Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Poll

Spore Spreader

Keep it as is
- 3 (12%)
Change it to a full Jester, with game-end on win
- 1 (4%)
Change it to a full Jester, but without game-end on win
- 5 (20%)
Change it to a full Jester, with game-end on win AFTER day 3
- 3 (12%)
Change it to a Jester with the loss of the Next Day phase
- 4 (16%)
Remove it entirely
- 9 (36%)
Other (explain)
- 0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 25


Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 117

Author Topic: Paranormal Mafia Game - Rules Discussion  (Read 131544 times)

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2009, 04:04:19 pm »

Okay, now list what abilities Mind Shields block.

Ok, I've added that in. For the record, it's Telepath, Warlock, Disciple of Truth, and Psychic Warden.

Bodyguard would probably be ok to have two of, but I'll leave it at one per side for now to be consistent. Might change that later if we decide we need more town roles.
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2009, 05:23:55 pm »

What do people think of making the Warlock's curse unable to be prevented by a Protector? It would help stop the problem of the dopps having a Protector and therefore perfectly able to kill whomever without worrying about Warlocks or Paranoid War Vets.
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Servant Corps

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #32 on: May 08, 2009, 06:29:44 pm »

I just re-reading the role lists. I want to make it clear...Can the FBI Agent be a Dopp?
Logged
I have left Bay12Games to pursue a life of non-Bay12Games. If you need to talk to me, please email at me at igorhorst at gmail dot com.

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2009, 06:31:18 pm »

I just re-reading the role lists. I want to make it clear...Can the FBI Agent be a Dopp?

Yes, there can be a Dopp Agent. Not horribly useful for them, but still possible. Note that there can be one of any role per side so nothing stops there from being two Agents in the game. One human, one dopp.
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Pandarsenic

  • Bay Watcher
  • FABULOUS Gunslinger
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #34 on: May 08, 2009, 06:42:55 pm »

What do people think of making the Warlock's curse unable to be prevented by a Protector? It would help stop the problem of the dopps having a Protector and therefore perfectly able to kill whomever without worrying about Warlocks or Paranoid War Vets.
Agreed. Also, Protector gets a lot more weight in the formula as a Dopp than as a human, right? I mean, a Doppelganger Protector never accidentally guards a Paranoid War Vet or someone from the other team.
Logged
KARATE CHOP TO THE SOUL
Your bone is the best Pandar honey. The best.
YOUR BONE IS THE BEST PANDAR
[Cheeetar] Pandar doesn't have issues, he has style.
Fuck off, you fucking fucker-fuck :I

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #35 on: May 08, 2009, 06:47:25 pm »

What do people think of making the Warlock's curse unable to be prevented by a Protector? It would help stop the problem of the dopps having a Protector and therefore perfectly able to kill whomever without worrying about Warlocks or Paranoid War Vets.
Agreed. Also, Protector gets a lot more weight in the formula as a Dopp than as a human, right? I mean, a Doppelganger Protector never accidentally guards a Paranoid War Vet or someone from the other team.

Correct. A dopp protector is worth -6 while a town protector is worth only 4. (Negative is against the town's power, positive if for the town)

Actually, let me just post the current weights for people to comment on:

nametypefactionmaxweightpsychicgoal
Mind Shieldabilitytown111
Mind Shieldabilitydopp1-21
Mind Shieldabilityalien111
Townspersonroletown10000survive
Agentroletown140find
Detectiveroletown130find
Telepathroletown131find
Protectorroletown140protect
Paranoid War Vetroletown110kill
Bodyguardroletown110protect
Mad Scientistroletown120survive
Mediumroletown111survive
Ghostroletown111survive
Disciple Of Truthroletown131find
Warlockroletown121survive
Wardenroletown131protect
Aggressive Vetroletown130kill
Reporterroletown120find
Doppelgangerroledopp100-10kill
Agentroledopp1-30find
Detectiveroledopp1-60find
Telepathroledopp1-51find
Protectorroledopp1-60protect
Bodyguardroledopp1-40protect
Mad Scientistroledopp1-40survive
Wardenroledopp1-41protect
Reporterroledopp1-40find
Leaderroledopp1-40kill
Exterminatorrolealien1-10kill
Agent Seekerrolealien110find
Doppelgagner Hunterrolealien110find
Survivorrolealien100survive
Kookroletown1-10survive

(The alien mind shield power is actually just whatever the alien's power is. So a survivor has 0 effect, Exterminator and additional -1, etc)
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #36 on: May 08, 2009, 07:34:09 pm »

I think from now on I'll make sure that the Dead Chat knows if there is a Medium or not. While it was very useful for me to see what a Medium would have gained last time, the fake Medium deception really ticked some people off.

So, no more of that.
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

JoshuaFH

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2009, 07:36:51 pm »

Looking over my actions, I can see where I went wrong. I forgot to force Frelock and Alexhans to roleclaim when I proclaimed mass roleclaim. I should have gotten suspicious when they didn't.

I'll gladly take responsibility for this loss, I got too cocky.

EDIT: HEY WAIT! This isn't the mafia thread! Man it's hot! I can barely think.
Logged

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #38 on: May 08, 2009, 07:41:03 pm »

Speaking of the Dead Chat...what do people think about the handles? I'm kind of thinking that it's fairly useless, since it'd be very tricky for a dead dopp to do much harm over there. Plus, the two dead dopps this time didn't even bother trying.

Also, I'm not sure if the handles carry over from thread to thread. If they do, that'll make it very hard for me to keep up with finding interesting handles for each person each game.
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Pandarsenic

  • Bay Watcher
  • FABULOUS Gunslinger
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #39 on: May 08, 2009, 07:50:18 pm »

SUGGESTION:

Classify certain kills (i.e. the Curse) as a Morningkill - it occurs before day but after night, meaning Protector and such are no good against it.
Logged
KARATE CHOP TO THE SOUL
Your bone is the best Pandar honey. The best.
YOUR BONE IS THE BEST PANDAR
[Cheeetar] Pandar doesn't have issues, he has style.
Fuck off, you fucking fucker-fuck :I

Mephansteras

  • Bay Watcher
  • Forger of Civilizations
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #40 on: May 08, 2009, 07:51:08 pm »

SUGGESTION:

Classify certain kills (i.e. the Curse) as a Morningkill - it occurs before day but after night, meaning Protector and such are no good against it.

I like that idea!
Logged
Civilization Forge Mod v2.80: Adding in new races, equipment, animals, plants, metals, etc. Now with Alchemy and Libraries! Variety to spice up DF! (For DF 0.34.10)
Come play Mafia with us!
"Let us maintain our chill composure." - Toady One

Servant Corps

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #41 on: May 08, 2009, 07:55:33 pm »

Speaking of the Dead Chat...what do people think about the handles? I'm kind of thinking that it's fairly useless, since it'd be very tricky for a dead dopp to do much harm over there. Plus, the two dead dopps this time didn't even bother trying.

Also, I'm not sure if the handles carry over from thread to thread. If they do, that'll make it very hard for me to keep up with finding interesting handles for each person each game.

If it is going to be hard for Dopps to try and mislead the town, maybe it might be better to just get rid of the regular handles. I also consider having dead Dopps stay on the Dopp channel, so the dead Dopps can still help the live Dopps out.
Logged
I have left Bay12Games to pursue a life of non-Bay12Games. If you need to talk to me, please email at me at igorhorst at gmail dot com.

webadict

  • Bay Watcher
  • Former King of the Mafia
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #42 on: May 08, 2009, 11:23:06 pm »

Speaking of the Dead Chat...what do people think about the handles? I'm kind of thinking that it's fairly useless, since it'd be very tricky for a dead dopp to do much harm over there. Plus, the two dead dopps this time didn't even bother trying.

Also, I'm not sure if the handles carry over from thread to thread. If they do, that'll make it very hard for me to keep up with finding interesting handles for each person each game.


If it is going to be hard for Dopps to try and mislead the town, maybe it might be better to just get rid of the regular handles. I also consider having dead Dopps stay on the Dopp channel, so the dead Dopps can still help the live Dopps out.
I dislike this idea. It'll give dead Dopps the ability to learn the Medium's identification, or other things only the dead know.

And the Dopps can, but, like I said, there was no Medium. So it's not nearly as fun. And it made the townies mad.

Meph, I think some of those numbers are off. A protector should be a 3, Dopp Agent -2, Dopp Mind shield should be -3 or -4, Psychic Warden should be 2, ghost should be 2 (at least), Agent Seeker should be 0, Dopp Reporter should be -3, Disciple of Truth should be 2, Telepath should be 4...

These are just from what I'm thinking, so it's just a suggestion. The Ghost is clearly underestimated and the Agent Seeker is kind of anti-Town, in a way (Though more neutral).

SUGGESTION:

Classify certain kills (i.e. the Curse) as a Morningkill - it occurs before day but after night, meaning Protector and such are no good against it.

I like that idea!
Second.
Logged

Pandarsenic

  • Bay Watcher
  • FABULOUS Gunslinger
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #43 on: May 08, 2009, 11:31:16 pm »

Right, this should go here:

Quote
Could be interesting. Post whatever you come up with over in the rules suggestion thread. Won't be in for this round, of course, but maybe the next.

Killer who is Psychic: This player can kill through one of two methods each night. Creating Heart-Stopping Nightmares will kill any player who is not taking an action that they PMed to Meph that nigh. Inducing Mind-Rending Hallucinations will kill any player who is taking an action that they PMed to Meph. Amnesia victims are weak to Nightmares. This player may be Townie or Dopp, but to get the kill must guess correctly whether their target is going to be active that night.

Killer of Psychics: This player will learn on the first night how many Psychic characters the game contains. He shows up as Human or Alien/Kill/Psychic Slayer, for Race/Goal/Role. His win condition is the death of every psychic character. He can choose two players every night and will be told if at least one of them is psychic. He can execute a standard, non-psionic nightkill, and is only able to nightkill once for every psychic player who exists at the start of the game (meaning he has to trick a lynch of a psychic if he messes up a nightkill). Once he has killed all psychic roles, he impedes no win condition other than the Alien Exterminator's.
Logged
KARATE CHOP TO THE SOUL
Your bone is the best Pandar honey. The best.
YOUR BONE IS THE BEST PANDAR
[Cheeetar] Pandar doesn't have issues, he has style.
Fuck off, you fucking fucker-fuck :I

Zai

  • Bay Watcher
  • Elmo? Is that a SIMPLE UTENSIL?
    • View Profile
Re: Paranormal Mafia Game - Round 4 rules discussion
« Reply #44 on: May 08, 2009, 11:36:10 pm »

Brought over from the Round 3 topic as I realized this would fit better in this one:

I think that Dopps need a little less powers, or less chance of getting them. The town needs at least one more investigative role than the Dopps do, and definitely need a Protector if the Dopps have one. For sure. Psychic Wardens are good, but not as great as you'd like. They can be both beneficial and terrible, depending on their luck.

Also, less powers in general.

Yeah. The Warden needs to be paired with an investigative role to be anything but frustrating. Or perhaps simply describe what the targets are doing (holding a gun, sleeping, studying/researching, etc.) in the night results PM or maybe even combine it with an investigative role (probably telepath), so that when the Warden blocks somebody, they at least have some clue as to whether or not they chose the right people to block and whether or not they should block them again.

And eh...talking after death is a pretty big advantage. Take the first M&M Mafia for example. I died and our reviver had already been killed, so I had no chance of coming back alive. However, since I was the Cop and Pandar was my Enabler (effectively my partner; kind of like the typical "Lovers" role but when one person is dead, the other is merely useless except as a regular townie, as compared to dying the next day with the regular Lovers role), Josh allowed me to continue talking to Pandar via PM. I then proceeded to pretty much mastermind the town's recovery plan (I think I spent more time analyzing the game after I had died than when I was alive, actually). And though we still lost anyway, from that experience, I can say that it's a pretty big advantage to have talking dead people that don't have that unknown-trust-level that is so important to Mafia games present.

The leader of the Dopps (not even necessarily the one who has the leader role; the one who takes the lead as mastermind for the Dopps (typically webadict or Josh)) may die, but then if allowed to continue to talk to the other Dopps, the dead Dopp could continue to mastermind the Dopp operation, proceeding as if barely anything had happened. This is compared to the town's Medium role. The Medium first has to connect with the town base and they have to trust him, and vice versa, along with trusting the dead people (big deal in Mafia games, this one especially) to really be useful. This would take at least 2 turns, probably more if the Medium is really unlucky. The dead Dopps however would just continue to talk to each other, with no "time penalty" that the town's Medium would experience.

In short, Dopps should not be able to talk to each other after death (though dead Dopps should still be allowed in the dead chat). =)
Logged
DEATH has been waiting for you. He has poured you some TEA.
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 117