Topic: Black Powder Firearms (Read 104143 times)

Acperience · « **Reply #30 on:** May 31, 2011, 02:29:22 pm »

Quote from: omglazers on May 31, 2011, 02:10:02 pm

I think tonight I will cheat to speed up gun production and try and test out all the gun functions. I'd really like to try and help this mod get somewhere, because to be frank I like dwarves who are more industrious and steampunk-ish than high fantasy. So I'd love to see a mod that takes dwarves in an industrial direction.

The gnomes and goblins take offense.

omglazers · « **Reply #31 on:** May 31, 2011, 08:20:28 pm »

Quote from: Acperience on May 31, 2011, 02:29:22 pm

The gnomes and goblins take offense.

They got firearms too though!

Jake · « **Reply #32 on:** May 31, 2011, 09:11:50 pm »

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I'm currently on vacation and don't have access to my main PC, but I'll be coming out with an update that addresses at least some of your suggestions ASAP.

Acperience · « **Reply #33 on:** May 31, 2011, 11:33:22 pm »

Alright, suggestions time!

Gun making seems to take a massive amount fuel, so I created some magma powered workshops to make gunstones and guns.
When making guns, it seems any mechanism will work so I removed the metal mechanism crafting reactions from the gun forge.

HOWEVER, game gave me a
Fatal Error: Missing Reactions Definition, so I reverted everything back :/

A stack of 60 exceptional quality iron gunstones valued at 3000 urist gets turned into 120 "rock cartridges" valued at 480 urists.

Alternatecash · « **Reply #34 on:** June 02, 2011, 04:11:20 pm »

I've had trouble with the rock cartridges as well, with dorfs refusing to stockpile them at all.

Acperience · « **Reply #35 on:** June 03, 2011, 03:24:45 am »

Ok I got the magma versions to work.

Spoiler: Append to reaction_guns.txt (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Append to building_guns.txt (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Append to entity_default.txt for whatever race gets guns (click to show/hide)

The magma versions of the gun forge and ammunition mint will appear in the workshops menu after genning a new world and will work like other magma furnaces and not require fuel.

Quote from: Alternatecash on June 02, 2011, 04:11:20 pm

I've had trouble with the rock cartridges as well, with dorfs refusing to stockpile them at all.

At least the bullets show up in the ammunition menu in the military screen :/

Also, just wondering, why did you add making mechanism to the gun forge if normal forges can already make metal mechanisms?

Acperience · « **Reply #36 on:** June 04, 2011, 03:49:24 am »

Bullet hits eye........bruises it..........

A recent battle with a simple good quality iron rifle.
I made the cartridges with iron but they show up as "rock"

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

As you can see, a lot of light hits and glancing blows :/
At least my marksdwarf took 120 cartridges with him so ammunition wasn't a problem.
The fight ended after one shot bruised the strangler in the chest and gave him breathing problems. The strangler then promptly ran off the map and escaped.

My dwarf started with zero experience in archery and marksdwarfship ended up firing 35 rounds and gained enough exp to be just a smidge shy of Adequete in the ranged skills.

He was locked in melee about 90% of the time AND he had a shield with him.
He sustained no injuries. Was a proficient dodger and fighter, used the rifle the whole fight.

Acperience · « **Reply #37 on:** June 04, 2011, 07:52:19 am »

MOOOOOORE TESTING!

I did some tweaking and experimenting in the arena

Spoiler: Added Magma Versions of the Gun Forge and Ammo Mint (click to show/hide)

Pretty much the only thing I added there was a separate named version that needs magma

Spoiler: New Reactions to go with magma workshops (click to show/hide)

Here I also removed the need for fuel to make all airguns

Spoiler: Ammo tweaks (click to show/hide)

Bullets made of metals better for cutting fare better than heavy materials.
Ex Iron>Lead etc etc
Gun material only matters for melee, cutting metals are better.

In arena testing:

A proficient marksdwarf/archer with a steel rifle and lead bullets got killed by an elephant starting from 15 tiles
A grand master MD/A with a steel pistol and lead bullets killrf the elephant before it moved 10 tiles. 3 shots to incapacitate about 10 more to finish it off

A team of 10 gunmen with steel rifles/bullets vs a team of 10 crossbowmen with steel crossbows/bolts. 15 tiles apart. All proficient at ranged combat. Each dwarf had 11 ammunition.
-Riflemen won with 7 dead 2 moderately injured 1 heavily injured
-2 crossbowmen were killed in melee

A team of 20 gunmen with steel rifles/bullets vs a team of 20 crossbowmen with steel crossbows/bolts. 15 tiles apart. All proficient at ranged combat. Each dwarf had 11 ammunition.
-Riflemen won with 5 dead 3 lightly injured 6 moderately injured 6 heavily injured
-4 crossbowmen were killed in melee
-1 riflemen was killed in melee

Didn't seem to be any difference in firing speed.
Rifles and muskets CAN be used with a shield

Spoiler: Tweaked weapon properties (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: New permissions that need to be added to entity files (click to show/hide)

Jake · « **Reply #38 on:** June 04, 2011, 07:50:42 pm »

Much obliged, Acperience. If you don't mind, I'll add the magma forges and the tweaked ammo values to the next update. Pistols with daggers attached is historically accurate, at least according to the Valiant Book of Pirates, so I'll throw those in as a separate weapon to the ordinary pistol. Vaguely torn about bayonets for rifles though; it makes perfectly good logical sense but renders muskets a lot less useful.

Acperience · « **Reply #39 on:** June 04, 2011, 09:22:15 pm »

Quote from: Jake on June 04, 2011, 07:50:42 pm

Much obliged, Acperience. If you don't mind, I'll add the magma forges and the tweaked ammo values to the next update. Pistols with daggers attached is historically accurate, at least according to the Valiant Book of Pirates, so I'll throw those in as a separate weapon to the ordinary pistol. Vaguely torn about bayonets for rifles though; it makes perfectly good logical sense but renders muskets a lot less useful.

No problem, but I think the bayonets I added to the rifles were pretty crappy. Less than half the penetration value of muskets.

1 other thing is I'm not 100% sure I tagged the airrifles right. I don't know if a reaction can have 2 building tags. DF didn't give me an error, but I haven't tried building them in a new world yet.

Also on the rifles.
It seems in arena mode, dwarves won't equip a rifle with a shield, however in fort mode, they will equip both.
I think this is because in arena mode, the ammunition is held in the offhand whereas in fort mode, quivers take care of that.

eddyg86 · « **Reply #40 on:** June 05, 2011, 07:48:39 am »

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=74103.0
i released a similar w.i.p concept, we simplified everything however.

good job bud. i'll nitpick thru your job, see if you made any cool progress, my latest build, human city fort, has to have muskets. has to. if they aint got glaives and single steel plate chests, the guards gotta be on the foot in a feathered hat with a musket. and the captains all gotta have pistols. lol...

Jake · « **Reply #41 on:** June 05, 2011, 11:00:07 am »

Quote from: Acperience on June 04, 2011, 09:22:15 pm

It seems in arena mode, dwarves won't equip a rifle with a shield, however in fort mode, they will equip both.
I think this is because in arena mode, the ammunition is held in the offhand whereas in fort mode, quivers take care of that.

I think that's a bug on Toady's end, judging by the number of posts I've seen about dwarves carrying three swords and a shield at once etc. The rock bullets are probably an error in the reaction somewhere, though for the life of me I can't think where. I'll look it over, and if I can't find it I'll just make separate reactions for each metal.

Oh, by the way, when did metal mechanisms get reintroduced? I made this mod when I was still on .31.18.

Acperience · « **Reply #42 on:** June 05, 2011, 04:54:11 pm »

Quote from: Jake on June 05, 2011, 11:00:07 am

Quote from: Acperience on June 04, 2011, 09:22:15 pm
It seems in arena mode, dwarves won't equip a rifle with a shield, however in fort mode, they will equip both.
I think this is because in arena mode, the ammunition is held in the offhand whereas in fort mode, quivers take care of that.

I think that's a bug on Toady's end, judging by the number of posts I've seen about dwarves carrying three swords and a shield at once etc. The rock bullets are probably an error in the reaction somewhere, though for the life of me I can't think where. I'll look it over, and if I can't find it I'll just make separate reactions for each metal.

Oh, by the way, when did metal mechanisms get reintroduced? I made this mod when I was still on .31.18.

I think they've existed since I started playing in .31.15
I usually don't use metal for mechanisms so I don't know for sure.

Jake · « **Reply #43 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:33:38 pm »

Me neither. I never even noticed they were available!

Acperience · « **Reply #44 on:** June 23, 2011, 12:11:04 am »

I've been playing Dead Frontier more than DF lately

. Still keeping track of where this is headed though.

Maybe the future syndromes will allow for tranquilizer darts.

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Author Topic: Black Powder Firearms (Read 104143 times)

Acperience

Re: Black Powder Firearms

omglazers

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Jake

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Acperience

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Alternatecash

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Acperience

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Acperience

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Acperience

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Jake

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Acperience

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eddyg86

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Jake

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Acperience

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Jake

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Acperience

Re: Black Powder Firearms