splash at all).

even if it can evaporate over time, just flip on the pond zone again. a couple bucketfuls later you're back up to full power :D

Aspgren

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2009, 01:38:34 pm »

and here I just made a waterfall that accidentally flooded the statue garden and killed 6 dwarves & countless animals ...

I am not worthy.
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Itnetlolor

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2009, 01:43:12 pm »

I love it! Now I can install a shower system for my dwarves.

Thanks to cave adaptation, I think a majority of my dwarves are constantly covered in vomit.

It does clean dwarves right?

AncientEnemy

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2009, 01:51:09 pm »

apparently not...?

i stationed a dirty dwarf under one of the falls and this is what i got:



which makes no sense to me...

i guess maybe they have to be submersed in water longer than the splitsecond that this thing drops it on em?

So I guess it doesn't work as a dwarf-wash, but I think it's cooler with the statues anyway :)
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 01:52:47 pm by AncientEnemy »
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Elvang

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2009, 01:56:44 pm »

Nothing but season changes clean dwarves. Standing in 7/7 water would only give you a dwarf with water covering (lungs) :)
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Puck

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2009, 01:57:57 pm »

That's a friggin nice design, a lot more efficient and cool than the mini-mist-generator you posted a while ago.

Buuuuut... i just cannot imagine this thing working for very long... isnt there parts of 1/7 all the time all over the place, leading to evaporation and the need for restarting the system?

On the other hand... I guess there is no reason why there couldnt be an access to the pump level... just designate one of the channels as "not full pond" and you can have water added to the system on the fly, no?

If yes, why bother with the walled up tile at all?

anyway, I like it, and I guess I'll abuse it real good. I need to get rid of my 6 z-level dining rooms anyway  ;D

Nothing but season changes clean dwarves. Standing in 7/7 water would only give you a dwarf with water covering (lungs) :)
What about the everlasting quest for extinguishing !!dwarves!!?

Elvang

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2009, 02:00:37 pm »

You could use this as an automated torture device for nobles... Trap the noble in a 1x1 room somewhere along the generators path. Your dwarves will be happy from the mist else where while your noble is periodically submerged in 7/7 water xD.

On a side note, would a dwarf gain Swimmer skill if he was in said nobles shoes?
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The Practicalities of Fire Imp Defense
Tileset fonts for dfterm/telnet
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Quote from: They Dig
I have come here to drink booze and breach HFS... and I'm all out of booze.

AncientEnemy

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2009, 02:05:21 pm »

That's a friggin nice design, a lot more efficient and cool than the mini-mist-generator you posted a while ago.
thanks. like i said, i stumbled across it by accident, it was supposed to be a repeater (with pressure plates under the channels) but the water moves too fast for the switches to cycle, and it just grew from there.

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Buuuuut... i just cannot imagine this thing working for very long... isnt there parts of 1/7 all the time all over the place, leading to evaporation and the need for restarting the system?
nope, that's the beauty of it. for some reason, all water in the system when it's turned on aggregates into a single block of 7/7 that jumps around the system (see the video), although like i said, any water in excess of 7/7 does overflow
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On the other hand... I guess there is no reason why there couldnt be an access to the pump level... just designate one of the channels as "not full pond" and you can have water added to the system on the fly, no?
yeah, that's the idea. although i've now had this running for 3 months and haven't lost even 1 water yet. I don't think water underground suffers from heat evaporation the way water on the surface does (although I can't be sure about that)
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If yes, why bother with the walled up tile at all?
that's for filling it up initially. although come to think about it, it probably isn't even necessary :D
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 02:07:34 pm by AncientEnemy »
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AncientEnemy

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2009, 02:09:19 pm »

You could use this as an automated torture device for nobles... Trap the noble in a 1x1 room somewhere along the generators path. Your dwarves will be happy from the mist else where while your noble is periodically submerged in 7/7 water xD.
heh. the only torture in that would be 'slept in the mud' lately. which i think would be offset by the constant mist exposure XD

[edit] I take that back, they must -really- hate sleeping in the mud, because the dwarf i stationed there to clean him went from ecstatic to unhappy really really fast.

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On a side note, would a dwarf gain Swimmer skill if he was in said nobles shoes?
lol, hot damn, it does teach them to swim. i removed the statues entirely and several of my dwarves are dabbling swimmers now.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 02:12:33 pm by AncientEnemy »
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Puck

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2009, 02:12:14 pm »

for some reason, all water in the system when it's turned on aggregates into a single block of 7/7 that jumps around the system
I think that happens because you fill the walled up tile with water, and then turn it on. At least I assume that's what's happening.
Furthermore I assume a pump can move a full block of water in one cycle. Hence we get what we get.

Could I bother you for a little test? I wont be playing DF for some time now, so I cant just fire up one of my fortresses and test it myself. Could you try it with the bucket brigade? you know, no walled up tile, one channel as pond, and add water to the powered (but dry) system. Will it even out after a while and also run with a 7/7 block or will you get smaller amounts of water throughout the system, leading to evaporation? Can you just keep filling with buckets, til there is one 7/7 block, have the rest overflow, and then leave it be?

Oh and if you want a challenge.... how about building the system in a way it will power itself?  ;) You know, use the one block of water to tickle some waterwheels along the way  ;D I dont think that's possible in an elegant and beautiful way, however.

Logical2u

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2009, 02:14:39 pm »

This is amazing - definitely going in my next fortress now.

This is about a bajillion times more efficient than the "reroute a river to provide an artificial waterfall" thing I have going now.... wonder if there's a way to shrink the size any more though, I am a fan of 3x3 systems... maybe that can change though :p (never mind - looking at the video you have an 8 pump system operating, which easily permits a 9x9 area underneaeth).

First problem is that it seems like it might have some difficulties on hotter maps or if you attempt to "branch" the system. It looks like it'll work best when kept very tightly knit - 4 pumps.

I think pumps only transmit 7x7 tiles of water - which used to be a convienent exploit to get infinite water, but I think they also only suck up 7 tiles at a time before spitting them out.

AncientEnemy

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2009, 02:18:41 pm »

for some reason, all water in the system when it's turned on aggregates into a single block of 7/7 that jumps around the system
I think that happens because you fill the walled up tile with water, and then turn it on. At least I assume that's what's happening.
Furthermore I assume a pump can move a full block of water in one cycle. Hence we get what we get.
that's the thing tho; when i turned it on with two separate starting ponds, at opposite ends of the loop, both at 6/7, it instantly sprayed five 1/7 tiles around the pump room and ended up with a a single 7/7 tile.

Quote
Could I bother you for a little test? I wont be playing DF for some time now, so I cant just fire up one of my fortresses and test it myself. Could you try it with the bucket brigade? you know, no walled up tile, one channel as pond, and add water to the powered (but dry) system. Will it even out after a while and also run with a 7/7 block or will you get smaller amounts of water throughout the system, leading to evaporation? Can you just keep filling with buckets, til there is one 7/7 block, have the rest overflow, and then leave it be?
testing that now. one drawback to the system is that if you turn if off, the block that's flying around inevitably muddies up the lower room, but since this is just a testing-ground fort i don't mind about the mess :)

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Oh and if you want a challenge.... how about building the system in a way it will power itself?  ;) You know, use the one block of water to tickle some waterwheels along the way  ;D I dont think that's possible in an elegant and beautiful way, however.
i don't think this is possible at all (without designing a completely different system), given the nature of the way it works. any given tile in the system is dry at least 7/8ths of the time, and that's just for the 4-pump version.

Martin

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Re: Yet another mist generator! (now with 4x the mist!)
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2009, 02:24:51 pm »

You could use this as an automated torture device for nobles... Trap the noble in a 1x1 room somewhere along the generators path. Your dwarves will be happy from the mist else where while your noble is periodically submerged in 7/7 water magma xD.

Fixed
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