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Author Topic: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.9  (Read 308882 times)

KippLeKipp

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.7
« Reply #630 on: August 20, 2014, 04:38:21 am »


Quote
In other news, there was a big DF release while I was on vacation regarding the new pole controls! That means I have to re-visit the problem of the temperature map, and maybe I can finally include the temperature map in PerfectWorldDF! Yay! I'll start working on that in my spare time.

Hopefully this means I can recreate my tropical savage island archipelago in DF and found dorven Manila. Yay, patriotism!
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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.7
« Reply #631 on: August 25, 2014, 10:18:26 am »

So, I'm getting ready to implement the temperature map, and I would like to discuss any temperature options people would like to have while I'm doing this.

My plan so far is to have several gradient options that can do the same things as vanilla DF as far as North and/or South poles, but at any angle. Also a radial gradient option for 'polar' type maps, similar to how the radial gradient works on the savagery map.

I also want to include an option to have altitude more strongly influence temperature, but there is some weirdness to this approach. The thing is, 'mountains' in DF are purely a function of altitude, whereas in the real world, it is a function of altitude change. In the real world, there are mountains that are quite large that do not have high altitude peaks (an example would be the Olympic mountains west of Seattle). In DF, such a thing is impossible. If altitude affects temperature, then you can't have things like jungle next to a mountain.

Another issue is that DF automatically does some altitude based temperature adjustment, but it is rather subtle. Anything I do would be in addition to what DF does. I wonder if I should leave altitude based temperatures alone.

Also, there will be the normal noise map with an adjustable weight.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on what the temperature map needs to do?

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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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nil

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.7
« Reply #632 on: August 31, 2014, 09:10:36 am »

Something to incorporate milder temps near bodies of water?

cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.7
« Reply #633 on: September 02, 2014, 08:40:33 am »

Something to incorporate milder temps near bodies of water?

I won't have time to do that this version, but I might be able to do it later. I also canceled the plans for altitude based temps to save some time. I'm not hugely in favor of Earth-like planetary weather systems in a fantasy game, although I know a lot of people like to add a bit more realism. As a workaround, there will be the option to paint temperatures as usual.
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #634 on: September 11, 2014, 03:27:11 pm »

I hereby present version 1.8! Finally we have a temperature map in PerfectWorldDF! Big thanks to ToadyOne for giving us the POLE:NONE option that made this possible. As this is a major update, keep an eye out for bugs that surely have been introduced. Make sure you set the Pole option to 'None', otherwise you will get a combination of PW's poles and DF's poles. Here are some examples of what can be done with the temperature map:

Here is the standard North and South pole, which is basically like the one that DF can do except that you can adjust the amounts of each temperature range.


As we are dealing with fantasy worlds, maybe there is no north or south! Maybe it's just cold and warm. You can decide.


Here is an example of a polar map. We are looking down at the North Pole in the center of the map. Can you take an adventurer to the North Pole? Probably.


Here you can see the cold northern lands giving way to warmer climes radiating south. You can almost see the curve of the Earth. Is that Earth? I don't know.


One thing that I discovered in my experiments is that you can't use the temperature map to make the world cold or hot enough to kill dwarves. As the numbers that you input approach the extremes, they have less effect on the actual temperature. The effective range of world painter values goes from about -30 to 140. Values outside of that range have almost no effect on temperature.

Here's the breakdown for sea level temperatures:
<-1 Freezing
0 thru 14 Cold
15 thru 49 Temperate
50 thru 74 Warm
75 thru 119 Hot
>120 Scorching
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 06:16:20 pm by cephalo »
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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Vattic

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #635 on: September 11, 2014, 06:04:17 pm »

Nice work as always. More temperature control was a long time coming.
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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #636 on: September 11, 2014, 06:17:29 pm »

Thanks Vattic!
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #637 on: September 13, 2014, 12:57:55 am »

I've been waiting for this for a loooong time. Thank you Vattic, and toady one!
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Vattic

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #638 on: September 13, 2014, 07:34:45 pm »

It's cephalo's work not mine, he was thanking me for my compliments.
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Ddynamo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #639 on: September 22, 2014, 06:05:00 pm »

Small thing but should the temperature gradient have a scroll bar, I can't see to create noise.

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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #640 on: September 22, 2014, 08:24:02 pm »

Small thing but should the temperature gradient have a scroll bar, I can't see to create noise.

Yep. I guess I missed that. Thanks for reporting it.
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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vjek

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #641 on: September 23, 2014, 12:36:19 pm »

You may already know this, cephalo, but the 'pole' settings determine whether or not you can go over/under temperature for things like cold damage and melting body fat, etc. 
Without them, as you've surmised, you can't exceed certain limits, but with the poles in play, you can romp in the danger zone.  Not sure if this is something you want to deal with, but it's a possible feature.
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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #642 on: September 23, 2014, 03:12:29 pm »

You may already know this, cephalo, but the 'pole' settings determine whether or not you can go over/under temperature for things like cold damage and melting body fat, etc. 
Without them, as you've surmised, you can't exceed certain limits, but with the poles in play, you can romp in the danger zone.  Not sure if this is something you want to deal with, but it's a possible feature.

Are you sure about this? In my testing I was unable to do this even when combining DF poles with PW poles. If it was possible before, that may have changed in 40.09. I was able to get colder and hotter in degrees Urist, but not to physically dangerous levels.
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

My latest forts:
Praisegems - Snarlingtool - Walledwar

vjek

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #643 on: September 23, 2014, 06:40:26 pm »

... Are you sure about this? In my testing I was unable to do this even when combining DF poles with PW poles. If it was possible before, that may have changed in 40.09. I was able to get colder and hotter in degrees Urist, but not to physically dangerous levels.
Yep, try this worldgen:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Embark on the southern edge of the map.  Everything on the surface will be dying/dead within the first season, possibly within the first month.  The surface temp should be 10113U at the far map edge with a worldgen world temp min/max of 140 and a single pole.  120 is 10099 and 100 is 10086.  Melting point of fat is 10078.

Similar results for cold, iirc, at -90 or below.
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cephalo

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Re: PerfectWorldDF world creator utility v.1.8 (Temperature Map Update!)
« Reply #644 on: September 24, 2014, 11:08:55 am »

Hmm, so what I'm getting from this, is that the actual generation parameters from the temperature map (the ones I turn off in PW when the temperature map is selected on the parameter tab) are not subject to the same limitations that the pre-set map data is. If for example, you set all the temperature data in PWDF to 140 (you can do this by putting the last temp slider to zero) and use a north pole, I don't think you will get fat melting temps at the bottom of the map. I could be wrong though, I thought I tested this but I may have made a mistake.

I'm super busy at work this week, if someone could test that for me it would be great.
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PerfectWorldDF World creator utility for Dwarf Fortress.

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