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Author Topic: So much blood...  (Read 9335 times)

ledgekindred

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So much blood...
« on: July 21, 2010, 09:09:16 am »

Dwarves will clean up blood from inside on smoothed walls and floors, but from what I've read, there's not much you can do about outside?  My "courtyard" outside the drawbridge is a blood-soaked battlefield and I'm surprised the dwarves can even slog through what must be several inches of congealed blood and mud.  It doesn't wash away during rain and obviously the dwarves don't clean it up.  I think there's a bug where blood tends to spread infinitely with water?  Is that still present in .10?  Is there anything I can do to clean up the gallons and gallons of blood outside my entrance so they stop tracking the stuff inside all over my nice clean hallway?
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I don't understand, though that is about right with anything DF related.
I just hope he dies the same death that all dwarfs deserve: liver disease.
The legend of Reg: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=65866.0
Atir Stigildegel, Legless Hero of Diamondrelic: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=83136.0

Sphalerite

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2010, 09:45:19 am »

Water spreads blood.  Dwarves try to clean the blood up, but get more blood on themselves and track it around and just make the problem worse.  Once the blood spill has reached a certain point it will grow unstoppably and paint your entire fortress with blood.

You can use the cleanmap tool in dfhack to remove all blood splatters on the map.  This doesn't remove blood on creatures, so your dwarves will continue to leave bloodstains until they manage to clean themselves off, and you may have to keep using cleanmap repeatedly until all the blood is gone.

Alternately, magma flooding seems to remove blood reliably.  I am seriously considering rigging up a mechanism to selectively seal off and magma-wash parts of my fortress.  This also disposes of those items of clothing dwarves claim and then never wear or put away.
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Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius --- and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction.

TanSerrai

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2010, 09:54:03 am »

An alternate method to prevent spreading of dirt: I dig a single tile line of channels (=ramps underneath) across chokepoints (entrances or whatever), then construct grates above that. This seems to stop dwarves from tracking mud, dirt and blood into my fortress. I have used this method in several areas within my fortress as well and most of it is now clean where before it looked...interesting. Note that grates do _not_ support other constructions, so you need to anchor each grate horizontally to something solid (wall, floor...)
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BlueFireLady

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2010, 09:57:30 am »

I remember reading about people who would do wash jobs with irrigation and their fortress, though this is dangerous. You can also do something similar with washing your Dwarves in a room with grates and hand pumping some water in. this water has to run for a while and it has to go OFF THE MAP, or it will just result in the spread of more blood and mud. It's not hopeless butit's very very hard to get rid of that blood. Also, there used to be a bug IDK is it's still around that blood would not go over bridges. So you would surround your slaughter house with bridges.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2010, 09:59:16 am by BlueFireLady »
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Sphalerite

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2010, 10:05:24 am »

In my current fortress I have a meeting hall that doubles as the grand bathing chamber.  The floor of the hall is almost entirely made up of grates over a deep drainage tunnel.  Above the meeting hall is a reservoir which is filled by a river, when when full dumps its contents on everyone in the meeting room.  The dwarves get happy thoughts from the waterfall, gain swimming skill, and in theory get washed off.

The floor of this meeting room/bathing area is now a solid sheet of blood.  The fact that the floor is made of grates appears to do nothing whatsoever to prevent pools of blood from accumulating.  The water falling from above washes the blood off the dwarves, but does not wash it off the floor or the grates.  Instead, it spreads it around so that any contaminant brought to the bath by one dwarf gets inevitably spread around the entire bath.  Strangely, the water flowing out the drainage channel does not have a single speck of blood in it.  It's as if either the grates or just falling vertically causes water to lose contamination.

Dwarves come to the bath with blood on them.  They get hit by the water.  Rather than being washed away by the water flow, the blood spreads out in a pool and fills the bath.  Every dwarf in the bath picks up the blood, and as they leave track it all over the fortress.  This is exactly the opposite of what the bath was supposed to do.
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Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius --- and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction.

BlueFireLady

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2010, 10:13:40 am »

I haven't played in a while, in fact I can't even play rn cause I can't figure out how to get the stupid thing to stretch the screen res. I've done it with side grates going off the map. not bottom grates which  think have always pooled blood and you have to rinse them for a while as in there has to be a flow of water, not a reservoir dump.
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ECrownofFire

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2010, 10:37:41 am »

In my current fortress I have a meeting hall that doubles as the grand bathing chamber.  The floor of the hall is almost entirely made up of grates over a deep drainage tunnel.  Above the meeting hall is a reservoir which is filled by a river, when when full dumps its contents on everyone in the meeting room.  The dwarves get happy thoughts from the waterfall, gain swimming skill, and in theory get washed off.

The floor of this meeting room/bathing area is now a solid sheet of blood.  The fact that the floor is made of grates appears to do nothing whatsoever to prevent pools of blood from accumulating.  The water falling from above washes the blood off the dwarves, but does not wash it off the floor or the grates.  Instead, it spreads it around so that any contaminant brought to the bath by one dwarf gets inevitably spread around the entire bath.  Strangely, the water flowing out the drainage channel does not have a single speck of blood in it.  It's as if either the grates or just falling vertically causes water to lose contamination.

Dwarves come to the bath with blood on them.  They get hit by the water.  Rather than being washed away by the water flow, the blood spreads out in a pool and fills the bath.  Every dwarf in the bath picks up the blood, and as they leave track it all over the fortress.  This is exactly the opposite of what the bath was supposed to do.
That is going to be very fun with contaminants from FBs.
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ledgekindred

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2010, 10:51:13 am »

The drawbridges are also coated in a thick layer of congealed filth, but the dwarves do at least clean it off the walls and floors inside the fortress.  I don't know if this is something that's been fixed in one of the recent .31 releases, but on the occasions where invaders have gotten into my fortress and my traps and military have turned the hallway into an abattoir, it doesn't take all that long for it to get cleaned up.  At least on the inside.  And they DO seem to be successfully washing themselves off at the well.  I've seen "Cleaning Self" status on occasion.  Presumably since I have a good well and successful soap making line it's working as it should be?  And the well is surrounded by smooth floor so either the "washing self in well covers the area in blood" bug has been fixed, or the other dwarves clean it up before it gets to be a problem.

It's not really a problem exactly, it's just that I'm kind of tired of seeing all my outdoor farms getting coated in blood, and any time a dwarf goes outside, he gets coated in blood too.  And pets don't clean themselves so all my war and hunting dogs are coated in so much blood and gore I'm surprised they can even move any more. 

I'll try the grate thing.  Maybe I can surround my farming area with grates and that way at least the farm plots won't get coated.  Otherwise I do have magma tunnels set up to flood into any part of the "airlock" system of multiple drawbridges I have in place...

Of course once Toady gets decomposition in the game, getting your farms coated with a 6" deep layer of filth will be a good thing as it gets broken down and turned into fertilizer!

And clouds and clouds of miasma.
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I don't understand, though that is about right with anything DF related.
I just hope he dies the same death that all dwarfs deserve: liver disease.
The legend of Reg: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=65866.0
Atir Stigildegel, Legless Hero of Diamondrelic: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=83136.0

Hokan

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2010, 03:23:29 pm »

*looks at thread title*
......
Who touched Sasha?
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Only in Dwarf Fortress is the value of life placed as "aesthetic."

clc02

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2010, 04:31:40 pm »

Also happens to me, only thing that makes it bearable is dfhack, use the cleanmap or whatever and it removes all blood, vomit, pus, ichor, what have you, and leave the precious mud behind ;)
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Only in dwarven culture is alcohol poisoning a death worthed investigating, while being impaled through several toes, a eye, and a thumb from a spiraling water[3] is not.  Because everyone knows, the only way a dwarf could get alcohol poisoning is if someone put poison into the alcohol.

Niveras

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2010, 06:27:54 pm »

I have a similar issue in my current fort. After cleaning out the spoiler, one of the clowns had dangerous blood that's now been tracked outside and is covering my entire entrance area in addition to a great deal of my constructed roads. Luckily the blood is mild and only causes some blistering of bone that eventually goes away, but keeping the dwarves clean is a nightmare (dwarves spam clean self: area inaccessible when they try to use soap, and only clean themselves at the well after attempting to use the soap that's become forbidden), and the injuries by the blistering cause cancellation spam by haulers.

It is somewhat annoying that the issue could be worked around in two ways: either a method to direct cleaning, including cleaning things aboveground (especially constructions above ground), or dwarves equipping their clothing properly so they don't become infected by contaminants (nearly all my contaminations appear to be on their feet from walking through the killing zone). As it is my entire fort is naked, because their clothes have rotted away but they do not equip the new clothes they claim. I guess I could draft all the civilians and give them uniforms, perhaps then they would clothe themselves, but it is pretty excessive management for a fort of 120+ dwarves.

An interim but labor intensive solution is to build (or deconstruct) the tiles that are contaminated, though it means busy work hauling the trap components away and then rebuilding them, not to mention the road.

Guess I'll pick up DFHack to clean it for now.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2010, 07:32:03 pm by Niveras »
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ikacer

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2010, 10:49:47 pm »

The blood issue is far, far worse on a permanently frozen map. Check out this picture of the entrance to my fort after only a single year.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yea, thats all blood.
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KaelGotDwarves

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2010, 11:00:11 pm »

The blood issue is far, far worse better on a permanently frozen map. Check out this picture of the entrance to my fort after only a single year.

Yea, thats all blood.
Fixed.

ECrownofFire

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2010, 12:09:27 am »

That's just insane. How does ice make blood spread more?
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ikacer

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Re: So much blood...
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2010, 12:26:34 am »

That's just insane. How does ice make blood spread more?
I'm not sure but it seems to spread on snow easily. The section you can see in the screencap is just a fraction of it too. The whole map is covered in blood, it must be a sign from Armok. :)
« Last Edit: July 22, 2010, 12:30:27 am by ikacer »
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