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Author Topic: The Generic Computer Advice Thread  (Read 493739 times)

wierd

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4725 on: November 12, 2021, 06:44:42 am »

The cutoff for sdhc is 128gb, not 32gb.

If your junky 'tato-phone has a card slot, you can pop a 128gb card in.

It is my observation that lots of phones that claim they cant do sdhc, actually can.

Just try a larger module in the slot, and see if the phone can use it.

Edit--  GSM Arena says this phone has an SDHC slot. You should be able to jam a 128gb module in that thing. (larger than that is SDXC, my bad)

You might need to use either adopted storage, or root+apps2sd pro if you want to have more than 32gb of apps installed.  I had lots of mileage from the latter back in the day.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2021, 07:17:14 am by wierd »
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LordBaal

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4726 on: November 12, 2021, 07:24:56 am »

Custom roms?
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wierd

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4727 on: November 12, 2021, 08:23:05 am »

No, I mean

Some kind of root method (Magisk, SuperSu, et al..)

and an app called App2SD Pro


App2SD Pro is able to mount an EXT4 filesystem/partition on the sdcard, and then abuse features of the ext4 file system to redirect application data folders to that partition. This lets the stock OS *THINK* an application is living on the internal storage, when it is really living on the SD card.

Since only the root user can get unfettered access to the /data folder, (where app data gets stored), you need a root method to use it.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2021, 08:26:07 am by wierd »
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LordBaal

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4728 on: November 12, 2021, 08:37:58 am »

Oh no, I meant, if you can and exists, throw in a custom ROM, this way you can also squeeze a bit more of performance if the thing is filled with bloatware and skip the planed obsolescence for some popular apps. Dunno, never worked or had a phone of that brand.
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!

King Zultan

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4729 on: November 13, 2021, 04:03:55 am »

Edit--  GSM Arena says this phone has an SDHC slot. You should be able to jam a 512gb module in that thing.
Wait does that mean that the stuff saying the phone can't have an Micro SD card bigger than 32gig in it is a lie and I can put the biggest one in there and it work?


I'm less interested in putting apps on this thing, and more in putting loads of videos on the SD card so I can watch them when I away from home.
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methylatedspirit

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4730 on: November 13, 2021, 05:31:05 am »

The cutoff for sdhc is 128gb, not 32gb.

You probably know more than I do, but the SD Association itself says that SDHC supports only a max of 32 GB. That's what the standard says. Is there a source for your claim? I guess you could allow non-standard implementations, but the problem with allowing non-standard behavior is that you can't rely on them to work all the time on every device.

Wait does that mean that the stuff saying the phone can't have an Micro SD card bigger than 32gig in it is a lie and I can put the biggest one in there and it work?

I'll just answer the general case of "my phone's advertised as supporting a max of $SOME_SIZE cards, but the standard says I can put in $MAX_SUPPORTED_SIZE_FOR_STANDARD ones!". I'll hold the specific assertion here as wrong until proven otherwise, but the general idea is answerable.

Educated guess ahead: It's a matter of marketing. If you look at SDUC, it supports up to 128 TB, but (as of this writing) no-one's made them yet. Do you want to be the company saying things like "our phone supports 128 TB SD cards!"? It's technically correct, but any outsider hearing that would start asking "is $PHONE_COMPANY smoking crack again?"

...that, or "ooh, where can I find these 128 TB SD cards?", proceeds to buy a fake one off Wish, then blames $PHONE_COMPANY for the fake card once it loses the precious memories of their family or something.
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wierd

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4731 on: November 13, 2021, 06:12:15 am »

The cutoff for sdhc is 128gb, not 32gb.

You probably know more than I do, but the SD Association itself says that SDHC supports only a max of 32 GB. That's what the standard says. Is there a source for your claim? I guess you could allow non-standard implementations, but the problem with allowing non-standard behavior is that you can't rely on them to work all the time on every device.

Wait does that mean that the stuff saying the phone can't have an Micro SD card bigger than 32gig in it is a lie and I can put the biggest one in there and it work?

I'll just answer the general case of "my phone's advertised as supporting a max of $SOME_SIZE cards, but the standard says I can put in $MAX_SUPPORTED_SIZE_FOR_STANDARD ones!". I'll hold the specific assertion here as wrong until proven otherwise, but the general idea is answerable.

Educated guess ahead: It's a matter of marketing. If you look at SDUC, it supports up to 128 TB, but (as of this writing) no-one's made them yet. Do you want to be the company saying things like "our phone supports 128 TB SD cards!"? It's technically correct, but any outsider hearing that would start asking "is $PHONE_COMPANY smoking crack again?"

...that, or "ooh, where can I find these 128 TB SD cards?", proceeds to buy a fake one off Wish, then blames $PHONE_COMPANY for the fake card once it loses the precious memories of their family or something.

This is more an issue with FAT32 (or rather, Microsoft's hard cap of 32gb for FAT32), than the signalling technology.  Android runs on linux, and does not give a shit about the huge-fat implementations. It will happily format that card as fat32 with a huge-fat implementation.

See for instance, the exchange here.

I have used huge cards in phones from that era without any problems at all.  128gb card will likely live in there just fine, but I would be leery of putting bigger.

If the device supports adopted storage, it wont use FAT filesystem at all anyway, it will use an encrypted form of EXT4, which will work all the way out to the signalling limit of the SDHC spec, which is 128gb. 

Anything larger than 128gb must be supported by an SDXC controller, because it uses a different addressing technology.


The reason the SDCard association caps SDHC at 32gb, is because larger modules tend to have large erase-block sizes, and the cards wear out extra super fast if the wrong allocation unit size is used.  ExFAT allows cluster sizes that are astronomically large, which is what is really needed for large capacity SDcards. (Which is why the SDCard Assn switches gears abruptly and harshly at the 32gb boundary, and says "With ExFAT" for anything larger.)  It has nothing to do with the signalling tech underneath, it has to do with the typical memory granularity of the flash array being accessed, and how long the device is likely to service under heavy read-erase-modify cycles.

Microsoft limits the allocation unit size to 16kb, which translates to a maximum volume size of 32GB.  FAT32 actually allows you (within actual FAT32 specification) to specify a 32k cluster size, which can handle a volume up to 2TB.  This is what I mean by "Huge-Fat".  Linux FAT implementation does not bat an eye at 32k cluster for FAT.

The issue, is that super-duper large SDCards, use physical eras block sizes upwards of 1MB on really large capacity modules (sometimes larger than 4mb!!), and this leads to write amplification.  The SDCard Assn wants you to use ExFAT, so that you can set an extra super huge cluster size, that FAT32 does not support.

That is the real, nitty gritty, down and dirty on the subject.


Zultan's intended use case: "load it up with as many video files as possible" should not have serious issues with write amplification, since the files wont change after being written.  A 128gb card should work fine.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2021, 07:03:02 am by wierd »
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LordBaal

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4732 on: November 13, 2021, 07:41:47 am »

You could stick over 80 "light hd" full length movies on it.
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!

wierd

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4733 on: November 13, 2021, 07:43:19 am »

FAT32 has a 4gb max file size limit, be sure to consider this.
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LordBaal

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4734 on: November 13, 2021, 07:46:48 am »

Light hd generally results in 720p rips from 1 to 2 gb max in size for hour and a half ~ two hours videos. Nothing ever over 3 gb. Well, dunno if the lord of the rings extended movies would go up to 4gb...

It can look bad (but only if you are close) on extra big/super HD screens but on a phone screen it's like 4k.

Even on my old 42" lg dumb tv they looked fine!
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!

Starver

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4735 on: November 13, 2021, 08:44:36 am »

If you're just going to see them on a phone-res screen (that you know), then there are also good reasons for down-converting to that resolution in advance (saves space, saves real-time decision-making by the device, you can tweak the aspect ratio/letterboxing how it best works for you, maybe the device doesn't even have/efficiently support the originally-required codecs, etc). You can even do the same for the sound (at least remove 5.1ness, and any alternate dub/commentary tracks) but the video savings are going to outweigh all else (esp. unused/unusable subtitle streams) if visuals are at all part of the media file.

Obviously less of a bonus if you want to transfer them up again (phone2TV broadcast), or copy them onwards for others (having had full permission from the copyright owner for every stage of this, naturally) but for anything you want to cement as a specific personal portable solution it just takes a bit of (batch-?)conversion before you plug in the cable/media/WEP-code to transfer the results.

I've also been known to speed-convert things I want to watch/listen at 1.5x (considered important/desirable to view or hear, portably, but on a device I don't have my usual playback speed-altering ability upon), but you don't get size benefits if this is just forcing a new internally recognised sampling rate and of course it's a 'funny copy' (though tones of voices/music remain the same, the tempo can be distracting to others... So a set of earphones, or general privacy, is useful, if not already implemented!


A side-suggestion, from personal experience. No idea if it helps with the original issue but mentioning anyway.
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King Zultan

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4736 on: November 14, 2021, 04:21:43 am »

Zultan's intended use case: "load it up with as many video files as possible" should not have serious issues with write amplification, since the files wont change after being written.  A 128gb card should work fine.
Thank you for the info, now I just need to buy one.
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The Lawyer opens a briefcase. It's full of lemons, the justice fruit only lawyers may touch.
Make sure not to step on any errant blood stains before we find our LIFE EXTINGUSHER.
but anyway, if you'll excuse me, I need to commit sebbaku.
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methylatedspirit

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4737 on: November 18, 2021, 02:04:22 am »

If I buy a laptop from a seller that bundles Windows by default, and I tell them to omit Windows entirely:
a) Would they do this if I insisted?
b) Would they deduct anything from the cost, or would I still be paying the same price as the normal people who don't ask such absurd things as "I don't want Windows on this" to their salespeople?
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delphonso

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4738 on: November 18, 2021, 02:45:54 am »

There was literally a protest outside the Microsoft headquarters in the 90s about this.

I expect most distributors just receive whatever the manufacturer makes - who are almost certainly under contract with HP (for example), who likewise have a contract with Windows. I doubt they would if you insisted, as that would probably entail some modicum of risk on the distributor's part.

MSI, though, does produce good (expensive, but not over-priced) gaming laptops with Linux pre-installed. I believe you can also find a wide variety of budget laptops that come with either some Linux distro (usually Ubuntu) or that Chrome monstrosity.

Build-your-own is the best way to not pay for Windows. Certainly the folks here will flood you with far too much information on the subject, should you ask (as I plan to sometime next year)
« Last Edit: November 18, 2021, 07:21:18 am by delphonso »
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LordBaal

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Re: The Generic Computer Advice Thread
« Reply #4739 on: November 18, 2021, 07:19:50 am »

Most likely no, your pleas will fall for deaf ears as they are obliged to sell them like that or will nor care/know/want to format it for you, and even if they somehow did it, they will charge you the windows licence plus the formating probably.
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!
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