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Author Topic: Things that made you RRRRRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Trust-o-nomics Edition  (Read 2799636 times)

wierd

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31350 on: January 11, 2014, 12:44:24 am »

From my perspective, GTA isn't sexist per se-- it depicts gross stereotypes in gender roles.

The males in GTA are abusive whoremongering assholes (with an overdose of machismo so extreme, their brains are obiously being poisoned by the sheer excess of testosterone.)
The women are sex objects and or whores. (Often shown to be of inferior intelligence, though when compared with the men -see above- that's questionable that there can be any implication that the men are smarter.)

Both are equally unrepresentational of both respective genders.


« Last Edit: January 11, 2014, 12:50:02 am by wierd »
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Flying Dice

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31351 on: January 11, 2014, 12:53:21 am »

GTA is sexist on both sides of the coin--both the male and female characters often embody negative gender stereotypes. Part of that is satirical, but part of it isn't. That's just the negative portrayals of gender, too. Of course, that's a part of the experience that they're apparently trying to create, in which just about everyone is a horrible person and horribly offensive. Makes it easier to not feel bad when you bump them off, I suppose.  :-X
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Cake
Aurora on small monitors:
1. Game Parameters -> Reduced Height Windows.
2. Lock taskbar to the right side of your desktop.
3. Run Resize Enable

Ogdibus

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31352 on: January 11, 2014, 01:14:55 am »

The men have agency and the women are objects, I'm guessing.  I haven't played, but you all seem to be describing.
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Iceblaster

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31353 on: January 11, 2014, 01:22:56 am »

On the whole EA thing, I've never really bothered to pay attention anymore.

Sure, they diiid do some good with the humble origin bundle for charity, but as we all know, EA is kinda in need of new, less terrible management :P

wierd

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31354 on: January 11, 2014, 01:34:58 am »

The men have agency and the women are objects, I'm guessing.  I haven't played, but you all seem to be describing.

The men are portrayed as raging machismo headed felons.  The game *is* about stealing cars, afterall.

It glorifies reveling in being bad-- the car thieves are male; as is apt given the poisonous machismo stereotype. Women are accessories, pawns, and victims in the various missions general plot outlines of the titles in this series. As such, they take on the "clueless cum dumpster" stereotype more often than not, but in some noteworthy examples I have read about "raging bitch" and "filthy whore" also make appearances.

It presents a poisnous view of what is ideal-- especially for adolescent males-- concerning masculinity.  Namely, being an abusive, self-serving, and incouragable douche-bag asshole that treats women like things that are only there to get porked and to be looked at and or beaten--

This is where the big "sexist" thing comes in-- but that radically overlooks just how sexist the portrayal of the men is.  As a man, who does none of those things, I can't begin to describe the bile that churns up when I hear "all me are pigs", and how offensive I find such blatant idealizations of that .... disgusting... portrayal of my gender's identity.

I consider it every bit as degenerate and unacceptable as the portrayal it gives the women.
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Bauglir

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31355 on: January 11, 2014, 01:37:57 am »

I think the idea is also that you don't have to make one "better" than the other. Sexism just requires ascribing to the idea that sex is a sufficient determinant of the roles somebody will play in society, I think.
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In the days when Sussman was a novice, Minsky once came to him as he sat hacking at the PDP-6.
“What are you doing?”, asked Minsky. “I am training a randomly wired neural net to play Tic-Tac-Toe” Sussman replied. “Why is the net wired randomly?”, asked Minsky. “I do not want it to have any preconceptions of how to play”, Sussman said.
Minsky then shut his eyes. “Why do you close your eyes?”, Sussman asked his teacher.
“So that the room will be empty.”
At that moment, Sussman was enlightened.

wierd

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31356 on: January 11, 2014, 01:44:46 am »

In that capacity, it certainly is sexist with room to spare, and pegs the meter past 11.

I was approaching more from the standpoint of "portrays one sex more favorably than the other."
In that capacity, it isn't sexist per se-- both portrayals are equally reprehensible.
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mastahcheese

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31357 on: January 11, 2014, 01:48:32 am »

I'm surprised personally that anyone still takes that entire game company to be anything other than a joke by now.
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Might as well chalk it up to Pathos.
As this point we might as well invoke interpretive dance and call it a day.
The Derail Thread

wierd

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31358 on: January 11, 2014, 01:49:58 am »

EA games is like the dark lord sauron, and the gaming consumer demographic is like gollum.

Sauron makes the precious.

Gollum loves and hates the precious.

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Willfor

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31359 on: January 11, 2014, 01:50:39 am »

I, for one, prefer to tear down sexist jokes. So even if the entire company is a joke, it doesn't get them off the hook.
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In the wells of livestock vans with shells and garden sands /
Iron mixed with oxygen as per the laws of chemistry and chance /
A shape was roughly human, it was only roughly human /
Apparition eyes / Apparition eyes / Knock, apparition, knock / Eyes, apparition eyes /

Ogdibus

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31360 on: January 11, 2014, 02:04:15 am »

The men have agency and the women are objects, I'm guessing.  I haven't played, but you all seem to be describing.

The men are portrayed as raging machismo headed felons.  The game *is* about stealing cars, afterall.

It glorifies reveling in being bad-- the car thieves are male; as is apt given the poisonous machismo stereotype. Women are accessories, pawns, and victims in the various missions general plot outlines of the titles in this series. As such, they take on the "clueless cum dumpster" stereotype more often than not, but in some noteworthy examples I have read about "raging bitch" and "filthy whore" also make appearances.

It presents a poisnous view of what is ideal-- especially for adolescent males-- concerning masculinity.  Namely, being an abusive, self-serving, and incouragable douche-bag asshole that treats women like things that are only there to get porked and to be looked at and or beaten--

This is where the big "sexist" thing comes in-- but that radically overlooks just how sexist the portrayal of the men is.  As a man, who does none of those things, I can't begin to describe the bile that churns up when I hear "all me are pigs", and how offensive I find such blatant idealizations of that .... disgusting... portrayal of my gender's identity.

I consider it every bit as degenerate and unacceptable as the portrayal it gives the women.

I have to agree that it sets a terrible example to follow.  The sexist aspect that I was pointing out is more about appealing to a male audience through fantasies of power and sex.  It doesn't seem to offer this to a female audience, but again, what I know is second hand.  I could be way off the mark.

You raise a good point about the gender role of men and the negative stereotypes.  I think a lot of boys grow up thinking that they are supposed to be assholes.  They don't have many examples of responsible and gentle behavior to follow in the media.  I know that there is at least a small movement to counter this, but for the most part the problem is neglected.
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kaian-a-coel

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31361 on: January 11, 2014, 07:35:41 am »

EA games is like the dark lord sauron, and the gaming consumer demographic is like gollum.
Sauron makes the precious.
Gollum loves and hates the precious.
I'm so sigging this.
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EA games is like the dark lord sauron, and the gaming consumer demographic is like gollum.
Sauron makes the precious.
Gollum loves and hates the precious.
Full Sig

Caz

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31362 on: January 11, 2014, 08:43:17 am »

I think the idea is also that you don't have to make one "better" than the other. Sexism just requires ascribing to the idea that sex is a sufficient determinant of the roles somebody will play in society, I think.

'Being male shouldn't hamper my ability to birth children.' -_-
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Caz

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31363 on: January 11, 2014, 08:45:51 am »

The men have agency and the women are objects, I'm guessing.  I haven't played, but you all seem to be describing.

The men are portrayed as raging machismo headed felons.  The game *is* about stealing cars, afterall.

It glorifies reveling in being bad-- the car thieves are male; as is apt given the poisonous machismo stereotype. Women are accessories, pawns, and victims in the various missions general plot outlines of the titles in this series. As such, they take on the "clueless cum dumpster" stereotype more often than not, but in some noteworthy examples I have read about "raging bitch" and "filthy whore" also make appearances.

It presents a poisnous view of what is ideal-- especially for adolescent males-- concerning masculinity.  Namely, being an abusive, self-serving, and incouragable douche-bag asshole that treats women like things that are only there to get porked and to be looked at and or beaten--

This is where the big "sexist" thing comes in-- but that radically overlooks just how sexist the portrayal of the men is.  As a man, who does none of those things, I can't begin to describe the bile that churns up when I hear "all me are pigs", and how offensive I find such blatant idealizations of that .... disgusting... portrayal of my gender's identity.

I consider it every bit as degenerate and unacceptable as the portrayal it gives the women.

If people are using the protagonists of GTA (I assume that's what you're talking about) as rolemodels they've got bigger problems than the crappiness of GTA-rolemodels lol.
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MaximumZero

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Re: Things that made you RRRAAAAGGGGEEEE today: Sex-y Edition
« Reply #31364 on: January 11, 2014, 09:10:44 am »

The problem with GTA games is that idiots don't pay attention to what goes on in the games they give their children. GTA is meant for adults, who know that the characters are idiots and assholes, but it's commonly a babysitter for kids because they sit down and shut up when they're playing it. Now, I'm not saying that kids are going to go out stealing cars because of GTA, but they are going to learn attitudes toward the world and people somewhere, and those get ingrained quickly and deeply. Kids are notoriously bad at recognizing satire/parody, and are quick to idealize.

The characters in the game are supposed to be reprehensible, but the audience is supposed to know that and not idealize them.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2014, 09:55:10 am by MaximumZero »
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Holy crap, why did I not start watching One Punch Man earlier? This is the best thing.
probably figured an autobiography wouldn't be interesting
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