Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8

Author Topic: Am I the only one who likes the user interface  (Read 15647 times)

Kilo24

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #60 on: May 10, 2010, 07:54:50 pm »

It's really hard to learn, but once your used to it, it's very efficient and easy to use.

Define "efficient".  I don't know how many times I've found myself repeatedly pressing keys over and over and over just to perform some task that would have taken 10 seconds at most with a well designed interface.  That to me is the exact opposite of efficient.
My guess is that he's thinking efficiency means that each order you give can be accessed fairly easily provided you know what to do.  In that formulation, the interface works well - you do get a lot of control over the orders.

How I (and I think you) try to interpret efficiency is minimizing how much effort it takes to get your dwarves to do something that the designer doesn't intend to be a challenge. 

The latter definition is wider and more open to subjectivity (but it's still not that subjective.)  It cares about how easy it is to give orders, but also about the effects of each order.  It incorporates a number of optimizations like not requiring specificity in orders when you don't want any further specification as well as making the most frequently used orders the easiest to use.
Logged

Hyperturtle

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #61 on: May 10, 2010, 08:10:40 pm »

It sounds like people either want the interface A) pretty B) mouse enabled C) organized differently and D) involve Clippy, the helpful paperclip, to tell you what to do.

It looks like your dwarfs are thirsty!  May I suggest using the Still?  You're trying to use the Still!  May I suggest making a barrel, first?  You want to make a barrel!  May I suggest obtaining a source of wood first?  You want to chop down trees!  May I suggest enabling the woodcutter skill, first? You found an axe!  Great, now you want to make a barrel!  Someone needs the carpenter skill!  You are trying to use the Still! Too bad you don't have any brewable plants around.  You want to start a farm!  Too bad you don't have any seeds.  May I suggest bringing an axe, booze and seeds next time, after you abandon this fortress since you embarked at a location without a river, the ponds dried up, you're out of booze, your dwarfs are tantruming and the first dwarf caravan only brought schisty crafts NO ONE would want?

I don't see the dwarfy suggestion system working that working well.

As for the interface, well... I have little problems with it now, and I had stopped playing for well over a year.  It was quite easy to pick up again.  Sure the new military was a little difficult to grasp at first but now I have no problems and prefer it to the old system, despite a few bugs.  I will concede that digging out bedrooms is a drag, especially when under a river or water source.










Logged
igless

Rotten

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #62 on: May 10, 2010, 09:20:17 pm »

I love the interface. Military screen is very nice and easy to use. What's so bad about it? It's really powerful and most simple actions like drafting can be done in 2-5 keypresses. Equipping takes about 10, but it's still easy. I just wish it would delete dead dwarves from squads.
Logged
True, but at a certain velocity the resulting explosion expels invader-bits at fatal speeds. You don't want to be dropping trogdolyte-shaped shrapnel bombs into your boneworks.
Only in Dwarf Fortress...

Urist McOverlord

  • Bay Watcher
  • [Evil_Genius]
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #63 on: May 10, 2010, 09:35:02 pm »

I think that consistency would be really nice. I'd also like some better defaults for some of it (like the military. It shouldn't be so hard to get the darn guys to train. Although I blame a bug on that particular issue, because everything I've found says it should work, but I'm straying from my point.)

Of course, other people have beaten that half to death already, so I'm gonna chip my two cents worth into the graphics debate.

Tilesets are not anti-imagination. I really like Mayday's tileset, because it lets me easily see and determine the difference between dwarf professions (especially for military.), and I can tell the difference between a worthless rock and an ore, and it just works. That said, I still need to imagine how a fully fleshed-out fortress would look. Wouldn't have it any other way.
Logged
Magma: The cause of, and solution to, all life's problems.

If it moves, it wants to kill you. It may not try to, but it wants to.

Naxza

  • Bay Watcher
  • Wanderer of Broken Worlds
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #64 on: May 10, 2010, 11:22:15 pm »

I like the interface, but that's because I don't have to look at much of it since memorizing it.

It was a daunting wall of text when I first found Dwarf Fortress, though.
Logged

Deon

  • Bay Watcher
  • 💀 💀 💀 💀 💀
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #65 on: May 11, 2010, 12:04:41 am »

I love the interface. Military screen is very nice and easy to use. What's so bad about it? It's really powerful and most simple actions like drafting can be done in 2-5 keypresses. Equipping takes about 10, but it's still easy. I just wish it would delete dead dwarves from squads.
Crashing :). When it's sorted out and I am used to it, I am sure I will love it.
Logged
▬(ஜ۩۞۩ஜ)▬
✫ DF Wanderer ✫ - the adventure mode crafting and tweaks
✫ Cartographer's Lounge ✫ - a custom worldgen repository

Retro

  • Bay Watcher
  • o7
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #66 on: May 11, 2010, 12:29:49 am »

and D) involve Clippy, the helpful paperclip, to tell you what to do.

It looks like you are trying to commit elven genocide! What would you like to do?

Jackrabbit

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #67 on: May 11, 2010, 12:32:36 am »

I quite like the interface. As it stands, the military interface is terrible, but I forced myself to get used to it and now I'll celebrate like anyone else if it's made easier to use but it's not a huge problem for me.
Logged

Aklyon

  • Bay Watcher
  • Fate~
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #68 on: May 11, 2010, 12:34:53 am »

and D) involve Clippy, the helpful paperclip, to tell you what to do.

It looks like you are trying to commit elven genocide! What would you like to do?
A. Be Nice?
B. Continue On.
C. Ignore Clippy, then B.
Logged
Crystalline (SG)
Sigtext
Quote from: RedKing
It's known as the Oppai-Kaiju effect. The islands of Japan generate a sort anti-gravity field, which allows breasts to behave as if in microgravity. It's also what allows Godzilla and friends to become 50 stories tall, and lets ninjas run up the side of a skyscraper.

ManaUser

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #69 on: May 11, 2010, 01:30:30 am »

My 2☼:

I don't expect or even want huge changes to the interface. I don't mind that it's primarily keyboard based, in fact I usually prefer to use the keyboard when given choice. That said, it is nice to have a choice, so I think expending the places a mouse can be used would be a good thing.

However, I am fully in agreement with everyone who says the interface should be more consistent. Someone claimed there were 15 different methods used to draw a rectangle... I only know of three, but ideally it should be one. Another perennial newbie confusers is when to use use -/+ and when to use ↑/↓. It's not too bad once you figure out that full screen menus used the arrow keys and half screen menus use the other (though there are exceptions, like the talk menu in Adventure Mode, why?) But might it not be better if -/+ worked all the time?

Finally, some of the menus are just plain awkward. The custom stockpile menu is frequently mentioned in this context. This could have been so much simpler. No e/d a/b f/p, why not just have enter toggle whatever is selected, be it an item type (bars/blocks) sub-type (metal bars), or specific type (iron bars). My own pet peeve is the notes menu. Many other menus aren't bad, but they could still be improved. For instance by putting commands in some logical order, alphabetical (by function, not hotkey) if nothing else. Also tiny things, like on the embark planner screen, it's sometimes hard to see which column has the focus. Wouldn't it be nice if the background color changed to make this easily visible? Especially if that convention were used consistently across all menus?
Logged
Akur Akir Akam!

Deathworks

  • Bay Watcher
  • There be no fortress without its feline rulers!
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #70 on: May 11, 2010, 01:47:24 am »

Hi!

O.o

Wow, this is developing really fast. So much interesting text to read with so many interesting thoughts. Thank you all!

So, I have to pick out some examples, some aspects without meaning any disrespect to those not referred to.

General: Let me stress again, that this thread here is about subjective views, about feelings. It is about the question how the individual members feel about the UI and not about its bugs or its deficiencies according to specific academic evaluation procedures (of course, if your own feelings co-incide with those procedures, it makes sense to include them). As such, there is no universal "right" answer - everyone here has their own answer and while we can ask for details, I hope we can respect that.

Also note that the question was just about "liking" the UI. It is not proposing that the UI is perfect or anything.

Jiri Petru: First of all, I really want to thank you for linking to that other thread. As I said, I want this thread to be something positive/useful, and that link helps channel some of the energy into other venues that may make that energy even more effective.

Your question about how people can feel that way is a bit hard to answer or rather, the answer is a bit hard to put into words.

Basically, at least in my case it is a combination of a natural inclination with an extensive training. The natural inclination I already hinted at before - I am not very fast and not very good at fine jobs, so mouse controls, for instance, are rather daunting for me, unless they give me either a lot of margin for error or give me a lot of time to carefully make sure I am clicking at the right spot. You could say that the input the mouse accepts is too detailed/too fine for me to feel completely comfortable with. Opposed to that, keyboard controls have a very ensuring discreteness.

The other aspect, training, refers not only to having played Dwarf Fortress or other roguelikes. I started playing computer/video games in the late 80s, including things like Wizardry - Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord on the C=64, or SimCity, The Bard's Tale, Ultima III on that machine as well. I thoroughly got used to certain approaches to handling interaction between the user and the game, and thus, while I enjoyed playing SpellForce and got along with Earth 2160 and I even played through WarCraft and WarCraft II (I notoriously fail to reach the end of games (^_^;; ), I simply do not feel at home with their mouse-based systems.

And this favoring one type of input is strong enough to color my perception: if I control a game using a keyboard (or gamepad for action games), I am likely to ignore smaller issues with the controls. The overall favorable view I take on the input cancels out all but the most horrible atrocities. On the other hand, once I notice that SimCity 4 does not allow you to turn buildings with the mouse but requires a keypress in an otherwise pure mouse interface, I feel horribly repulsed and offended by that complete failure of an interface (I am exaggerating - a little bit (^_^;; ). People are less likely to see the flaws in which they like while those in the things they are critical about become even more obvious and glaring.

So, the user interface appeals to me because a) it is keyboard based at the core, b) makes it clear that we are tile-based with the game engine, c) feels rather "texty" (you see, even though I am not really good at them, I really like text adventures/interactive fiction. So, walls of text are something that make a game appealing). I guess there is also some Spartan flair to the very simple design of the menu, which gives it a comforting hardness for me (I need hard edges in my controls as I am too clumsy to handle smooth gradiants).

In addition, there is of course the experience bonus - for most of the commands, I do not need to actually look at the command overview, but I am forgetful, so that the rarer commands sometimes do prompt me to quickly look at the overview, just to make sure. And at least for me, that is usually something that works out very quickly as the keywords given work well with me.

And personally, I don't think that the kitchen screen is actually something you use that often - I basically only visit it to deactivate cooking for brewables, alcohol, and tallow, and then never again. So, it is not really something I miss. And I have grown used to the status view with its subviews of various states - like the animals page showing you which animals you actually have while the status view just gives you two numbers as a rough overview, or the kitchen menu kind of complimenting your stock screen by listing the actual number of processable food items. To me, that tree in the interface makes perfect sense.

I hope I was able to make it a bit more understandable why I feel that way.

Urist McOverlord: I also agree that the tilesets do not replace imagination. I personally prefer ASCII because the symbols are easier for me to tell apart.

However, if you scanned photos of some real life people like George Bush or George Clooney and used them for graphics, I think you can say that you just butchered imagination and my healthy sleep... There are just some things that I can not really suffer :) :) :)

Hyperturtle: Mmmmhhhh, Clippy, the helpful paperclip ... it is actually a cute idea. But I personally rather leave such things out of the game proper. Good for tutorials and fan-art, but quickly becoming annoying once you got used to a game, I think.

Footkerchief: I have to admit that I was really surprised when I read your assessment. I would never had thought you felt that strongly about it, seeing your activity around bay12... (I am aware that the current interface is considered a stopgap of sorts and will be overhauled, but that were really strong statements O.o )

General: Allow me to explain a little bit about my paranoia concerning the mouse input debate.

In my experience, it seems to be very difficult for designers to come up with a really good interface, regardless which path they choose. Sure, the core may be easily set up, but when you get to the details, things often get tricky and balancing the clutter of multiple menus on the same level with the problems caused by deep submenu trees can have very interesting results, to say the least.

I have to admit that I am more than a bit worried about the mouse control question because a genuine mouse based interface simply has to look differently from a genuinely keyboard based interface. You have simply different needs to respond to, different elements that are required. Of course, it is at least theoretically possible to have a game that works perfectly for keyboard controls and also works perfectly for mouse controls, but that would basically require designing TWO good interfaces where most designers seem to have a hard time even putting together one good interface.

The easy way out would, of course, be to have one as the core system and the other as an optional, additional system. But that means that the optional system has to be warped and has to succumb to the needs of the main system. And frankly, I think it is easier to warp keyboard controls to work with a mouse-controlled game, than it is to warp mouse control to work with a keyboard controlled game. So, if that shortcut was chosen, I think it would be likely for the keyboard controls getting the short end of the stick. And this could eventually lead to incompleteness, meaning that you can't solely play with the optional controls, but need the core ones for certain aspects.

The negative consequences of this hybridity can already be seen a little bit in world gen. There is this map painting option, it seems, but as far as I understand it, it requires mouse control. Thus, it is not usable for me (especially since I turn off all mouse elements so as not to have the mouse cursor block the view).

Mind you, that fear is probably exaggerated, but that is just how I personally feel and why I am always wary when people talk about mouse control.

(I hope I remembered all the important points raised)

Deathworks

EDIT: Since ManaUser posted while I typed, I want to quickly point out that I basically feel the same about where the keyboard controlled system stands and what could be improved (although I don't mind the order of keys in the overview :) :) :) :) ).
Logged

Jiri Petru

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #71 on: May 11, 2010, 03:49:58 am »

Deathworks, thanks for your answer. But you are basically advocating keyboard interface above mouse interface. Please note I wasn't talking about keyboard vs. mouse, I was using the example of the main menu to talk about organisation, submenus, visual disctintion, etc., while at the same time keeping everything keyboard-based. I would really like to hear your opinion on these.

Quote from: Deathworks
And personally, I don't think that the kitchen screen is actually something you use that often - I basically only visit it to deactivate cooking for brewables, alcohol, and tallow, and then never again. So, it is not really something I miss. And I have grown used to the status view with its subviews of various states - like the animals page showing you which animals you actually have while the status view just gives you two numbers as a rough overview, or the kitchen menu kind of complimenting your stock screen by listing the actual number of processable food items. To me, that tree in the interface makes perfect sense.

I don't actually want to bring kitchen out into the main menu, and I think the Stocks menu might be the best designed menu in the game. My point was: why are there things like artifacts and civilisations in the main menu, when they really could and should be hidden the same way kitchen, justice, economy, etc. are.

EDIT: In other words, I wouldn't call the game's menu "interface" - it's simply "a list of controls". If it weren't in the game and you'd have it printed on a piece of paper next to your keyboard, the effect would be exactly the same - ie. you'd memorise the list and then throw it away.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 03:53:54 am by Jiri Petru »
Logged
Yours,
Markus Cz. Clasplashes

zwei

  • Bay Watcher
  • [ECHO][MENDING]
    • View Profile
    • Fate of Heroes
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #72 on: May 11, 2010, 04:23:21 am »

General: Allow me to explain a little bit about my paranoia concerning the mouse input debate.

In my experience, it seems to be very difficult for designers to come up with a really good interface, regardless which path they choose. Sure, the core may be easily set up, but when you get to the details, things often get tricky and balancing the clutter of multiple menus on the same level with the problems caused by deep submenu trees can have very interesting results, to say the least.

I have to admit that I am more than a bit worried about the mouse control question because a genuine mouse based interface simply has to look differently from a genuinely keyboard based interface. You have simply different needs to respond to, different elements that are required. Of course, it is at least theoretically possible to have a game that works perfectly for keyboard controls and also works perfectly for mouse controls, but that would basically require designing TWO good interfaces where most designers seem to have a hard time even putting together one good interface.

The easy way out would, of course, be to have one as the core system and the other as an optional, additional system. But that means that the optional system has to be warped and has to succumb to the needs of the main system. And frankly, I think it is easier to warp keyboard controls to work with a mouse-controlled game, than it is to warp mouse control to work with a keyboard controlled game. So, if that shortcut was chosen, I think it would be likely for the keyboard controls getting the short end of the stick. And this could eventually lead to incompleteness, meaning that you can't solely play with the optional controls, but need the core ones for certain aspects.

The negative consequences of this hybridity can already be seen a little bit in world gen. There is this map painting option, it seems, but as far as I understand it, it requires mouse control. Thus, it is not usable for me (especially since I turn off all mouse elements so as not to have the mouse cursor block the view).

Mind you, that fear is probably exaggerated, but that is just how I personally feel and why I am always wary when people talk about mouse control.

(I hope I remembered all the important points raised)

Deathworks

One think about mouse controll is that it provides much better user-feedback for user than shortcuts. You get to hover over button and and read tooltip for example. Game can highlight relevant infromation without user having to take specific action. It is more "physical" metaphor where player explores interface and learns gameplay.

Keyboard wins once you get past "familiarizing" with game ad when your gameplay becomes more mechanic: you know what to do and want fastest way to do it. In civilization, you eventually stop clicking "Build road" button and start pressing "r" for example.

Current game keyboard implementation does not allow much of exploring: you pretty much always need to know what you want to do.

There are some decent gui standarts that get ignored:

 * Lists need to be naivagle by arrows and selectable by enter. 'd'esignate and 'b'uild lists, most importnat ones lack this.
 * Possible 'commands' could use being able to be selected by tab and activated by enter. If you can focus on them, you can also display helpfull information about them that would be cluttering ui otherwise.

And as always, keyboard sortcut coordination, etc, etc, etc...

(Frankly, i would not exactly be considering world painter requiring mouse as bad. Drawing with keyboard is kind of not that great).

Deathworks

  • Bay Watcher
  • There be no fortress without its feline rulers!
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #73 on: May 11, 2010, 04:40:51 am »

Hi!

Well, the terminology is a bit tricky, but basically, user interface is about anything where the game gives you some information or you give the game some information. This is why I included the keyboard vs. mouse issue which is a central piece of the puzzle for me, while others point to the graphics issues.

It may have been a bit difficult to see through all the things I wanted to explain, but keyboard controls are really an essential part for me (without alternatives given that gamepad controls would necessarily turn into a nightmare of submenues to compensate the lack of input options), to the point that they determine what I want all the rest of the interface to be like. I don't want a mouse driven interface designed and streamlined for mouse controls with some keyboard shortcuts patched into it, but rather an interface that by its structure and workings responds mainly to the needs of keyboard controls and may suffer mouse controls as an option (I know, I am putting it harshly, but that is what my heart actually would tell me to favor).

With this in mind, I think it becomes obvious in what directions I would tend: Keyboard controls tend to work well with a comparatively shallow menu tree. Given that you have a lot of keys = input options available, using them instead of using submenues seems to be the reasonable approach. Thus, I don't think that a genuine menu reshuffling (which would necessitate the de-activation of universal key-bindings less it becomes meaningless) is really necessary, at least not in the direction of bundling the active commands. So, having building, designating, defining burrows, ... all those things that affect the game world on the map level as well as those that directly order things to happen on the top level and not structured in any way is what I would support (and which is what we have now).

However, I do agree that the passive or aspects like civs and artifacts could be moved below the status screen, thus making that the inactive block. But again, as long as we have keys free, that is not really a necessity in my opinion. Of course, reports and announcements are far too essential to go anywhere below the top level, given that those are really the ones you check out quite regularly.

So, about submenues, as I said before, my position is that they should be kept to a minimum. (Rereading your suggestions, I noticed that you also proposed moving the Depot Access to the depot itself, which I would consider a really, really bad idea - you want to see your depot access at different points across your fortress, rather than just near the depot, so having to select the depot to get that view sounds unnecessarily complicated).

While I support the inclusion of inverse as a marker for an active selection (that does really help a lot), I also do not see any problems with distinction. As I say below, the "main menu" display is actually just an "overview" in many ways, so I want it to be easy on the eyes. Using strong distinctions as you proposed may end up making it too aggressive. So, I would want it to be as quiet as it is now, simply as to not have it disrupt the visuals.

Currently, the overview takes up 1/3 of the screen if you go by the default display. While I can understand that you feel it is crowded, if you wanted to add more space to it, where do you take it from? In the current 1/3 1/3 1/3 format, both the game view and the map have just large enough space to be enjoyable. The game view can definitely not be reduced any further is some may argue that it is already to limited in the default. The map view might be reduced a little bit, but depending on the size of map the player prefers, even that is not guaranteed.

So, I think that unless you want to risk either making playing things more difficult by adding unnecessary sublevels or making the overview sheet possibly hard on the eyes and/or distracting, there is very little you can do to reduce the clutter in the overview sheet. Mind you, I am not totally opposed to visually cleaning it up a little bit (I consider that a minor change as I don't mean to change the overall screen layout and the controls are also not changed in my view), but I am afraid that more harm than good would be done by such an attempt.

As for your assessment about the "main menu" (which I prefer to call an "overview"), since it is something the game offers the player as information, I guess it is technically part of the user interface, but I agree that it does not have the same significance a pull-down menu has (which is already shown by the fact that you can remove it complete from the interface without suffering any ill consequences).

I think I have described my feelings to most of the relevant points, or is there something I should clarify.

By the way, I took the liberty of putting the link to your suggestion forum thread into the opening post (I hope you don't mind my humorous advice there :) :) ).

Deathworks

P.S.: (I really need to write these posts faster) Zwei: I think that is a bit of a difference in gamer type. I am quite happy to read the manual before playing, so - provided the documentation is up to par, which is an aspect I think none of us wants to delve into (^_^;; - I am not really that dependent on tool tips. Add to this that I expect a game to wait for me and not rush me, then the advantages of tool tips are not that strong for me.

But that is just my personal situation, and as I tried to express, I think there are aspects to this that are really very subjective (of course, an interface that simply does not allow you to do all the things you should be able to do, regardless of what you try, is probably shunned by all :) :) :) ).

EDIT: I forgot to mention, drawing with the mouse in the world painter is not disliked by me because of any sentiments towards painting with a mouse (sure beats joystick), but because it breaks up the consistency of the keyboard controls. Having to add an entire new input device just to use one feature of the game seems rather unfortunate to me.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 04:43:36 am by Deathworks »
Logged

Jiri Petru

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Am I the only one who likes the user interface
« Reply #74 on: May 11, 2010, 05:00:56 am »

Quote from: Deathworks
With this in mind, I think it becomes obvious in what directions I would tend: Keyboard controls tend to work well with a comparatively shallow menu tree. Given that you have a lot of keys = input options available, using them instead of using submenues seems to be the reasonable approach. Thus, I don't think that a genuine menu reshuffling (which would necessitate the de-activation of universal key-bindings less it becomes meaningless) is really necessary, at least not in the direction of bundling the active commands. So, having building, designating, defining burrows, ... all those things that affect the game world on the map level as well as those that directly order things to happen on the top level and not structured in any way is what I would support (and which is what we have now).

However, I do agree that the passive or aspects like civs and artifacts could be moved below the status screen, thus making that the inactive block. But again, as long as we have keys free, that is not really a necessity in my opinion. Of course, reports and announcements are far too essential to go anywhere below the top level, given that those are really the ones you check out quite regularly.

So, about submenues, as I said before, my position is that they should be kept to a minimum. (Rereading your suggestions, I noticed that you also proposed moving the Depot Access to the depot itself, which I would consider a really, really bad idea - you want to see your depot access at different points across your fortress, rather than just near the depot, so having to select the depot to get that view sounds unnecessarily complicated).

Bear in mind you don't have to show the tooltip on the screen to make the shortcut available. You can easily hide the depot access "button" or "tooltip" in the depot selection menu, while keeping the "D" shortcut functional. Funcionally, nothing would change, you would still press "D" to see depot access... if you remembered it and knew what you were doing. On the other hand, if you were a new user or simply forgot the shortcut and you were "exploring", you would have to click on the depot first to see the "Press D for depot acces" tooltip. As weird as it sounds, I think it actually helps the exploring players, because it (1) reduces the clutter of the "main menu" (overview) and makes it more useful, and (2) puts the depot function where a novice player would expect it - in the depot.

Thus, we made the game a little bit more friendly for new learners, while keeping all the functionality the same for the sake of skilled players.


EDIT: This feels like such an important lesson for Toady to learn: you can have shortcuts without showing all the tooltips! (Well, obviously you have to show them somewhere, but it can easily be done in submenus - like eg. in a web browser).

EDIT2: Also, trying to put all the shortcut tooltips on the screen at the same time is counterproductive. You can never beat the good ol' reference sheet printed on a paper, and the only thing you really accomplish is that you make the screen crowded.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 05:32:56 am by Jiri Petru »
Logged
Yours,
Markus Cz. Clasplashes
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8