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Author Topic: [0.44.12+] Fortress Defense Mod II R v21: Progress Trigger and Bug Fixes!  (Read 217444 times)

darkflagrance

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #495 on: July 27, 2011, 07:32:12 pm »

One or two civs that are just huge numbers of (intelligent) small creatures would be cool, especially if small (but still dangerous) enough to be sent flying.

Planning to release the prototype of such a mod soon.

Need to work on syndromes so that creatures can be small but still deadly.
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jaxy15

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #496 on: July 30, 2011, 12:56:38 pm »

You should have carpmen and war elephantmen as tier 5 attackers.
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TerryDactyl

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #497 on: August 01, 2011, 09:08:51 pm »

I have noticed some peculiar behaviour on the the part of White Tigermen (et. al?): They're timid. There's two xbow traps in my entrance. They cause a few injuries, mostly to mounts and pull the entire siege to a standstill. My enemies don't take another step towards my fortress interior, preferring to just stand there with their feet in the door unless either lured by creatures or slaughtered by marksmen.

Is this... normal?

Neyvn

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #498 on: August 02, 2011, 12:53:49 am »

Um... So Stranglers and Beak Wolf Hunters..... Are they spos to be that cowardly...
Opened my gates to bait them in, and the Stranglers approached, my archers fired on one maiming it and the rest turn tail and ran, the maimed one getting out of range. The BWHs didn't move an inch. I then told my Archers to approach on foot, they took aim, shot one and maimed it, it ran back to the pack out of range, moved the Archers forward, they let loose at the pack and they turn tail and ran aswell... They even had one mounted on a Giant War Eagle who's name was Stun... The archers ended up cleaning up 2 of the ones they maimed but they were never threatened by them...
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darkflagrance

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #499 on: August 02, 2011, 03:49:05 am »

I have noticed some peculiar behaviour on the the part of White Tigermen (et. al?): They're timid. There's two xbow traps in my entrance. They cause a few injuries, mostly to mounts and pull the entire siege to a standstill. My enemies don't take another step towards my fortress interior, preferring to just stand there with their feet in the door unless either lured by creatures or slaughtered by marksmen.

Is this... normal?

This is a normal bug/feature of Dwarf Fortress; goblins also exhibit this behavior. In Dwarf Fortress, normal soldiers only follow their squad leader or attack nearby enemies. As a result, when their squad leader dies, they tend to stand around doing nothing. Since the squad leader usually goes first, he gets killed by traps, and then the other soldiers nearby stop moving because they don't have anyone to follow.

Um... So Stranglers and Beak Wolf Hunters..... Are they spos to be that cowardly...
Opened my gates to bait them in, and the Stranglers approached, my archers fired on one maiming it and the rest turn tail and ran, the maimed one getting out of range. The BWHs didn't move an inch. I then told my Archers to approach on foot, they took aim, shot one and maimed it, it ran back to the pack out of range, moved the Archers forward, they let loose at the pack and they turn tail and ran aswell... They even had one mounted on a Giant War Eagle who's name was Stun... The archers ended up cleaning up 2 of the ones they maimed but they were never threatened by them...

Both Stranglers and Beakwolves have FLEEQUICK, which causes them to flee quickly when they are losing a battle. This is because they are early attackers; this works balancewise to make sure they don't pose too much of a challenge if the player can kill a couple, as well as flavorwise, because as wild animals, they are cautious and prefer not to fight prey that can defend itself.

As for why the beakwolves stopped moving, in Dwarf Fortress, when a siege is spawned, if there is no path from the siege squads to the nearest meeting zone or meeting hall, often the squad ai will break and the squads will not move from their starting spot. They may remain still if no meeting zone is presented as an available target, and I have even encountered situations when, after the gates were shut for a prolonged period, siegers failed to budge after a meeting zone target was made available.

In any case, unarmored, weaponless beasts are not really capable of posing a threat to armored, ranged dwarven warriors; nor are they intended to, that being the duty of later enemies.
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Mickey Blue

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #500 on: August 07, 2011, 11:42:26 am »

Nightwings.. Wow.. A group of fourteen just killed my army of nearly fifty (armed with cobalt* and a mix of other weapons/armor and average training).

Just wow..

*Cobalt is a metal from Dig Deeper that is comparable with iron in terms of property but cannot be used to make steel.
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EddyP

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #501 on: August 07, 2011, 12:19:45 pm »


Both Stranglers and Beakwolves have FLEEQUICK, which causes them to flee quickly when they are losing a battle. This is because they are early attackers; this works balancewise to make sure they don't pose too much of a challenge if the player can kill a couple, as well as flavorwise, because as wild animals, they are cautious and prefer not to fight prey that can defend itself.


I find the fact that stranglers flee quickly annoying, given that they're basically free experience (which is very valuable in this mod). I had always assumed that their purpose was to help train dwarves up for frogmen and tigermen.
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Mickey Blue

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #502 on: August 07, 2011, 12:22:36 pm »

You can always trap them and kill them.  I sometimes allow them to get into my courtyard and then close the floodgates* locking them in while my dwarves finish them off.. Sort of a reversal of the normal use of my defenses to kill them all (particularly as early on you can butcher them for bones, leather, food, etc). 

*One of my general 'rules' is I don't 'wall myself in', the most I can do is use floodgates (which can be destroied by building destroyers and can also get 'stuck' on things above them and fail to raise).
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EddyP

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #503 on: August 07, 2011, 12:58:27 pm »

You can always trap them and kill them.  I sometimes allow them to get into my courtyard and then close the floodgates* locking them in while my dwarves finish them off.. Sort of a reversal of the normal use of my defenses to kill them all (particularly as early on you can butcher them for bones, leather, food, etc). 

*One of my general 'rules' is I don't 'wall myself in', the most I can do is use floodgates (which can be destroied by building destroyers and can also get 'stuck' on things above them and fail to raise).

Yeah, but it's not often I get stranglers by themselves. Right now they're outside with a group of frogmen, and I can't take on the one without taking on the other (and the frogmen squad utterly wipe out my 10-man militia even though they're fully clad in bronze. TBH Frogmen are my most feared enemy; send me nightwings anyday).
« Last Edit: August 07, 2011, 01:01:04 pm by EddyP »
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Mickey Blue

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #504 on: August 07, 2011, 11:14:31 pm »

I haven't found frogmen to be too horrible though I go big on my military with at minimum half my dwarves involved in it, though I guess it all depends on when they attack.  I also use a floodgate system on a lever so I can open and close it to try to split the group.

As for nightwings.. I guess like anything else its all about 'when they come' in terms of how prepared you are, but I hit them with an army of nearly fifty dwarves clad in mostly cobalt (and iron like stone in dig deeper) and the fourteen of them destroyed me, I'm not even certain I killed any.  I've never had a battle go so poorly, even against titans and forgotten beasts.
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EddyP

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #505 on: August 08, 2011, 03:41:15 am »

I haven't found frogmen to be too horrible though I go big on my military with at minimum half my dwarves involved in it, though I guess it all depends on when they attack.  I also use a floodgate system on a lever so I can open and close it to try to split the group.

As for nightwings.. I guess like anything else its all about 'when they come' in terms of how prepared you are, but I hit them with an army of nearly fifty dwarves clad in mostly cobalt (and iron like stone in dig deeper) and the fourteen of them destroyed me, I'm not even certain I killed any.  I've never had a battle go so poorly, even against titans and forgotten beasts.

20 good dwarves in steel/spoilermetal is enough for nightwings, I find.
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Falesh

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #506 on: August 08, 2011, 07:14:19 am »

I just had a painful experience. At 36 dwarfs and 289k wealth Ferric Elves just sieged me and killed my budding army and my desperation miners. Are the various enemies supposed to be able to attack before your dwarf numbers are up or was this a fluke?
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darkflagrance

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #507 on: August 08, 2011, 03:10:17 pm »

I just had a painful experience. At 36 dwarfs and 289k wealth Ferric Elves just sieged me and killed my budding army and my desperation miners. Are the various enemies supposed to be able to attack before your dwarf numbers are up or was this a fluke?

While population usually triggers invasions, if you build up an incredible amount of wealth/trade beforehand, you can cause enemies to attack you anyway. Unfortunately, enemies must always track population and at least one other variable (such as trade or wealth) as triggers for invasion, so this is effect is necessary.

In the future, make sure that your production is contributing to your military instead of producing tons of clothing or food.

Nightwings.. Wow.. A group of fourteen just killed my army of nearly fifty (armed with cobalt* and a mix of other weapons/armor and average training).

Just wow..

*Cobalt is a metal from Dig Deeper that is comparable with iron in terms of property but cannot be used to make steel.

That's why they're in the challenge mod :P You don't HAVE to play the Challenge version you know, that's why there are two packaged versions ;)
« Last Edit: August 09, 2011, 07:12:48 am by darkflagrance »
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Falesh

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #508 on: August 08, 2011, 03:39:10 pm »

Is 289k a lot of money then for that stage of the game? The only thing I made other then beds and cabinates and some sets of armour/weapons was an artifact millstone. :P
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darkflagrance

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Re: [0.31.25] Fortress Defense Mod II v8: Elven Avengers!
« Reply #509 on: August 08, 2011, 06:37:47 pm »

Is 289k a lot of money then for that stage of the game? The only thing I made other then beds and cabinates and some sets of armour/weapons was an artifact millstone. :P

I don't think the game tracks wealth over time; rather, it sends opponents at you when you reach a certain level of wealth. Probably 250,000 or so (the exact demarcations that the progress triggers for entities correspond to are still a matter of speculation among modders) is enough for Ferric elves to consider worthy targets.
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The Legend of Tholtig Cryptbrain: 8000 dead elves and a cyclops

Tired of going decades without goblin sieges? Try The Fortress Defense Mod
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