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Author Topic: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem  (Read 16773 times)

GaelicVigil

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Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« on: February 21, 2011, 03:19:50 pm »

Warning: long review ahead

Background

Since I can first remember, I have always had a soft spot for old-school first-person computer role-playing games.  They seem to emulate the purest translation of the classic Dungeons and Dragons P&P system to the digital medium.  While roguelikes provide a quick and dirty run through a dungeon filled with loot and monsters galore, they come off as being a little too short-lived.  Most roguelike games last only a few minutes and are good for a play-through on your lunchbreak or while your sitting on an airplane.  Sometimes, however, you feel like playing something that holds your attention for just a little longer.

There have been plenty of games that spinned off the roguelike genre that forgoe permanent death such as Diablo, Torchlight and Din's Curse, but at times I feel like they come off as a little too "arcadey".  After a while these games begin to feel like all you are doing is clicking your mouse and grabbing an endless supply of color-coded loot.  The dungeon, although randomly generated, begins to feel all too familiar after a while.

Getting back to first person CRPGs, they seem to fall at the other end of the spectrum.  They become far too slow, monotonous, and time-consuming.  While I can appreciate their plodding sense of excitement, I yearn for something that holds the classic D&D feel, yet still gives me the excitement and freshness that a roguelike provides.  I want to experience a world with random generation, yet at the same time, I do not want a world that has no character or personality.  I want death to be punishing like Diablo, yet at the same time, not too punishing where I cannot play the same character again later.  After years of searching for a happy medium between these two genres, I've finally found something that fits the bill.

Demise: Rise of the Kutan is, in my opinion, the best first-person "old-school" style computer RPG ever made.  It is also probably the most underrated, misunderstood and one of the most obscure games in the genre.  This game deserves far more than it has been given credit for and, in my opinion, deserves a place among the classics such as Daggerfall, Bard's Tale, Might and Magic, Diablo, and others.

Demise can only be fully appreciated when viewed as a game that is far more than the sum of its parts.  When the game was released back in 1999, it got terrible reviews and, therefore, got little attention from the world at large.  The problem with most of the reviews, however, was that they dwelled on the superficial and failed to delve into the unique underlying intricacies that the game provided.  For example, while GameSpot's review is a fairly accurate assessment of the game's overarching theme (although I totally disagree with the "simplistic" label), it missed many of the things that made it so special.  Others criticized the game as the creation of a measly "American RPG fan" that should never have seen the light of day.  It turns out that the developer, David Allen would go on to create Alaganon and cement his name in history.  I'd like to take a few moments and review the game focusing on the things that, missed by the view of many, really make it a standout title.


World

An RPG's world is always an important part of a video game.  Unlike other genres, RPG worlds need to have some sense of realism, but also be dynamic enough to feel fresh.  In Demise, there is a single town and dungeon which is composed of around 30 levels of a hand-crafted dungeon.  Since it was created by hand, it means you will find places and things to see that are quite unique, that you wouldn't find in a randomized dungeon that most games of this nature employ.  While a non-random dungeon may sound like it would get boring fast, for a few key reasons, it really doesn't.

First of all, loot and monsters are still randomized, so although the rooms may look the same each time you visit them, the contents are not.  This keeps things interesting and fresh.  But the real brilliance of the dungeon design, and something not really appreciated until you've played through each level for several hours, lies in the way hidden passageways are revealed.  Via your initial ability scores, there is a chance of discovering hidden doors upon entering a room.  This means that with the right stats and a bit of luck, a familiar room may eventually reveal a passageway to an entirely new part of the dungeon for which you have never seen before.  This also means that having a thief or explorer in the party has some real benefit for exploration. 

Another perk about the dungeon is that the entire thing is one single instance, which means there are no loading screens.  Every time you descend a ladder or staircase, whether you've realized it or not, the monsters just got tougher and the loot just got better - it really pays to know where you're at if you don't want to get into trouble.  Setting the dungeon up this way provides for other interesting situations.  At times it is only possible to reach one part of the dungeon, only by descending first, passing through more difficult mobs, and then rising again.  The fact that there is no loading between levels means that your dungeon feels like a spaghetti bowl, and much more realistic.  Like the secret door mechanic I mentioned above, this is another aspect of the game that provides new content within locations you would have previously assumed were completely explored.

One critcism I've seen used against Demise is the fact that you will need to traverse the same areas to go back and forth between levels and to return to the town.  This argument is not entirely true as each character begins with a "town portal" spell, but only those with enough intelligence will be able to make use of it.  I actually appreciated this, because I think that "scrolls of town portal" in other games have become far too easy to find and have, therefore, dumbed down the game-play to a matter of "loot/portal" ad nauseam.  The fact that monster and loot spawns change, secret doors can be discovered, and dungeon levels are persistent opens up fresh avenues, making repetive journies far less so.

The town is rather ordinary and not rendered in 3D, however, it remains persistent as well.  So the loot sold back to the store will remain present for other players if connected in multiplayer.  The town also includes some unique locations as well, such as a monster jail where you can buy companions, a guild where you can multi-class, a "Seer" for help with quests, and a tavern where you can take a break with your friends.  Also interesting is the fact that the game forgoes a traditional "inn" to replenish your health. 

Instead, the game actually considers your visit to the town, in general, a time to replenish your wounds, and therefore ages your character accordingly.  I thought this was actually a nice convenience that is normally a time waster in other games.


Combat

Battle in Demise is fairly simplistic, especially if you're playing as a warrior-type.  In fact, it's so simplistic that you simply need to enter a room full of monsters and let the fight happen automatically.  At first I thought this was terrible short-sightedness on the part of the designer.  However, as I thought about it, was Diablo really any different?  At least in Demise, I can save my wrist from carpel-tunnel and won't need to replace my mouse after all of the endless clicking. 

The enjoyment you get from combat in Demise comes from preparation, and understanding when it's time to run for the town.  It also means that since combat takes a more hands-off approach, dungeon crawling in itself becomes less stressful and more leisurely.  Because of the very hands-off approach to dungeon crawling, I found that even my 4 year old was able to play very easily.

Interaction with the denizens of the dungeon can actually be quite interesting as well.  Depending on your Charisma modifier, some creatures will decide you are not a threat and will not attack, some will want to join you, and others may even talk to you. 

There are some aspects of the dungeon that hold static creatures, in a similar fashion to the creatures in Diablo - such as the Butcher or the Skeleton King.  These creatures are usually related to a guild quest and are tougher than the rest of the creatures.


Death

Demise is quite unique in the way it handles death and possibly one of the coolest aspects of the game.  Unlike most RPGs where dying means either reloading a save, re-rolling a character, or magically starting back at the town with a minor penalty (with no explanation on how you got there), death in Demise is a persistent event.  Whenever you die (and you will probably die quite often), your corpse will indefinately remain exactly where it fell.  If you turn the game off or re-roll a new character your character's remains will exist in your world permanently.  Now, from this point, you have a few different options. 

If playing in multiplayer, you can wait for another player come along and resurrect you, or, if they don't have a resurrect spell available, they can pick your body up and carry it back to the town and pay a fine at the morgue.  If you're not playing with someone else, you can load another character and go rescue your old body.  The third, and most costly option, is to simply have the town send out a search party to find and resurrect you.  Using this option, not only will you lose all of your gold (not loot thank goodness), but the time it takes for the search party to rescue you actually counts against your character's age, bringing you ever closer to your ultimate demise.

There are other means of restoring youth along the way, however, so one need not lose complete hope when you begin to age.


Stat Progression

Ultimately this is what this game is all about - character building.  While I'm a big fan of huge gaming worlds with great stories and deep dialog trees, when done right, a hack'n'slash game can be loads of fun.  And Demise has hit the ball out of the park in this regard.  Demise has a level limit of 999. Yes, you heard right: nine hundred and ninety nine.  You can play for a very, very long time.

Leveling in Demise moves along at quite a brisk pace, and can still be done with a single character (unlike most old CPRGs where a party is required).  The difficulty comes when trying to hold on to your cash.  As stated above, death comes often, and hanging onto your money is difficult which is required as a small payment to level.  There is a lot of freedom in how you decide to build your character.  You have access to join up with multiple guilds and specialize in areas that suit you best.

Demise has a very simple quest system built in.  Each class has it's own quest line and there are also random quests which mainly compose of item fetching, or slaying a boss.  While these aren't terribly interesting, they do spice things up from time to time.  Visiting the Seer will allow you to pay some gold to help you locate a particular monster or item if you're having trouble finding it.

There is no save-scumming in Demise.  Wherever you quit the game is where you will pick it up again later.


Multiplayer

This is where the game truly shines, and it's obvious that the game was initially designed to be played with real people.  The game actually ships with its own server software with which you can setup your own LAN parties, or broadcast your game online for others to join.  What is really neat about the server system is that all files relevant to your character are still stored and encrypted on your own hard drive.  So you can easily take a character from server to server and play with just about anyone without having to roll a new build each time.

Even though the world is persistent and works somewhat like a MMORPG, you can easily group into parties.  I was able to play over LAN with a friend and had a blast.  It's better to play with friends since they can bail you out if you get into trouble, or even carry your corpse back to the surface if you get killed.  I haven't had a chance to play on a public server yet, but I imagine that it would be pretty fun to run into other adventurers to trade with or get some


Graphics

Something ought to be said about the graphic and art-style as well, but mostly this comes down to a matter of taste.  I was a kid in the 80s, so I grew up with the classic era of fantasy.  Unlike today's RPGs where everything is "cute-ified", stylized and colorful, back then fantasy was dark, visceral and bordering on the occult.  This is the kind of fantasy I can relate to, and the games, movies and art held these images. 

The graphics in Demise epitomize this style very well, from the character portraits, to the races and classes, to the dungeon itself.  There is no hand-holding, no shiny interfaces, and no popups to help you out.  There's nothing to stand between you and the angry monsters who want to kill you.  This is raw dungeon crawling at its finest.

I won't lie, the 3D models themselves are about as nice as Everquest - which is not saying a lot.  I personally don't mind it, but coming to the game from a modern perspective can be a little daunting.  This is, unfortunately, why many people write it off as a bad game - don't let the graphics disguise the great game underneath.

The interface takes a little getting used to.  The layout is a bit awkward, but does the job fine.  Double-clicking the screen can remove some of the HUD for a better first-person experience as well.  Also the game can be completely keyboard driven, which means that there is little risk of having painful joints from using a mouse after a long play session.

Other nice details include the ability to upload your own character portrait, and disable blood (nice for the wife and kids).


Summary

At first glance it may not look like it, but if there is a single game I would compare Demise to, it would be Diablo.  You can't really beat Diablo's creepy atmosphere, but at times Demise introduces mechanics that work even better for this sort of game.

As I stated above about my criticism with graphical roguelikes (Diablo-likes), I get bored of the sheer crapload of random loot and the endless random dungeons.  At the same time, I get bored of the old CRPGS because of their slow pace.  Demise takes the best of both worlds and turns it into a very interesting hybrid that moves fast to keep you playing, but not too fast to keep you entertained.

A lot of people like to compare very addictive video games to the Skinner Box, something that Diablo was also famous for (*click,click,click,click*).  Demise is also one of those games that holds on and doesn't let go.  You'll find yourself wanting to explore "just one more room", and you'll sit down for a few minutes and the next thing you know, you've lost all track of time and have played for several hours.  I have never played an action RPG game since Diablo that balanced pacing so well.

Demise probably won't break anybody's top ten list, but I greatly believe that the game, for one reason or another, never got the credit that was owed to it.  It was released at a time when most had moved on from the first-person dungeon crawl, got very bad reviews, and received very little press.  I'd like to hope this can be changed and the game can receive the recognition it deserves.  Perhaps with a little more publicity, we could see this on GoG or another digital distribution site so more people can enjoy it.  I would love to see multiplayer servers running again.

If you'd like to play this gem of a game, you can purchase it here, or find it on eBay or elsewhere.  I was able to install this game just fine on Windows 7, but to play multiplayer, I had to run the game and the server software in Windows XP SP3 compatibility mode.
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getter77

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2011, 04:34:46 pm »

By my reckoning, I'm just too late to the party to jump in on the long standing version---when Ascension is, one would think, successfully released at some point this year that'll be my jumping in point.
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Grishnak

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2011, 05:43:04 pm »

You hit the nail right on the head with that review. This game is a hell of a lot better than the reviews gave it. I have seriously sunk hundreds of hours in this game alone, not to mention its predecessors.  I think I still have it floating around somewhere on my hard drives, if I can find it Im willing to play some multi-player with anyone that wants to play.  I generally roll a Giant and go mostly warrior/seeker because I love the exploration the most.

Which is probably the only thing you really left out of your review (well, barely touched on) and is also probably one of the best aspects of the game.  When you start off a new single player game, or when a server resets, ever single part of the map is covered in fog of war, so you have to explore the dungeon. I highly recommend playing single player first for this aspect alone. There is nothing like slowly trudging your way through a new level in the dungeon, not knowing what to expect, especially when you run into the Aboleths lair for the first time and just get absolutely rolled. The lairs are the only really REMOTELY static spawns. Certain monsters in the game will ONLY spawn in certain rooms on certain levels, known as lairs, and tend to have some of the best/most useful loot (Aards of Being come in to mind).

And correct me if Im wrong, but isnt Ascension going to be an MMO, and a family oriented one at that?

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GaelicVigil

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2011, 05:51:24 pm »

You hit the nail right on the head with that review. This game is a hell of a lot better than the reviews gave it. I have seriously sunk hundreds of hours in this game alone, not to mention its predecessors.  I think I still have it floating around somewhere on my hard drives, if I can find it Im willing to play some multi-player with anyone that wants to play.  I generally roll a Giant and go mostly warrior/seeker because I love the exploration the most.

It would be cool if someone could get a Bay12 persistent server running for anyone to connect to.  I'd be all over that.

Which is probably the only thing you really left out of your review (well, barely touched on) and is also probably one of the best aspects of the game.  When you start off a new single player game, or when a server resets, ever single part of the map is covered in fog of war, so you have to explore the dungeon. I highly recommend playing single player first for this aspect alone. There is nothing like slowly trudging your way through a new level in the dungeon, not knowing what to expect, especially when you run into the Aboleths lair for the first time and just get absolutely rolled. The lairs are the only really REMOTELY static spawns. Certain monsters in the game will ONLY spawn in certain rooms on certain levels, known as lairs, and tend to have some of the best/most useful loot (Aards of Being come in to mind).

You hit on something that I've been a little bit confused about.  When playing in multi-player, when someone explores the map, does it become uncovered for all players, or just for the player that uncovered it?  I thought it was the former, but maybe I'm mistaken.

Also, if a thief discovers a secret door does he discover it only for himself, just for his party, or for everyone playing on the server?

And correct me if Im wrong, but isnt Ascension going to be an MMO, and a family oriented one at that?

From what I've heard, it's just going to be basically the same game with a lot more enhancements.  I haven't heard whether or not the cap on players in multi-player would be rasied above 16.  http://www.decklinsdemise.com/help/HTML/note.htm
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Grishnak

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2011, 07:54:31 pm »

Thats right, Ancension is the expansion for Demise. They have been working on it for a really long time. I thought they already put out a beta for it.

As for exploration on multi player servers, if someone explores something, it explores it for the whole server. This includes types of floor tiles (extinguish, Stud, Secret Doors, etc..)  Imagine how it works for single player, and it works exactly the same way. Multi player is essentially the same as single player, except you can only run one char at a time.

Yeah, it would be nice for a persistent B12 game, but there should be resets every so often in my opinion. :)
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Nistenf

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2011, 08:15:01 pm »

Anyway to get this game?
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Hiiri

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2011, 08:22:59 pm »

Thats right, Ancension is the expansion for Demise. They have been working on it for a really long time. I thought they already put out a beta for it.

Ah yes.. Ascension.

I remember when their site said: "Ascension to be released in early 2007!" Yay!
In August of 2007 it changed to 2008... 2009... 2010... now I don't think the site is even up anymore.

Best just to consider it dead :)
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 08:26:22 pm by Hiiri »
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Soulwynd

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2011, 08:26:19 pm »

I used to play this online quite a bit. It was sort of fun, but also sort of almost like a progress quest.
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Grishnak

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2011, 09:30:34 pm »

Thats right, Ancension is the expansion for Demise. They have been working on it for a really long time. I thought they already put out a beta for it.

Ah yes.. Ascension.

I remember when their site said: "Ascension to be released in early 2007!" Yay!
In August of 2007 it changed to 2008... 2009... 2010... now I don't think the site is even up anymore.

Best just to consider it dead :)

Actually, apparently its in open beta! http://www.decklinsdemise.com/ right ther eon the home page.
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I'm a saint when it comes to pirating.  I've ripped and burned many a .iso, went .rar at my maties and sailed the .7z's.
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Sfon

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2011, 10:11:48 pm »

I played the Morder 2 open beta, the game which would eventually evolve into this, back in the day. The addition of 3D in late Mordor 2 and eventually Demise really took away a lot of the fun for me, so sadly I've had trouble getting into it.

I recommend checking out Mordor 1 and maybe the Mordor 2 beta, though sadly the latter is vaporware of sorts. Demise replaces one kind of charm with a very different one. M1/M2 feels much more classic, with simpler gameplay elements (no underwater etc) but more brutality. The dependence on your character's perception skills in M1/M2 as opposed to the detailed 3D view in Demise is very fun both in the normal and Dwarf Fortress sense. M1/M2 also do not have the long, boring rotator animations that Demise does.

Most people will probably like Demise better, though. It is easier to get into, looks much better, and the dungeon of Demise was completely redesigned to take advantage of the 3D to do neat things the M1/M2 system could not do.

Very nice to see a review like this, as I've hardly ever even heard it mentioned. The combination of many conveniences like the automap which is always viewable along with some very brutal gameplay elements give the series in general a sadly rare feel. A feel that is cruel yet smooth.

---Edit---
This is in essence a separate post, but to avoid double posting I'm just tacking it on.

This got me thinking about the series again, and I started playing Mordor 2 while I wait to see if I'll be able to reinstall Demise (DRM, sigh).

Though this is focused on Mordor 2, it's qualities are also mostly reflected in Mordor 1 and Demise. I played M2 when I was only around 15/16, and ever since then in western RPGs I'd felt robbed at the beginning. Everything felt too easy. You start with a rusty sword, but in a few minutes you are in shining noob-plate armor with spiffy noob-rating skills coming out your ears.

M1/M2/Demise is totally different, especially M1/M2. There is only one shop, and it only starts with some beginner items which will mostly be obsolete by dungeon Level 2. To fill it, you must find and sell stuff to it. No, I'm not talking about modern grindathon BS designed to appeal only to the most obsessive-compulsive person who must collect everything and cannot comprehend playing games for fun. Every little thing, from opening locked chests to just getting into a magic guild (class) to learn spells feels like a huge accomplishment. Even eventually upgrading to an iron sword feels like you've done something noteworthy. Every inch of every thing your characters have and even what they can buy in this game feels hard-earned. It is an incredible feeling to have clawed your way up from where you start, especially the very first time.

I've often thought of it in contrast to Diablo 1 and 2, because even though it is a different kind of RPG it gets right what the Diablos badly messed up. Diablo 1, for example, made you drop equipment on death. Equipment, often of the hard-to-find sort, is such a significant part of your character's power in it and Diablo 2 that this is highly frustrating. Diablo 2 solved this by wimping out in death penalties. In M2 it can be even harsher on death, and heck items can even be destroyed by lava (even if levitating!) or some enemy attacks. And yet it feels so much less frustrating. Your character's guild levels are the most significant thing, which allows the game to be both brutal and fun at the same time in a way the Diablos never could be.

(Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Diablo 1 and 2 were bad games. They did many things very well.)

Another difference from the Diablos is how easy it is to mess up a character in them. It is easier to mess one up in M2 than in many games, and yet is is so much more fair than in both Diablos and many games like them. There are a few basic character development pitfalls to avoid, which a newbie will likely fall into. But beyond those a semi-experienced player who has not seen half the game can plan out characters with nothing but the instruction manual's statistics of races and guilds. This is especially impossible in Diablo 2, where you need either a guide or to have tried that specific build before.

M2, and also M1 and Demise, are often mean without being frustrating. Requiring lots of effort, and yet not relying on the rewards alone to make the effort worthwhile as the effort itself is part of the fun. More and more video games seem to be taking the mmorpg element of only the rewards mattering. As if developers are asking themselves "Is this neat, does it fill our need for a certain role (death spell, warrior class, etc.), and will it keep the player busy?" and never stop to ask "But... is it fun?". M2 is not very shiny, or often even neat. It is raw fun of a sort when "hardcore gamer" still meant "liking it rough and fun", before it turned into meaning "goal-oriented with no concept of fun". It doesn't spoon-feed you things because it doesn't need to in order to get you hooked. Even wandering around the dungeon lost because you hit a teleporter is not only fun, but perhaps the most fun you will have in this or any RPG. In most RPGs it would be just an irritating, though perhaps neat, delay in achieving your next brief hit of "fun".
« Last Edit: February 23, 2011, 02:44:10 am by Sfon »
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MasonF

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2011, 02:33:05 am »

Ah, Demise.  I sunk at least 100 hours into it when it was Mordor 2, and a few into it when it was Demise, I even purchased the game.  (Not the CD version, just the download).  Unfortunately, I later "Upgraded" to windows vista, now it doesn't work anymore.  Apparently, only the Demise CD version works on vista, and Mordor 2 doesn't work at all, so I've been having huge withdrawals the last couple years, and I check the forums regularly.  The Project's cursed, and it misses release date after release date.  Apparently the game's "Finished" Now, and Decklin, the guy working on it, is just trying to fix some installer issue before mailing out the CDs, with downloads being available a couple weeks after, for some reason.
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Muz

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2011, 04:28:27 am »

Heh, I remember this. It was on the top of my list back then. I was a big Mordor and Mordor 2 fan. It was even the first forums that I signed up on. It introduced me to games like D&D and other fantasy ones.

I am looking back at it with some rose-tinted glasses, so I don't actually want to touch it, for fear it might be like Wizardry or Bard's Tale or Mortal Kombat which I once thought were the greatest games in the world.
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MasonF

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2011, 08:15:38 pm »


I am looking back at it with some rose-tinted glasses, so I don't actually want to touch it, for fear it might be like Wizardry or Bard's Tale or Mortal Kombat which I once thought were the greatest games in the world.

Nah, it's actually still a lot of fun.
Well.
As much fun as doing the same thing over and over again, just to increasingly larger extents CAN be.
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cganya

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2011, 01:01:23 am »

i would definitely be interested if someone started a server. i recently applauded this game's greatness. i remember manually mapping out the teleporters for the first 10 or so floors with a pen and a little booklet. some of those things were downright evil, dropping you into water nowhere near a way out of water. I remember one teleporter that puts you in a section of water with another teleporter nearby that simply leads to another underwater section deeper into the dungeon also not near access to air. diabolical!
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mendonca

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Re: Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan - A hidden gem
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2011, 07:54:26 am »

I played Mordor (shareware version down to level 3) for a hell of a lot.

I played Mordor 2 and never really got beyond level 3 on that anyway. I always wanted other members of my family to join in with their own characters so that when I logged back on my little Nomad could go and see if there were any goodies in the shop.

They never did ... I guess it's a bit of a niche game, eh.

And I distinctly recall finger muscle memory taking me to a certain spot at a whim, the movements you had to make to get to the Aboleth, for instance, on level 1.

First time round I just pretty much ignored this game (demise), probably because I could play the Mordor 2 beta and felt it would have been the same game.

And in fairness, I don't think I coud justify 35 dollars on it, but I would definitely go for it if it was a few bucks less.
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