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Author Topic: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject  (Read 71489 times)

Dwarf

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2010, 04:45:06 pm »

OVER 9000?!
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Quote from: Akura
Now, if we could only mod Giant War Eagles to carry crossbows, we could do strafing runs on the elves who sold the eagles to us in the first place.

Xerillum

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2010, 08:07:17 pm »

Oh my god... That is the most win thing I have ever seen in DF
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Arkenstone

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2010, 10:29:54 pm »

Hm...  I've been wondering how hard it would be to code some solid-state transistors into DF -essentially have a 3x3 workshop where the center tile of each side serves as input/output.  If we could get toady to do something like ths (and it gave better FPS) how much do you think it would bulk your device?

PS:  lol, normaly solid state reduces bulk in exchange for decreased efficiency (more heat) but in this case it would be the other way around.
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Dwarven economics are still in the experimental stages. The humans have told them that they need to throw a lot of money around to get things going, but every time the dwarves try all they just end up with a bunch of coins lying all over the place.

The EPIC Dwarven Drinking Song of Many Names

Feel free to ask me any questions you have about logic/computing; I'm majoring in the topic.

truckman1

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2010, 11:14:30 pm »

I think the only true way to REALLY win dwarf fortress would be to make a dwarfputer capable of playing Dwarf Fortress. Or a Dwarfputer that's self-aware. But this is damn close
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Spoiler (click to show/hide)
That's the point, it wouldn't be as fun to crush their souls if they didn't have souls to begin with.

garfield751

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2010, 12:25:17 am »

this is simply amazing that you managed to achieve this much awesome in a 2x2 embark

vogonpoet

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #20 on: October 29, 2010, 05:03:34 am »

Awesome. As a keen ADOM herbalist - I love me some moss and some morgia - I have so been waiting for someone to do this, so that I might praise their name.

A Game of Life simulation running inside a simulation game. Holy Shit.
 
Sphalerite, like Quantum Sawdust and a few others before you, you have indeed won Dwarf Fortress.
Congrats.
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Everything I know about reality, I learned from Dwarf Fortress.

Kurouma

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #21 on: October 29, 2010, 06:15:23 am »

The first programming language to be written on a Dwarfputer will be called...drumroll...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Eugenitor

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #22 on: October 29, 2010, 06:16:47 am »

Holy shit.
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Jordrake

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #23 on: October 29, 2010, 07:01:00 am »

Next time my friend and I get into a Dwarf Fortress v Minecraft debate, I'm gonna drop this on him. And he will lose.
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Sphalerite

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2010, 07:46:44 am »

Hm...  I've been wondering how hard it would be to code some solid-state transistors into DF -essentially have a 3x3 workshop where the center tile of each side serves as input/output.  If we could get toady to do something like ths (and it gave better FPS) how much do you think it would bulk your device?
Interesting question.  It would probably make it a lot larger.  Each cell is performing some pretty complex logic, counting the number of cells which are 'alive' and pumping water if less than a certain number are.  To perform that with transistor logic I'd have to build some kind of 9-input binary adder, then subtract the threshold number from it and look for a carry.  The way mechanical power works in DF makes it really easy to perform the check the way I'm doing it, I wouldn't even attempted this project if I had to do it all with water logic gates.

Last night while running some test patterns I discovered that cells would sometimes fail to switch on if multiple other cells near them were changing state at the same time.  I traced this to some oddness in how DF handles flowing water.  It seems that falling and flowing water in DF is somewhat random, and I didn't leave enough time in the sequencing between when the second bridge closes and when the transfer gates open.  Pressure plates in some cells were being triggered before water had started transferring out of temporary storage cells, and under the right conditions this could cause the pumps to activate prematurely and pull enough water out of the temporary storage cell to cause the cell not to get enough water to become 'alive'.  I can fix this by adding another stage into the sequencer, making a full device cycle 707 steps long instead of 606.  Once that's done and tested I'll put up a map archive and save files.  I should be able to do that this weekend.
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Jong

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2010, 06:30:09 pm »

Well done! I was thinking of attempting this next, but looks like I was beaten to it :P

I think your 5x5x5 unit cell could be the smallest possible, which is great! I think it's a shame though that it needs to be built on the surface. Certainly waterwheels could be substituted with some minor modifications, which would make it significantly bigger.

Have you considered any less space efficient designs that don't use floodgates and bridges? Or that require fewer steps to run? Or fluid conserving designs? Since there are so many z-levels in every map now, space is rarely in short supply, so speedier designs could be more optimal. I believe water flows to be the biggest FPS hog, rather than items.

Silent_Thunder

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2010, 08:33:24 pm »

Oh god, I want this save. Or at least a video. Either way this needs to be shared in the name of !!science!!.

Sphalerite

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2010, 10:23:18 pm »

I think your 5x5x5 unit cell could be the smallest possible, which is great!

Actually, my original design sketches were for a 4X5X5 cell, one tile narrower than this design, but that design didn't have any provision for access stairs from below.  The dwarves would hace had to walk all the way to the side of the map and up stairs going around the array, then down from overhead walkways to work on it.  5X5X5 let me give each cell its own access stairway,  and also made drainage of excess water from the temporary register easier.

Quote
I think it's a shame though that it needs to be built on the surface. Certainly waterwheels could be substituted with some minor modifications, which would make it significantly bigger.

I considered a waterwheel-based design.  Waterwheels would have given me 60 more units of power in each cell, which would have required 12 more dummy load gears in each cell if I used the same type of mechanical logic.  Could have been done, but with a lot more parts required.  Ultimately I chose the simplest and easiest to build design.

Quote
Have you considered any less space efficient designs that don't use floodgates and bridges? Or that require fewer steps to run? Or fluid conserving designs? Since there are so many z-levels in every map now, space is rarely in short supply, so speedier designs could be more optimal. I believe water flows to be the biggest FPS hog, rather than items.

One thing I could do to speed the mechanism up is perform the overpopulation check and underpopulation check at the same time.  My design uses the same windmill/gear/pump assembly to perform both checks, with the bridges and mode switch gear reconfiguring the device between steps.  If both tests were performed at once the machine would run faster, but would take about twice the space and require about twice as many parts per cell.  I also considered a fluid-conserving design, where water was shunted back and forth between two storage cells to denote if a particular cell in the grid was 'alive' or 'dead'.  Again, this design was chosen for simplicity of construction.  In a 8X16 grid I have to build 128 individual cells, so making each cell as simple as possible was the most important design goal.

Just in the process of building this I came up with several ways the design could be improved, but this was such an insanely time-consuming megaproject to build that I'm not going to attempt anything similar anytime soon.
Oh god, I want this save. Or at least a video. Either way this needs to be shared in the name of !!science!!.
Soon.  A little bit of final testing, a few finishing touches to put on it, and I will upload a save, map archive, and movies.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2010, 08:42:54 am by Sphalerite »
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The Merchant Of Menace

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #28 on: October 30, 2010, 02:45:45 am »

Hehe, and then we shall all discover new evolution patterns and become famous.
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*Hugs*

lordnincompoop

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Re: Game of Life dwarfputing megaproject
« Reply #29 on: October 30, 2010, 02:48:22 am »

Dwarf Fortress (or at least Pong) in Dwarf Fortress feels close at hand now.
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