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Author Topic: SALES Thread  (Read 837769 times)

Teneb

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15690 on: December 06, 2018, 06:32:57 pm »

I don't think paying for cosmetic skins is a bad thing.

This is what I've said before: current games are so expensive to produce that a standard $60 per box doesn't pay for development. They can increase the box price, however that would decrease sales, so that's a zero-sum game.

So ... having optional purchases means that the box price stays lower, but the game company has more revenue, which pays for both development and continuing after-market support, that would otherwise have to be covered in your box price. You're getting shit in the base game that's paid for on the expectation of how many additional skins they will sell after the game is launched.

It's easy to see that you're missing out on the skins as a result of not having the extra cash, but it's less easy to see the base content they would have cut if they hadn't been able to extrapolate how much revenue they could get from selling those skins to some players.

For example, if you engage with a customer support person for 2 hours for game you purchased, that costs the company $30 an hour, completely blowing the money they made selling you the game (in fact they probably only made $15 and the distribution+retailers made the rest). Modern gamers expect that their money entitles them to customer support, but ... it's clearly not within budget to provide that level of support unless there are additional revenue streams.
They are expensive because of the fuckhuge PR budgets and an unhealthy fixation with the best graphics when it's not exactly necessary. And if you are in a business whose point is making games and you are not making enough money with them... then you are in the wrong fucking business.

And game prices HAVE gone up. Not only has there been inflation, meaning that those 60 dollars cost way more than they did 10 years ago, but there are: collectors editions. super colectors editions. deluxe editions. complete editions. ultimate editions. olympian editions. dlc. day one dlc that was cut from the main fucking game. season passes. microtransactions. and so on and so forth.

They are not complaining that they aren't making enough money. They are complaining that they are not making ALL OF THE MONEY, thus enabling an unfeasable perpetual growth of their investors' shares.
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Reelya

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15691 on: December 06, 2018, 06:56:11 pm »

Quote
They are expensive because of the fuckhuge PR budgets

They have huge PR budgets because that's how people hear about your game, and thus buy it. The end result is that you get more game for your $60 rather than less.

If they spend $10 million on promotion it's so that they can count on $20 million extra revenue. So, they're only going to spend extra on promotion as long as it increases sales revenue faster than it increases costs. The end result, is that total cost per copy is reduced. And when they're initially budgeting the game, they take the increased revenue that marketing gives them into account. It's not an either-or situation. Development costs * marketing costs = profits. So, a big marketing budget gives them the leeway to make a big game. Take away the marketing, and then expect sales crash and they slash the development budget to compensate.

If you're not happy with that, buy indie games only, but don't complain about what they have to do to make games like GTA V viable.


And game prices HAVE gone up. Not only has there been inflation, meaning that those 60 dollars cost way more than they did 10 years ago

Uh, what? That's like the exact opposite of how inflation works. Hourly wages rise over time. Prices rise over time. If an item still costs $60 now and did 10 years ago, that's a price drop in inflation-adjusted terms.

Quote
collectors editions. super colectors editions. deluxe editions. complete editions. ultimate editions. olympian editions. dlc

Yeah, just buy the regular edition then. People who pitch in extra for those silly collectors versions are in fact subsidizing things so that the base price doesn't have to rise in line with inflation.

As for making money hand over fist: studios and publishers go broke all the time. THQ for example went broke in 2014. Telltale Games closing earlier this year, etc etc.

Even EA, their profit margin is only about 6% of their revenue. That's ... not actually very high in terms of different types of businesses. A slight reduction in profitability would be enough to send them into the red. If you knock off 3% of revenue on all their games then that would in fact halve their profits.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 07:17:05 pm by Reelya »
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Teneb

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15692 on: December 06, 2018, 07:09:25 pm »


And game prices HAVE gone up. Not only has there been inflation, meaning that those 60 dollars cost way more than they did 10 years ago

Uh, what? That's like the exact opposite of how inflation works.

Hourly wages rise over time. Prices rise over time. If an item still costs $60 now and did 10 years ago, that's a price drop in inflation-adjusted terms.
Haha, no. Wages stay the same, but are worth less so you have to spend more. Doubly so if you don't pay in dollars, since let me tell you prices? Totally gone up. Let me give you an example: four years ago, a AAA game was around R$100 in the steam store. Now? Anywhere from 150 to 250. Before such beauties like DLC, MTX, and so and so on.

Quote
collectors editions. super colectors editions. deluxe editions. complete editions. ultimate editions. olympian editions. dlc

Yeah, just buy the regular edition then. People who pitch in extra for those silly collectors versions are in fact subsidizing things so that the base price doesn't have to rise in line with inflation.

As for making money hand over fist: studios and publishers go broke all the time.

THQ for example went broke in 2014. Telltale Games closing earlier this year, etc etc.

Even EA, there profit margin is only about 6% of their revenue. That's ... not actually very high in terms of different types of businesses. A slight reduction in profitability would be enough to send them into the red.
They are going bankrupt because that money goes to pay executive bonuses, to butter up investors, to patent new and incredible ways to "turn players into payers" (from an actual ad for a monetization algorythm). Not to game development. They are not poor indies scrapping by.
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Reelya

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15693 on: December 06, 2018, 07:18:52 pm »

What games even cost $250?

I can see Just Cause IV on Steam for $90, but that's Australian dollars (so about $70 US), and the price of an AAA game here hasn't changed since the 1990s.

hector13

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15694 on: December 06, 2018, 07:22:11 pm »

He means 250... presumably Brazilian currency.

The price of a AAA game hasn't changed, but the delivery of said game most assuredly has. You had to press CDs and instruction manuals and cases and such prior to digital means of delivery.

Edit: oh hey I didn't see he already responded, that was silly. Edit2: never mind I'm just going mad thanks
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 07:25:29 pm by hector13 »
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Reelya

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15695 on: December 06, 2018, 07:23:06 pm »

They are going bankrupt because that money goes to pay executive bonuses, to butter up investors, to patent new and incredible ways to "turn players into payers" (from an actual ad for a monetization algorythm). Not to game development. They are not poor indies scrapping by.

No, they're not indies. However a 6% profit margin on all EAs titles is not like a huge margin or anything. If they switched to straight box-price packaging, then most current-gen games they make would not be viable. They could cut total revenue collection on every single game by at most 6% before they start to run into trouble.

As for the CEO of EA, he got $35 million, but that was almost all in stock value, not money from profits. Giving him shares in the company is a value-transfer from the existing stockholders to him, not from company profits to him. Shares and profits are completely different things. He got given all those shares because they recognize that he grew the value of the company so now he's a partner. It's not the same thing as plundering the company's cash reserves to pay bonuses whatsoever.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 07:43:24 pm by Reelya »
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AzyWng

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15696 on: December 07, 2018, 12:12:33 am »

Chrono.gg's site currently has American Truck Simulator for $4.99, down from $19.99.

That's a sale.

Something that belongs in the sales thread.

Debates as to whether it's ethical to include microtransactions in video games or whether people focusing on better graphics is a detriment to the budget-to-quality ratio of a game do not belong in the sales thread - though I do admit they interest me somewhat.

If the debates/arguments are going to continue, can we please put them in a different thread before the derail goes too, well, off the rails?

Gentlefish

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15697 on: December 07, 2018, 12:01:05 pm »

I'll blame the "ALL THE MONIES PLS" on the fact that businesses need to show quarterly growth or stockholders/investors jump ship on those publicly traded companies.

Not that it's an excuse. It's still super dumb. But it's more of a symptom than the cause.

But yes. Another thread, another time.

hector13

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15698 on: December 07, 2018, 02:15:52 pm »

I mean, y’all say another thread, but it’ll crop up again in a few months, maybe weeks since there’ll probably be Christmas stuff going on.
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Trolldefender99

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15699 on: December 07, 2018, 03:07:19 pm »

Fanatical https://www.fanatical.com/en/ has Warhammer 2 Total War on sale for 27 USD. And according to "Isthereanydeal" that is the lowest its ever been.
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Wiles

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15700 on: December 07, 2018, 05:16:12 pm »

Looks like they're going 5% less than previous sales elsewhere. They have the Tomb Kings DLC is on sale as well. It also looks to be slightly cheaper than I've seen it before (38% off as opposed to 33%). Vampire Coast is 15% off.
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Yoink

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15701 on: December 07, 2018, 08:34:11 pm »

Fanatical is doing a ridiculous bundle right now: https://www.fanatical.com/en/bundle/kingslayer-bundle

Kingslayer Bundle - Oxenfree, Styx: Shards of Darkness, STAR WARS - Knights of the Old Republic I and II, STAR WARS™ - The Force Unleashed, The Age of Decadence, THE KING OF FIGHTERS XIII, METAL SLUG X, SimCity™ 4 Deluxe, Shadowrun: Hong Kong ($4.99/97% off)
Wow, I kinda want to buy this just for Age of Decadence and Shadowrun.
Who knows if AoD would run on my laptop, though... it looks suspiciously purty. I guess I could always just hang onto it for whenever I get around to upgrading. Also, wow, SimCity 4, that'd be a blast from the past haha.   
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hector13

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15702 on: December 07, 2018, 09:05:51 pm »

I caved and bought it.

I guess having the two KotoR's is worth it for that. Also kinda wanted to play Shadowrun, and I guess SimCity... Metal Slug is always fun, though I don't really have a controller for it.
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Yoink

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15703 on: December 07, 2018, 09:16:02 pm »

Ummmm, looking more closely at that Fanatical bundle, judging by the 'bundle details' a bunch of the games are mac-only. ???
Is this true?! Hopefully I'm just misreading things 'cause that would be kinda shite.   
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hector13

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Re: SALES Thread
« Reply #15704 on: December 07, 2018, 09:50:17 pm »

Well I'm playing the allegedly Mac-only Sim City 4 on my Windows 10 PC so... hopefully I'm not in the process of summoning an eldritch being which will tear the world asunder in a horrifically misanthropic rage.
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