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[Acanthus117]

Yay Effigies

[Fault]

Okay, here's some info on human religion.

Spoiler:  Human Religion (click to show/hide)

 HUMAN RELIGION

history:
 some 200-300 years ago, when the world was still locked in the Age of War, a man known as "the saviour" began wandering the world and preaching a philosophy of tolerance and reason. Many believed him to be a demigod, for he had an unearthly charisma and strange, mystical abilities - He could heal the sick, communicate with spirits, and see into the future. By using his powers to spread good will, he rallied many to his cause. Eventually he forged an alliance of Elves, Men, and Dwarves who were determined to drive out the aggressors of the Age of War and bring Reason to the world. This army marched northward, defeating many clans of goblins, barbarians and cannibals.
Truly their force seemed unstoppable - until they reached the citadel of the black cult, demon-worshippers who practiced human sacrifice. It was here that the saviour died. There is some debate on the circumstances of his death (though many believe he was betrayed by someone close to him) but all agree on the methods - his throat was slit and his body was burned to ash. Driven to rage by the fall of their leader, the remaining warriors of the alliance destroyed the citadel and all its inhabitants. It was on the citadel's ruin that they built The Keep, a great temple-city that served as a testament to their alliance's indomitable spirit.
Soon after the extermination of the black cult, the warriors of the alliance continued their march northward, while the citizens stayed in the areas surrounding the keep (The army never returned from their last campaign, and to this day no one knows their fate). To many it seemed the age of war was over, and it was with great jubilation that they ushered in a new age of Reason. The elves and dwarves of the alliance left for new homes in the forest and mountains, while the humans built new towns surrounding the keep. The human scholars who had enscribed the words of the saviour set about organizing the scattered documents into a comprehensive book - a book which forever remains incomplete, due to the saviour dying before he delivered his final sermons. The incompletenes of the holy book has led to much misinterpretation and debate about the book's true meaning.
religous figures:
The Saviour: the founder of their religion, who tought as a prophet and led as a warrior. He was believed to be a demigod. It is his word that the faith's holy book is based on.
The God: A divine being thought up by mankind in an effort to ponder the nature of the Saviour's parentage. He is associated with the live giving aspects of the sun and the destructive aspects of Fire.
religous sites:
The Keep: a massive temple-city built near the west coast of the north end of the continent.
Holy book:
The Faith's holy book lists several practices on how to live, most of them venerating wisdom, reason, and understanding in all actions. It also lists instructions for various other skills - understanding the movement of the sun to maximize crop growth, forging techniques for iron and steel, and other useful knowledge to build a functioning society.
Current practices
The incompleteness of the holy book and the strange nature of the saviour's heritage led to much speculation among the faith's members - several factors (including the fiery demise of their leader and the veneration of the sun found throughout his words) have led the populace to believe that the saviour was the child of a sun god. Thus, much of their religous symbols and practices are based around fire. Their main symbol is a torch, and human cathedrals are often filled with candles and burning incense. Bonfires are held during the winter, babies are annointed with ash shortly after being born. Devout members are expected to pray facing west at sunset and pray facing east at sunrise. Human graveyards are often littered with candles, lanterns, and torches, which they believe help the souls of the dead light their path to the next world.

some could say that years of misinterpretation and desperation have caused the religion to devolve into an over-elaborate fire cult.

It's like, 11:47 at night, so I'm kinda scatter-brained right now. I may have repeated or contradicted myself... if anything doesn't make sense, please point it out to me so I can remedy it!

[Mephansteras]

some could say that years of misinterpretation and desperation have caused the religion to devolve into an over-elaborate fire cult

Some could say that this is both awesome and hilarious.

[Dagoth Urist]

Conworlding makes you a great writer, artist and human being. It's a proven fact!  Do you want to draw parallels to the Christ, someone else, or do you want to keep the saviour completely without influence of real-world messiahs?

I'd be overjoyed to hear just a rudimentary briefing on the Age of War and the nature of magic.

Enough praise! More remedies!
The Age of War, beset by the goblins worshipping the Black Goddess, if I understand it correctly? And barbarian hordes too, it seems. The Saviour's teachings promoted reason and tolerance in a Crapsack World, am I right? Did he value peace highly too? It might not be a problem at all if he didn't, its just that the saviour both spread good will and amassed the greatest military power ever since the The Golden Age. He proceeded to kick the goblins 'til they curbed, at the price of his own life in the end. I think it looks like he was partly a religious leader, partly a military one. Not that there's anything wrong at all with it, I'm just notifying. Then again, The God and what he represent are in that same duality, so...

The incomplete book is interesting, and its a nice touch that it was even a bit of an instruction manual for life. Are there a lot of different variants and dissidents of the faith? Logically, it should; unless there is a strong organization that regulates what can be said and what cannot. Since the book was incomplete, there should be several ways to interpret the saviour's tolerance and reason. Even if there is a strong "church" that goes down on rogue upstarts; even if there is, there could be dissident factions that "spreads the truth underground".

The exact nature of the Age of Reason isn't told, and I think that's because you don't want to write a lengthy text of it too, just after finishing this one. Still, was it just an age of peace, or were there more "modern" improvements that the epithet suggest? Why exactly did the dwarves and elves leave the Keep, why not live with the humans instead? Did a few elves and humans actually stay with them? Weren't the dwarves and elves a bit pissed off about the humans automatically taking control of the citadel? If I was a dwarf, I would Did the construction of the Keep have a more pragmatic purpose? As I understand it, Man had lived underground for centuries and now sought to reclaim the overworld.

The map you supplemented in the first page of Effigies, does it show the entire continent? And do- Okay. Maybe I really ought not to bombard you with questions... I thank you in advance for any that you can answer You're doing great, Fault.

[eerr]

Also, I totally pegged a thread of yours on Mspa just from the name.

[Fault]

You raise a lot of good points, Dagoth Urist! 
At some point I'll try to answer your questions and consider your ideas, but I don't really have time for that so early in the morning.
HERE WE GO

Do you want to draw parallels to the Christ, someone else, or do you want to keep the saviour completely without influence of real-world messiahs?

well he's quite obviously a christ figure (with some Joan of Arc elements), but if you know any other messianic figures I could draw inspiration from, that'd be great. You know, to add some variety to his influences.

The Age of War, beset by the goblins worshipping the Black Goddess, if I understand it correctly? And barbarian hordes too, it seems.

The black goddess worshippers were human - they were a separate force from the Goblin Hordes.
AGRESSORS DURING AGE OF WAR: Human/Dwarven Barbarians, Goblin hordes, Elven Cannibals, Human Cultists.

The Saviour's teachings promoted reason and tolerance in a Crapsack World, am I right? Did he value peace highly too?

Yes, peace was always his intended goal. He may have been a bit flawed in his methods, though.

I think it looks like he was partly a religious leader, partly a military one. Not that there's anything wrong at all with it, I'm just notifying. Then again, The God and what he represent are in that same duality, so...

Pragmatism is a big part of his leading style. He knows that while he can convert many to his side through teaching, there are some who would prove unreasonable and must be dealt with through military action.

its a nice touch that it was even a bit of an instruction manual for life.

I tried to keep it away from being all about superstitious religous practices... the Saviour was only teaching the intelligent races how to survive and prosper, not how to live their personal lives (aside from fundamental guidelines about courtesy and tolerance, there's no list of sins or elaborations of right and wrong)

Are there a lot of different variants and dissidents of the faith? Logically, it should; unless there is a strong organization that regulates what can be said and what cannot. Since the book was incomplete, there should be several ways to interpret the saviour's tolerance and reason. Even if there is a strong "church" that goes down on rogue upstarts; even if there is, there could be dissident factions that "spreads the truth underground".

You could say there are two general factions of man: those who follow the saviour's lifestyle of reason and rationality (but do not follow his word religously), and those who actually revere the saviour as a divine being (these being the ones who thought up his divine father and all those fire-based traditions)
there is really no regulation on who can believe what. Something like this would be hard to manage in-story seeing as humanity coexists with elves and dwarves, both of whom have different religous beliefs! (not to mention any remaining humans who choose to follow "pagan" beliefs)

Still, was it just an age of peace, or were there more "modern" improvements that the epithet suggest?

Yes, it was basically an age of peace with modern improvements. (there is limited understanding of gunpowder weaponry, for one)

Why exactly did the dwarves and elves leave the Keep, why not live with the humans instead?

It is simply their way - elves and dwarves, being very long-lived races, are not all that comfortable with making drastic changes to their living style. Elves live in forests, humans live in cities, dwarves live in mountains - that's just the way it's always been.

Did a few elves and dwarves actually stay with them?

Yes. See the "races" category in the original post - it describes "hill dwarves" and "half elves" as dissidents from their race who chose to live as humans.

Did the construction of the Keep have a more pragmatic purpose?

It was essentially a centerpiece for the alliance to build their new society around - the towns surrounding it serve as trading hubs, among other purposes.

The map you supplemented in the first page of Effigies, does it show the entire continent?

I probably should have elaborated on this earlier... no.
the actual continent is far larger than the area inhabited by the remnants of the alliance. The kingdoms of the mortal races once spanned a continent about the size of the americas - but so many died during the age of war. The sparse populations left over are pathetically small compared to their size during the age of peace.
Right now, the combined numbers of elves, dwarves and men barely reach 100,000. It is a bittersweet existence: the world is at peace, but so much has been lost to attain that peace. Only a tiny percent of the continent is civilized - the rest is covered by "the great wild", which is a lot larger than the chapter one map implies (most citizens are unaware of how big the world really is)

[Fault]

Page #33 is up.

In which Josef's overeagreness once again brings disaster to the party.

How's the pacing? I'm not going too fast am I?

[Acanthus117]

Have I told you that this is awesome and its preventing me from getting any work done on that story I was talking about?

[Dagoth Urist]

Wonderful! I find this equally interesting to the comic itself. Which just got a new page, so I'm all rainbows and butterflies at the moment 

Your answers and reasons are clever, and I'm not trying to flatter you! The reason why the Keep fell in human hands makes perfect sense when considering that it was run by human cultist, and that the other races simply wouldn't (normally) live in cities. Bad research on my part, not noticing the halfelves and hill dwarves... I'm now satisfied at the moment

Regarding the saviour: I think its novel, which is good, that you made him so void of superstition and rational. Or so he seemed to be, if not listening to the fire-cultists Other inspirations besides the Christ and Joan D'arc, who is a borderline messiah herself, would be.... Andraste! Or not really. The Dragon Age mythos isn't all that expansive on her, unfortunately. I still think it's funny that she share the same inspirations, namely the Christ and D'arc. On a more serious note; the existing messiahs of our world is a bit too ...esoteric, I fear. But I think you could find some things interesting in Buddha, the Saoshyant and Origen Adamantius. The Mahdi and Bahá'u'lláh is just way too dissimilar to be of an use... Anyway, it's a lot of damn work going through just the basic elaborations of them. I've no bloody idea why I did anymore xD I will just direct to a place that I take it you already know of.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MessianicArchetype

...Just work on it between the updates, you lazy Acanthus.

[Acanthus117]

But then there's all this other crap that distracts me!

(school/webcomics/random writans on the intarwebs)

WHO ARE YOU TO JUDGE ME AND MY LAZY ASS?!

[Dagoth Urist]

I am that I am... But go ahead, now! Skip school, webcomics and diverse textual musings and treatises assortative and/or pertaining to the World Wide Web and the Internet Protocol Suite! I dare you! If you do good, I might dissect all you work ruthlessly. All in the name of positive criticism, of course

[Fault]

I think its novel, which is good, that you made him so void of superstition and rational. Or so he seemed to be, if not listening to the fire-cultists

the whole idea was that without a clear leader the alliance really fell apart. The dwarves and elves fled to their respective domains, and some branches of humanity even started to drift away from the collective of the keep (the Outlanders in the prologue map, for example).

In all the 200 or so years that the age of reason has lasted, humanity has remained as nothing more than autonomous collectives who rarely communicate outside of trading. There's not been a King of men for nigh on two centuries... their once great empire is in a truly tragic decline.

would be.... Andraste! Or not really.

last I checked that character was pretty much based on Joan of Arc.

Have I told you that this is awesome and its preventing me from getting any work done on that story I was talking about?

yes, you have told me this.

[Acanthus117]

Goodness, is this really supposed to be a Crapsack World or something? (too lazy to get Tv tropes link)

[Fault]

close. It was intended to be more of this world-type.

Spoiler: other depressing elements of this world (click to show/hide)

-Dogs went extinct during the Age of War.
-the creatures mankind calls "horses" are actually more of a pony-donkey hybrid (true horses having gone extinct during the age of war) which are slowly becoming sterile as their bloodlines get more muddied.

EDIT: BTW acanthus, I'm sending you some more plot information soon, for feedback.

[Maggarg - Eater of chicke]

I'm beginning to wonder why anyone in Effigies actually bothers getting out of bed.