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[Jonathan S. Fox]

If the proposed change of founders being tougher is implemented, will it affect founderII (aka the guy who takes over when the founder dies)?

Yes, it will. Whoever is at the top of the hierarchy will have an aura of badassitude that makes it less likely that they'll get picked off by a stray shot. They're hardly invulnerable -- I've lost a few founders in testing already -- but some cases where you would have been dead, you can get away badly injured instead, and some cases where you would be badly injured, you'll be lightly injured.

[LiteralKa]

I might need help (read: need help) making an editor for the .cpc and .cmv files.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Commit what you have to SVN in a new folder and let me know what the issue is and I'll see if I can help.

[LiteralKa]

Commit what you have to SVN in a new folder and let me know what the issue is and I'll see if I can help.

It's trunk/dev/cpc.cpp

[Leafsnail]

"FOR SHAME:
Today, the conservative machine executed Jo Radman
by drowning in a sewage digester vat."
Ew.  Something to do with the fact she was executed purely for one count of prostitution?

[Aqizzar]

Is it just me or am I no longer able to solicit donations from people I've persuaded? o.o

Yeah, I cut that feature, it was both grindy and overpowered. It's replaced by the option to just stop the meetings.

...What?  What?  Why?  I haven't been around this board in a while, so I missed the discussion where it was decided that my main source of income was Conservatively unrealistic or whatever.

Other than that, woo new version, at the perfect time.

[G-Flex]

Aqizzar: You could gain an indefinite amount of money every single gameday, and were encouraged to. That's grindy and overpowered.

[Aqizzar]

And?  I don't care if it's "grindy", it's perfectly realistic to ask people who like your organization to give you money.  As for the infinite part, how about instead just cap the number of people a member can be talking to each day?  I've always thought that was a little strange.

EDIT: Actually, now that I'm playing it, apparently that has basically been added.  So you pretty much have a finite cap on the number of people you can talk to, so I'll take my donations back now.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

There wasn't a discussion and consensus on removing that option, it was entirely my idea. When I added the ability to ask recruits for money instead of inviting them to join, the idea was that if you decide you don't want them, you'd at least ask them for some money instead. Instead, it became a mainline fundraising method. If I were to add it back it would be heavily nerfed:

1. As is now, you wouldn't be able to talk to more than about six or seven people at a time, and it takes days to get one up to the point where they want to give you money.
2. I would reduce the amount of money they agree to give you by 50% or more.
3. I would make their decision to give you money based on a random chance instead of guaranteed once their interest passes a certain point.

You can still ask people who like your organization to give you money, through the traditional method of picking "ask for donations" in the activation screen. Perhaps that ability is underpowered.

[mainiac]

How about a juice penalty for the donations option?  That would be a decent gameplay mechanic and I'm sure you can rationalize it somehow.

[Aqizzar]

It's very underpowered.  I'll put people to doing that and about once a week I'll get that "found some money on the ground" message for $5.  The homeless people in my neighborhood do better than that.

Why all the attempts to "nerf" the de facto source of funding of all honest political organizations?  Soliciting donations is what movements do, you shouldn't be punished for that.

[Little]

I think if the Police Gang Units catch a wounded Liberal, they should beat the Liberal before arresting them, with the damage pushing our brave Liberal to the brink of death. It's totally something the Conservative Menace would do, and it'd give Gang Units a bit more function.

[G-Flex]

It's very underpowered.  I'll put people to doing that and about once a week I'll get that "found some money on the ground" message for $5.  The homeless people in my neighborhood do better than that.

I found *most* of the typical fundraising methods to be almost worthless, but maybe I'm just stupid.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Why all the attempts to "nerf" the de facto source of funding of all honest political organizations?  Soliciting donations is what movements do, you shouldn't be punished for that.

You are not an honest political organization, you're a group of rogue terrorist extremists. Furthermore, the recruit donations system used is unfun. It is grindy whether you have a cap on recruits or not. If you're spending any significant chunk your time in Liberal Crime Squad walking around panhandling, there's something seriously wrong.

It's very underpowered.  I'll put people to doing that and about once a week I'll get that "found some money on the ground" message for $5.  The homeless people in my neighborhood do better than that.

Soliciting donations doesn't give you messages. The finding money on the ground message hasn't been in the game for years... since prostitution went in probably. It only appeared when you put a negative juice person on cause trouble. However, I take your point. I'll go ahead and increase the returns from donations by about four times in the next release. Once this is in place, a new recruit crack head character in a prison jumpsuit with a completely unknown (or completely hated) LCS will make about $5 a day. A hippie with 5 persuasion, 8 heart, and 7 charisma, with a 100% popular LCS will make $26 a day on average. Use a juiced up Liberal with 10 persuasion, 15 heart, 15 charisma, and an expensive suit, and they'll haul in $173 a day, assuming you can avoid rampages and bad press. That'll have to be good enough -- soliciting donations is a very safe activity.

So if the issue is that the ask for donations option is underpowered, thereby preventing you from playing out a certain strategy you want to use, I can deal with that. But if the issue is just that I removed an extremely lucrative and zero risk but playtime-intensive fundraising method, that is entirely the point. No risk options should be weaker than risky options, this is always the case.

If you want some other highly lucrative option, in the current release you might experiment with stealing cars (which can be scrapped at the dealership for $400-800 each) or rob buildings. In the next version, spawns in apartments will be reduced and your thieves will be able to sneak past Conservatives even after the alarm is raised, which will combine to make robbing the rich apartments more viable. These downtown apartments can give you fine jewelery, which is a new $500 each loot type I added to the game in this release. Then (and this is true currently) you can graduate to robbing the CEO house, where cracking the safe can now give you thousands of dollars in raw cash and multiple units of the aforementioned fine jewelery, not to mention one or more of several different possible publishables that can be sold for $250-1000 each at the pawn shop if you don't want to use them to pursue the Liberal Agenda. In the current release you can do this repeatedly once you locate the safe in the CEO's house -- next release, guard dogs will be much more dangerous to thieves.

I found *most* of the typical fundraising methods to be almost worthless, but maybe I'm just stupid.

Yes, and that's because this is supposed to be Liberal Crime Squad, not Liberal Fundraising Club. There's no lack of money in the game, but a good flow of it requires illegal methods. That is entirely by design.

I think if the Police Gang Units catch a wounded Liberal, they should beat the Liberal before arresting them, with the damage pushing our brave Liberal to the brink of death. It's totally something the Conservative Menace would do, and it'd give Gang Units a bit more function.

Yeah, they really should. Right now, that type of thing is only done in chase sequences, and it follows this hierarchy:

Cop: Push you to the ground and handcuff you.
Gang Unit Cop: Throw you to the ground and taze you repeatedly. (10% injury)
Death Squad: Throw you to the ground and shoot you in the head. (you die)
Anyone Else: Throw you to the ground and beat you senseless. (60% injury)

This is too generous. Cop should do that soft stuff only with heavy police regulation (L or L+), otherwise they should use the tazer. Gang Unit cops should beat you senseless. And as you suggest, this all should happen when you get caught from severe wounds outside of chases too. Right now, Gang Unit cops don't even arrest you, they just keep shooting -- but it would be more striking if they did, but only after kicking the crap out of you.

[Aqizzar]

Soliciting donations doesn't give you messages. The finding money on the ground message hasn't been in the game for years... since prostitution went in probably. It only appeared when you put a negative juice person on cause trouble. However, I take your point. I'll go ahead and increase the returns from donations by about four times in the next release. Once this is in place, a new recruit crack head character in a prison jumpsuit with a completely unknown (or completely hated) LCS will make about $5 a day. A hippie with 5 persuasion, 8 heart, and 7 charisma, with a 100% popular LCS will make $26 a day on average. Use a juiced up Liberal with 10 persuasion, 15 heart, 15 charisma, and an expensive suit, and they'll haul in $173 a day, assuming you can avoid rampages and bad press. That'll have to be good enough -- soliciting donations is a very safe activity.

I guess I was so used to the tedium that I didn't realize what was actually happening.  Now that you mention it, I was just thinking about how much I don't enjoy going to the Juice Bar and randomly mashing the arrow keys until a pile of literal and figurative green comes up, then holding down B for a few days.  Automating a completely sensible but tedious process sounds great to me, and if anything that does seem like a lot of money.  Carry on then.