Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 8

Author Topic: I love duplicate raws.  (Read 16925 times)

OrbinDules

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2011, 11:32:08 pm »

I decided to see what happens when you duplicate raws myself.  I kept it simple and only duplicated a smaller one, and the results were... interesting.  Playable Goblins (other civs being Kobolds, Trolls, and Gremlins) who had pet vultures, ate olm men and women as fish, and could somehow make silk out of frozen cave fish ichor.  Pretty tame overall, from the sound of it.

That's odd, When I duplicated a few Raw Files, the world I generated was surprisingly similar. There had been no Humans, Elves, or Dwarves. Instead, we had Kobolds living in towns, Gremlins living in forest retreats, and Goblins living in mountain halls. The roles of Kobolds and Goblins were being played by Ogres and Trolls respectively. Fortress mode allowed you to play as Goblins, who could bring along pet vultures. If you embarked in a warm climate, one frame after embark, everyone would burst into flames. Sea monsters became megabeasts, and Dragons became normal creatures. In legends, there was a page about a Gremlin who married a Boogeyman, and had eight children. The gremlin was then eaten a year later by a Sea Monster who, after 250 years of world generation, had roughly 200 kills. That Sea Monster was an enemy of almost every civilization.
Logged
This fortress is turning into some kind of supervillain lair or something.
You do remember that you've been farming gigantic wingless dragon-fish for profit and Fun, right?

Itnetlolor

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
    • Steam ID
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #16 on: January 22, 2011, 11:34:37 pm »

Took a crack at it myself as well, and with equipment raws as the dupe. (creature_equipment - Copy.txt is the filename BTW)

First thing I noticed was that instead of dwarves, I have humans in control for embark. and immediately as I embarked, it changed into 'Age of Legends'. I'll investigate further into any other oddities. So far, mine's a bit mild.

EDIT:
Started up the original game I copied so I wouldn't overwrite it with dupe results, and also for comparison. Yep, human takeover was a result of the dupe.

EDIT EDIT:
Found a colony of Monarch Butterflies. Interesting...
« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 11:49:55 pm by Itnetlolor »
Logged

ninja137

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2011, 01:35:10 am »

So do I copy a folder, or a specific thing in the raws like one of the creature files?
Logged

SkyRender

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
    • Sky Render's Domain
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2011, 01:58:29 am »

So do I copy a folder, or a specific thing in the raws like one of the creature files?

 All you have to do is copy and paste a single text file found in the raw\objects\ folder to that same folder (resulting in a file ending in " - Copy").  For reference, the one I did was creature_fanciful.txt on 0.31.16, resulting in creature_fanciful - Copy.txt (which caused all sorts of fun little muck-ups).
Logged
Sanity is for the weak.

Urist Imiknorris

  • Bay Watcher
  • In the flesh, on the phone and in your account...
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2011, 02:01:46 am »

You could also duplicate a specific entry, such as having two [INORGANIC:GRANITE] entries.
Logged
Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Rover963

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2011, 05:30:37 am »

This is so weird. How does this work lol? I created a world and embarked as vermin that live in water. Everyone suffocated within seconds. My pet flys survived tho....
Logged

Kurouma

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2011, 06:43:25 am »

No dwarves or humans, embarked as elves. Who are at war with a gremlin civ, and had tame saltwater crocs. I don't understand, how could duplicate raws do anything except destroy the game in an utterly earth-shattering way? The raws I copied don't have anything to do with gremlins, or elves! I copied pants, smelter reactions, and annelid entries (worms)!?

EDIT: Also, we eat "wagon unknown frozen creature substance chops [5]" out of "unknown frozen plant substance" chests. Wat.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2011, 06:45:34 am by Kurouma »
Logged

Namfuak

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2011, 06:51:33 am »

I tried duplicating all raws, and my game exploded when I embarked.  Everything was just "rock" on the choose screen though, and no aquifers it seemed.  Also, some weird land tiles (like an ocean being called a swamp).

Then I tried just duplicating entity_default and dwarven language, and the only difference seemed to be a general lack of adjectives (so many things were just one name, like rivers named rage and newt) and that names seemed to make more sense.  For example, one god was called "Fair Neutrality," and was the god of balance.
Logged

Gergination

  • Bay Watcher
  • The world is on fire
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2011, 08:52:33 am »

I've toyed around with this before and gotten some stupidly silly results.

I'm wondering though if anybody can fancy a guess as to why this happens? 
Has Toady ever explained why duplicating a raw would throw the entire world into unmitigated chaos?

I would think that at worst you would have things 1 off from what they should be or potentially nothing at all, instead it's just utter chaos.
Logged
With [SLOW_LEARNER], dwarves probably don't sit around and talk anymore. They just stand in the same corner altogether, staring at each other, sticking their bearded lips out trying to make sounds. And giggling when someone actually says a whole word.

SkyRender

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
    • Sky Render's Domain
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #24 on: January 23, 2011, 03:47:57 pm »

I've toyed around with this before and gotten some stupidly silly results.

I'm wondering though if anybody can fancy a guess as to why this happens? 
Has Toady ever explained why duplicating a raw would throw the entire world into unmitigated chaos?

I would think that at worst you would have things 1 off from what they should be or potentially nothing at all, instead it's just utter chaos.

 The game's code is ludicrously complex as it is (hence why it can bring even a top-notch PC to its knees).  It doesn't surprise me that the engine goes bonkers as soon as you inject it with something identical to something else already in the definitions.  Really it's a testament to his error-handling code that the game will even run (albeit unstably) when given duplicate entries in the raws.
Logged
Sanity is for the weak.

Gergination

  • Bay Watcher
  • The world is on fire
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2011, 05:33:22 pm »

I hope he never does anything to remedy this particular oddity, because it is fun to just screw around and see what kind of madness you cooked up.
Logged
With [SLOW_LEARNER], dwarves probably don't sit around and talk anymore. They just stand in the same corner altogether, staring at each other, sticking their bearded lips out trying to make sounds. And giggling when someone actually says a whole word.

G-Flex

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2011, 05:37:26 pm »

Really it's a testament to his error-handling code that the game will even run (albeit unstably) when given duplicate entries in the raws.

If the game had error-handling code for situations like this, it would either abort or the duplicate entries wouldn't cause a problem in the first place. It shouldn't be so hard to have some kind of sanity-check to ensure that no duplicate entries get generated.

Why they mess the game up so much, I have no idea.
Logged
There are 2 types of people in the world: Those who understand hexadecimal, and those who don't.
Visit the #Bay12Games IRC channel on NewNet
== Human Renovation: My Deus Ex mod/fan patch (v1.30, updated 5/31/2012) ==

Encased in burning magma

  • Bay Watcher
  • Nekkid
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2011, 05:47:21 pm »

I hope he never does anything to remedy this particular oddity, because it is fun to just screw around and see what kind of madness you cooked up.

Same here.
Logged
[MILL_CHILD:ONLY_IF_GOOD_REASON]

Stoup

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2011, 10:31:06 pm »

By duping the large mountain creatures, I ended up with leading a small squad of Gremlin hunters as my embark crew.

They wore fire snake clothes.

What was funny was that it took them several moments to suddenly combust. I thought everything would be normal, when suddenly I see a blood spatter, and one of them bleeds to death.

EDIT: Got a sea serpent civilization, but unfortunately was unable to get a fully-water embark, and therefore they all suffocated.

Wonder if someone used that with embark now, if they couldn't have a sea-serpent fortress working perfectly well.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2011, 10:40:01 pm by Stoup »
Logged

612DwarfAvenue

  • Bay Watcher
  • Voice actor.
    • View Profile
    • TESnexus profile, has my voice acting portfolio.
Re: I love duplicate raws.
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2011, 10:49:14 pm »

I decided to see what happens when you duplicate raws myself.  I kept it simple and only duplicated a smaller one, and the results were... interesting.  Playable Goblins (other civs being Kobolds, Trolls, and Gremlins) who had pet vultures, ate olm men and women as fish, and could somehow make silk out of frozen cave fish ichor.  Pretty tame overall, from the sound of it.

That's odd, When I duplicated a few Raw Files, the world I generated was surprisingly similar. There had been no Humans, Elves, or Dwarves. Instead, we had Kobolds living in towns, Gremlins living in forest retreats, and Goblins living in mountain halls. The roles of Kobolds and Goblins were being played by Ogres and Trolls respectively. Fortress mode allowed you to play as Goblins, who could bring along pet vultures. If you embarked in a warm climate, one frame after embark, everyone would burst into flames. Sea monsters became megabeasts, and Dragons became normal creatures. In legends, there was a page about a Gremlin who married a Boogeyman, and had eight children. The gremlin was then eaten a year later by a Sea Monster who, after 250 years of world generation, had roughly 200 kills. That Sea Monster was an enemy of almost every civilization.

I swear, this sounds like something from Monty Python's Flying Circus or something...
Logged
My voice acting portfolio.
Centration. Similar to Spacestation 13, but in 3D and first-person. Sounds damn awesome.
NanoTrasen Exploratory Team: SS13 in DF.
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 8