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Author Topic: [0.44.12+] Fortress Defense Mod II R v21: Progress Trigger and Bug Fixes!  (Read 309319 times)

fearlesslittletoaster

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Complete save here: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12151

Fortress is happy, reasonably well stocked, and the lever in the dining room opens and closes the front doors. 
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darkflagrance

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Complete save here: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12151

Fortress is happy, reasonably well stocked, and the lever in the dining room opens and closes the front doors.

I'm sorry for the delay, but I can't get the save to work for some reason. I've tried loading it up in 42.06 and 43.02, but DF doesn't seem to locate it in the save folder.

I haven't been able to replicate tired mercenaries in my own forts.
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fearlesslittletoaster

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Huh. Well, all I did was zip it and rename it, but maybe I screwed something else up on this end. If you can't replecate the bug I'll start a new fort in the same world/biome and see if it comes back up. If I can't get it to happen in the new fort then there must be a puddle of forgotten beast goo somewhere that they keep stepping in.
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darkflagrance

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Huh. Well, all I did was zip it and rename it, but maybe I screwed something else up on this end. If you can't replecate the bug I'll start a new fort in the same world/biome and see if it comes back up. If I can't get it to happen in the new fort then there must be a puddle of forgotten beast goo somewhere that they keep stepping in.

If you can post the gamelog I can look through it to see if there were forgotten beasts mentioned - although dollars to dimes that txt file will be bigger than the save you previously uploaded.

I'm thinking of revamping the current version anyway to address the potential for full armor in the current version. No longer will War Elephants go into battle bare-trunked!

Gonna have some free time later this week that can hopefully be poured into modding/save hacking.
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The Legend of Tholtig Cryptbrain: 8000 dead elves and a cyclops

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YetAnotherLurker

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New discovery: Wagons can be spurred.

Currently 8th year of my latest fort, with a military composed almost entirely of mercenaries on account of being cut off from the mountainhome. Have yet to see a tired mercenary that failed to be restored by sleep. Almost certainly your issue is due to a long-term forgotten beast syndrome. Oh, and uh... did you rename it before or after you zipped it? Quite likely the renaming is what's causing it to fail to load; what was it originally called?

As for War Elephant trunks, can they wear a gauntlet on their trunk? Not sure how parts are defined in relation to armor, but seeing as Naga tails are valid for wearing a single boot...

Oh, and there are definitely some sprite position errors. As before though, too busy to want to spend my limited free time going crosseyed checking each one... I swear I'll get around to it eventually! For that matter, what happens if you define a sprite for a caste/profession that isn't defined for the creature/entity itself? For example, if you stick a line defining a sprite for a Tiger Blowgunner into the graphics raws, will it cause problems? If not, it'd probably be simpler and better to just rewrite the whole thing with an entry for each of the 26 weapons, in order, so it's easier to work with in the future.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2016, 02:58:06 am by YetAnotherLurker »
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darkflagrance

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New discovery: Wagons can be spurred.

Currently 8th year of my latest fort, with a military composed almost entirely of mercenaries on account of being cut off from the mountainhome. Have yet to see a tired mercenary that failed to be restored by sleep. Almost certainly your issue is due to a long-term forgotten beast syndrome. Oh, and uh... did you rename it before or after you zipped it? Quite likely the renaming is what's causing it to fail to load; what was it originally called?

As for War Elephant trunks, can they wear a gauntlet on their trunk? Not sure how parts are defined in relation to armor, but seeing as Naga tails are valid for wearing a single boot...

Oh, and there are definitely some sprite position errors. As before though, too busy to want to spend my limited free time going crosseyed checking each one... I swear I'll get around to it eventually! For that matter, what happens if you define a sprite for a caste/profession that isn't defined for the creature/entity itself? For example, if you stick a line defining a sprite for a Tiger Blowgunner into the graphics raws, will it cause problems? If not, it'd probably be simpler and better to just rewrite the whole thing with an entry for each of the 26 weapons, in order, so it's easier to work with in the future.

War Elephants would indeed wear trunk gauntlets. I could define a sprite for a Tiger blowgunner - it would come up if the tiger was recruited by a civ with access to blow guns.

Whether or not I do sprites for all 26 weapons, I will still need to remap the current sprites as well. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.
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fearlesslittletoaster

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Hey Darkflagrance, only peripherally related to FD but this guy could use your help and I wanted to be sure you got the message. See this thread:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=158949.0

He wants to make a race of animal servant people, and I think your tigermen exactly fit the bill for what he's looking for. Right down to being butcherable delicious when cooked with some Quarry Bush leaves.   
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arbarbonif

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So I just had a fort wiped out by Pandashi in the first winter.  I had 18 dwarves (2 military that had been training for 2 months). They had 8 siegers.  They went through me like a lightsaber through butter.  I don't believe I gave them a wound.

I'm wondering if the triggers were changed. I thought setting a trigger to 0 turned it off, so looking at the raws suggests they shouldn't attack until I had 20 dwarves. You might want to dial that back a bit.
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YetAnotherLurker

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I've never had a FD race attack quite that early, except in the form of necromancers.

It's possible, even probable, you got hit by a worldgen army that was heading elsewhere and happened to cross your embark. Alternatively, bandit group? Not sure how those work. Pandashi are supposed to be tier 4 (late) siegers, after all.

I don't think spurring is working for siegers as it's meant to. The latest force of 80ish badgermen cavalry to attack my fortress dissolved into chaos when my crossbowmen shot a few horses from the gate tower. Ironically, this actually led to the attack being more successful than the previous two, as the now-panicked horses rushed my southern gate tunnel in an attempt to path through to the other side of the map, carrying their furious badgermen riders with them. Panicked horses run significantly faster than non-panicked ones, and quite a few managed to rush past my mustered military into my lever room (note to self: put levers further from gate tunnel) and prevent me from sealing the gates or dropping the tunnel floor. End result, lost a dozen candy-clad military dwarves and a handful of unfortunate civilians. Also had one injured horse leave a trail of blood some 300 units long along a winding path from my southern gateway, up 10 levels of stairs to my farming level, across my fields, back down another 20 levels to my forge level, back up to the entrance level, and 3/4 of the way out of my western tunnel before finally bleeding out. The rider escaped  >:(
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fearlesslittletoaster

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Allright, finally got a bit more data on the tired mercenary bug. Short version is it's badger man specific, but since they were the only mercs I got in the first fort I saw it I didn't notice. I have now replicated across three forts, and in every one badger man mercenaries never stop being tired. Tiger men, humans, and nagas behave normally. The following steps were taken to confirm this:

- All mercs were coddled in the back of the fort away from hostiles. My lazy dwarven militant got to take care of business when it was required. 
- Mercs were assigned to mixed squads with arrival dates noted as control groups. Naga men who have been on hand longer than badgers are fine, badgers are tired.
- No forgotten beasts were interacted with at any time (minus a hairy shrimp that had no syndrome attack and was kinda in the way, but the dwarves handed that and they are fine).
- Bug is common to honey badger and greater badger men.

On an unrelated note, spurring by mercs for their non-war animals is not happening often enough to be combat relevant as mentioned above. On the other hand the resulting panic scatter by invaders can be more of an issue than if they behaved predictably, also as noted above. Got a squad cut up real bad when they got split into ones and twos chasing mounted badger men all over the map, and some of them got dogpiled by like fifty hostiles in the corners.
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YetAnotherLurker

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Badgers continue to refuse all medical treatment. Tigermen seem to be slightly better, but only slightly, in that I've actually seen them go to the hospital and occasionally even get sutured before walking off with their broken arms. I've got one mercenary count consort whose neck and left arm have been broken for nigh a decade, with no apparent ill effects. I think I may have to rig a few cave-ins to try and get them hospitalized.

I've also gone and rechecked all of my badger mercenaries across three 42.06 forts, and fearlesslittletoaster is right about them being Tired. My apologies for doubting you. Note that I've yet to see any of them progress past Tired after resting, but they also remain at Tired even immediately after waking up from sleeping in their own rooms (both manually assigned and tavern-assigned), in their own beds. I haven't seen anything to contradict FLT's observations so far.

Also, I got my first badgerman full citizen! A resident multiracial performance troupe (Goblin poet, Human lady consort, Badgerwoman dancer) petitioned for citizenship. Her left hand is smashed open and broken as the result of a weregecko attack though, and she's also refused all medical attention. I hope she doesn't die to an infection, I like my dancing badger. Undecided on whether I want her to remain a dancer, or put her in charge of an all-badger squad... Worth noting, she does not appear to be suffering from the same tiredness issue as the mercenary badgermen. I'll keep checking up on her and see if anything happens.

Oh, and the badgerman necromancer I captured years ago doesn't appear to be able to do any, well, necromancy. I can't recall if he did any raising of the dead during his actual attack, or if his pandashi companion did all the work. I'm not sure if I'm setting things up correctly though, as this is my first necromancer. Can all corpses be raised, or are there requirements as to things like freshness, race, etc? Can they raise the dead while chained or through fortifications, or do I need to set up a moat/pit arrangement?

EDIT: I finally got off my lazy ass and went through the graphics raws for all of dead's lovely sprites. Main issues seemed to be page dimension being off (26, not 25, this one doesn't start with 0), and at least one misassigned coordinate. I just went ahead and redid everything in the order they appear, and assigned the dagger sprite to thief. Here's a single file that contains all of them, with some renaming to make things a bit more clear for future editors as well. It should replace all of the graphics_dead_(X), though naturally you can split it up again, I just dislike the clutter.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 01:09:59 pm by YetAnotherLurker »
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darkflagrance

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Badgers continue to refuse all medical treatment. Tigermen seem to be slightly better, but only slightly, in that I've actually seen them go to the hospital and occasionally even get sutured before walking off with their broken arms. I've got one mercenary count consort whose neck and left arm have been broken for nigh a decade, with no apparent ill effects. I think I may have to rig a few cave-ins to try and get them hospitalized.

I've also gone and rechecked all of my badger mercenaries across three 42.06 forts, and fearlesslittletoaster is right about them being Tired. My apologies for doubting you. Note that I've yet to see any of them progress past Tired after resting, but they also remain at Tired even immediately after waking up from sleeping in their own rooms (both manually assigned and tavern-assigned), in their own beds. I haven't seen anything to contradict FLT's observations so far.

Also, I got my first badgerman full citizen! A resident multiracial performance troupe (Goblin poet, Human lady consort, Badgerwoman dancer) petitioned for citizenship. Her left hand is smashed open and broken as the result of a weregecko attack though, and she's also refused all medical attention. I hope she doesn't die to an infection, I like my dancing badger. Undecided on whether I want her to remain a dancer, or put her in charge of an all-badger squad... Worth noting, she does not appear to be suffering from the same tiredness issue as the mercenary badgermen. I'll keep checking up on her and see if anything happens.

Oh, and the badgerman necromancer I captured years ago doesn't appear to be able to do any, well, necromancy. I can't recall if he did any raising of the dead during his actual attack, or if his pandashi companion did all the work. I'm not sure if I'm setting things up correctly though, as this is my first necromancer. Can all corpses be raised, or are there requirements as to things like freshness, race, etc? Can they raise the dead while chained or through fortifications, or do I need to set up a moat/pit arrangement?

EDIT: I finally got off my lazy ass and went through the graphics raws for all of dead's lovely sprites. Main issues seemed to be page dimension being off (26, not 25, this one doesn't start with 0), and at least one misassigned coordinate. I just went ahead and redid everything in the order they appear, and assigned the dagger sprite to thief. Here's a single file that contains all of them, with some renaming to make things a bit more clear for future editors as well. It should replace all of the graphics_dead_(X), though naturally you can split it up again, I just dislike the clutter.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Thank you very much YetAnotherLurker! I have adapted your file into the next pending release (with credit).

I have actually never had the chance to SCIENCE on necromancers. I wonder if the Fortress Defense creatures need a tag to actually raise the dead?

If the dancer you mention does not get tired, perhaps the issue is an entity one rather than a creature one, which would explain why I have not been able to resolve the bug thus far. Also, I think the reason she was able to become a full citizen is because she was raised goblin/human, and could thus become a dancer, instead of just a merc if she stayed in the badger civ.

I'm not sure I've seen my own dwarves accept medical care if their bodies naturally healed to the point where they could move. If a red infection occurs, I think that will be inevitably fatal, but otherwise they can just truck through the injury. It may have to do with personality or ethics changes, given that it is creature unique but there are no unusual tags on badgermen compared to other races.



Your entertaining experiences with invaders who use unintentional guerilla tactics are why I have always hesitated to declare that behavior a bug. That said, if the spurring interaction is not always effective, maybe I can improve on it.

I'm still bugfixing without much success, which is why the next version of the mod has been a bit delayed so far. Right now I'm nerfing the Badgerman civilization's currently suicidally high stoicism, hard work, and perseverance ethics and hoping it makes them more willing to use beds.

Edit: If their ethics do cause their current desire to work themselves to exhaustion, I might preserve it as a "feature" resulting from hilarious procedurally generated interactions.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 10:32:13 pm by darkflagrance »
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fearlesslittletoaster

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Badger men do use beds, they just don't get anything out of it. All mine have been observed to sleep in beds in their assigned rooms, they just don't stop being tired after sleeping.

Now, the fact that they wait until they are distracted before so much as going to have a drink is a whole different ball of wax. Also, just because I'm curious, why can't mercs ever become citizens? I wasn't aware of that myself.
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YetAnotherLurker

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No need to credit me, you and dead have done all the real work. You're welcome though!

The Pandashi necromancer that attacked me in the second year was raising the dead left and right with no issues, so I doubt it's that. More likely it's something wrong with my setup for attempted undead training, or maybe something badger-specific. I'll fiddle with it later once my dorfs get done plugging the volcano and obsidianizing the magma sea around the delicious candy, and my FPS recovers.

I'd say the extreme reluctance to seek medical treatment for badgers can be classified as a racial feature, though with perhaps the addition of better natural healing rates to compensate a bit. It seems to fit their personality, anyway, to simply tough out any injury until it heals or doesn't on its own. The main issue is that currently, it seems as though they aren't healing at all, though they also aren't deteriorating unless they also have an infection. Note that this is all in 42.06, though. I like my DFHack/Gemset/TWBT too much to upgrade to 43.x just yet, the changes to healthcare in the latest versions probably will affect things.

I've since received a petition from a Honey Badgerwoman Scholar to join as a citizen as well, and I'm rechecking her and the dancer periodically. Have yet to see any sign of them being afflicted with the same perpetual tiredness as the mercenaries. Checking Legends shows that the dancer is in fact the child of two abductees, born in a Goblin civilization before leaving to join the performance troupe. However, the scholar was born in a badgerman civilization and only left to join my fortress. I'll see what happens if I toss them into a squad later, though.

Mercenaries never petitioning for citizenship is just the way it works, for whatever reason.

Visitors are predominantly badgermen and tigermen, but that's probably a function of my embark preferences and proximity. So far across 4 fortresses:
Badgers: Mercenaries, Scholars, Entertainer (Troupe member, goblin abductee).
Tigermen: Mercenaries, Scholars.
Pandashi: Mercenaries.
Nagas: Mercenaries, Scholars.
Ferric Elves: Mercenaries, Entertainers (Troupe members, unsure on entity)
Frogmen: Entertainer (Troupe members, unsure on entity)
War Elephants: Mercenaries.
Furies: Mercenaries.
I will note that of the mercenaries, Badgermen and Tigermen have been extremely common across all embarks. Pandashi and Naga appear somewhat less so, but that's likely more a function of embark location, as on two of the four I've gotten enough to fill a squad over the the course of a decade or two. I haven't checked in Legends, but I'd say these four races are sending out native mercenaries. The remaining races have been rare enough that they may have been converted abductees. May have to design a custom pocket world to test each race individually to be sure, but again, lazy.

Oh, and side note. Helmet Snake Women claim nestboxes and lay eggs that can be collected and cooked. Shame Nagas are extremely rare in my current fortress, I want to see if I can set up a breeding experiment.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 04:48:38 am by YetAnotherLurker »
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darkflagrance

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Re: [0.43.04] Fortress Defense Mod II R v19: Full Armor Carnage!
« Reply #1019 on: July 03, 2016, 07:10:34 am »

Since bugtesting is slow, I've uploaded a version with the currently available bugfixes for the new version with full armor.

I have not yet addressed spurring or badgerman resting, but these are relatively minor, if annoying and hard to pin down/get working right.

Oh, and side note. Helmet Snake Women claim nestboxes and lay eggs that can be collected and cooked. Shame Nagas are extremely rare in my current fortress, I want to see if I can set up a breeding experiment.

I attempted my own breeding experiments as well. Having an army of native non-dwarves that bred in large expendable numbers was quite attractive - but it seems the eggs need the presence of the layer's husband to hatch. I hope you experiments prove me wrong.
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