Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 ... 80 81 [82] 83 84 ... 155

Author Topic: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-36 Decisions, Decisions  (Read 331112 times)

Deep Waters

  • Bay Watcher
  • earth does break the things that we make
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1215 on: October 12, 2012, 08:44:45 pm »

Act like you're a paranoid schizophrenic if you have to- convince

Why would you ever want to do that?

Quote
maybe you'll be able to get out of this without making either an (involuntary) ally or an enemy out of her/him/it.
Making the other necromancers think we're crazy and irrational will make them want to kill us because we're a threat to their plans. Don't do that.

Two words: Curo Nightroar.
Logged
[23:14:34] <GameMaster> And so (...) a one-armed dwarf and a mage wearing a blanket walk into a tomb.
[23:14:42] <GameMaster> Sadly, that isn't a joke.

[20:42:03] <HailFire> our wizard tower just got smoked by projectile cats from space

Grek

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1216 on: October 12, 2012, 08:52:48 pm »

Curo is crazy in a "Rarr Kill Everything" sort of way, which works out alright if you're trying to recruit for the God of Death. Useful, even, if you need someone to go nuts and kill a whole country worth of people. A paranoid schizophrenic is very different from that - it means that you might suddenly decide to turn on Morka at any time if you get it into your head that one of the other necromancers is plotting against you.
Logged

Deep Waters

  • Bay Watcher
  • earth does break the things that we make
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1217 on: October 12, 2012, 08:56:23 pm »

Curo is crazy in a "Rarr Kill Everything" sort of way, which works out alright if you're trying to recruit for the God of Death. Useful, even, if you need someone to go nuts and kill a whole country worth of people. A paranoid schizophrenic is very different from that - it means that you might suddenly decide to turn on Morka at any time if you get it into your head that one of the other necromancers is plotting against you.

Curo doesn't sound like someone who'd be particularly loyal, and if we did so we'd turn to Morka. I'm fairly sure that a lot of young, amateur necromancers like us are paranoid, and we have plenty of reason to be. Also, I was exaggerating. Don't take everything I say literally. :P
Logged
[23:14:34] <GameMaster> And so (...) a one-armed dwarf and a mage wearing a blanket walk into a tomb.
[23:14:42] <GameMaster> Sadly, that isn't a joke.

[20:42:03] <HailFire> our wizard tower just got smoked by projectile cats from space

RAM

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1218 on: October 12, 2012, 09:36:15 pm »

So we can't say yes, and we can't say no either, it looks dangerous. We should find a way to at least remain neutral, I guess ? A "we have the same goals but different methods" kind of deal ? Any association is going to be bad for us in the long run, and while we're going to clash eventually, the later the better. We could try to "join them" only to back-stab them later, but we're supposed to be nice, I don't like that option. So ...
I would advise against stalling. We're in a dream, so it may not even work, and even if it did it would be needlessly antagonizing a powerful opponent, which is #7 on the Big List of Things Not To Do When Becoming a Powerful Wizard, right alongside "don't brag" and "don't cast spells that you don't know what they do".

We should say that A] We agree with their goal of making the world safe for necromancers, but B] we can't agree to be on the same side as someone like Curo Nightroar since his sort of necromancy is the sort that gives all necromancers their bad name, and C] because of that we're not saying where we are until something changes and we are willing to join.
Agreed, with a strong does of openly say that we are not willing to provide our current location.

P.S.
 Of course, pressuring us for a location is a great way to mask that they already know it...
Logged
Vote (1) for the Urist scale!
I shall be eternally happy. I shall be able to construct elf hunting giant mecha. Which can pour magma.
Urist has been forced to use a friend as fertilizer lately.
Read the First Post!

Felius

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1219 on: October 12, 2012, 10:17:14 pm »

So we can't say yes, and we can't say no either, it looks dangerous. We should find a way to at least remain neutral, I guess ? A "we have the same goals but different methods" kind of deal ? Any association is going to be bad for us in the long run, and while we're going to clash eventually, the later the better. We could try to "join them" only to back-stab them later, but we're supposed to be nice, I don't like that option. So ...
I would advise against stalling. We're in a dream, so it may not even work, and even if it did it would be needlessly antagonizing a powerful opponent, which is #7 on the Big List of Things Not To Do When Becoming a Powerful Wizard, right alongside "don't brag" and "don't cast spells that you don't know what they do".

We should say that A] We agree with their goal of making the world safe for necromancers, but B] we can't agree to be on the same side as someone like Curo Nightroar since his sort of necromancy is the sort that gives all necromancers their bad name, and C] because of that we're not saying where we are until something changes and we are willing to join.
Agreed, with a strong does of openly say that we are not willing to provide our current location.

P.S.
 Of course, pressuring us for a location is a great way to mask that they already know it...
Which is the reason we should act as if we know that they already know. Either they do know and drop the act or they don't and we discover more about their capabilities. Unless the rabbit hole goes deeper, and they act like they know we are acting we know they already know. Ehh, anyway, yeah, our best option is probably keep being a paranoid bastard either way. They are likely to respect that a bit, specially if necromancers are rare. Stupid and/or naive necromancers might end being a liability or at most a pawn. They can get pawns without needing other necromancers.

Also, I don't think they really expect us to go all "yeah, let's kill all our previous societies". If they aren't stupid, they will consider the possibility that we are still attached to our previous societies and should be willing to take the longer route of letting us getting disillusioned with it while pushing us relatively gently to their side along the way.
Logged
"Why? We're the Good Guys, aren't we?"
"Yes, but that rather hinges on doing certain things and not doing others." - Paraphrased from Discworld.

RAM

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1220 on: October 13, 2012, 12:38:03 am »

But why would we say that, what is our motive? If we just say it at random then it is obviously a ruse and they then know that we are into that sort of thing. Just openly say that we refuse to reveal our physical location at the present moment. It is relatively neutral, doesn't really reveal much about ourself, and gives them ample opportunity to share the lengths to which they are willing to go to coerce us on this matter. If they don't care and it was all a ruse to begin with, then we know that they are into that sort of thing. If they try to take control of our mind and force the information from us, then we have learned a lot about their abilities and haven't really worsened our situation. If they keep hounding us for it, then we know that either they have a reason to want it, such as a strategic coordination of their associates, or a desire to send flying monkeys to eat our eyes... If they just drop it, then they don't need us to tell them right now, for whatever reason... If they spin a yarn about needing to know where we are for some specific reason, then we can judge whether we trust them or not...
Logged
Vote (1) for the Urist scale!
I shall be eternally happy. I shall be able to construct elf hunting giant mecha. Which can pour magma.
Urist has been forced to use a friend as fertilizer lately.
Read the First Post!

Cellmonk

  • Bay Watcher
  • You might find it, whatever it is.
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1221 on: October 13, 2012, 12:57:19 am »

I think we should be careful about coming to conclusions about who we are talking to based on what form they appear. If the puppet master can weave the surroundings of the dream, couldn't it have woven an avatar most agreeable to our Nym, namely that of a female elf? Our ex is a female elf, though i remember not whether she is redheaded. If it knew enough about Nym to appear as a female elf, then we are in quite a bit of trouble, and should keep an alternating night watch with our friend. How does this entity project us into a dream? it may be that they, or one of their minions, are close at hand, and their question "where are you" is merely meant to mislead us.

This in mind, we should still stall on its questions. make it clear that you don't trust them as of yet, and need verification that you aren't being manipulated by a more sinister force (than an honest necromancer). Ask them who is this god of death, and ask them for more details of the history of necromancy. Don't act immediately disgusted by their proposals, rather act hesitant or disturbed. Time your false hints of cooperation appropriately for maximum uncertainty on their part.

If things get out of hand, like if they show a hint of gleaning more information than you consciously send through the dream channel, try to wake up.

Of course, this might just be a dream...
Logged

Grek

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1222 on: October 13, 2012, 02:20:00 am »

It appeared as a female human and then corrected to a male elf. I don't think she knows anything.

E: In fact, I think we're just generally discounting the idea that this is exactly what is seems to be - a necromancer with illusionary powers working for the Death God Morka seeking to recruit us to conquer the world. They are asking where we are because they don't know but want to find out. They are asking us to join them because they want another necromancer to join them. Even though things aren't always what they appear to be, that doesn't mean that they're never what they appear to be.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 02:33:09 am by Grek »
Logged

Felius

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1223 on: October 15, 2012, 01:51:40 pm »

* Felius pokes

Anyway, I think we can agree on at least being cautious e reserved, if not outright dismissing. At the very least we can see if can buy more time. 
Logged
"Why? We're the Good Guys, aren't we?"
"Yes, but that rather hinges on doing certain things and not doing others." - Paraphrased from Discworld.

Baneling

  • Bay Watcher
  • Acid Balloon
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1224 on: October 15, 2012, 03:45:25 pm »

I think Grek is right.

Just because the DM is often out to get you oh wait the DM is always out to get you never mind.

Just because you think they're out to get you doesn't mean they actually are. This may in fact just be a rather heavy-handed attempt to do exactly what they've said with a bit of a help from seductive shenanigans(turning to the most likely form for Nym to be attracted by).
Logged
I tend to be a stupid person. Expect me to say/do stupid things and we'll probably get along better!

GlyphGryph

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1225 on: October 15, 2012, 03:50:19 pm »

We have a few important things we need to ask before doing ANYTHING.

First:
They told us their name. They did not, in fact, tell us who they are. They know who we are - an elf maiden and fledgling necromancer. We do not know their identity. What ARE they? How are they here? And most specifically, why do they need us? Why couldn't this creature do this all himself? Fale Packunion... is that a dwarven name? (If we think it might be something else, say that instead, but it sounds dwarven to me)

Two:
Why do they need to know where we are? Even assuming we wish to work with them - something we do not yet know, since we have only the words of a dream avatar to go by - can we be sure the other necromancers won't see us as potential competition instead of a potential ally? Can we trust them not to reveal out location? Even if we are all working together to conquer the world, I doubt it will be so simple as us peacefully splitting it between ourselves. Revealing ourselves before securing our own safety from the others seems foolish.

Three:
Is there a way to communicate with the others? If there were, perhaps we could speak with them ourselves, and some of our worries could be put to rest. At the very least, we would prefer to know their stance on you - how do we know they've even agreed to the this alliance? Or won't stab it in the back at the first opportunity for personal gain?

Finally:
We will work with you and share your knowledge, for so long as it will benefit us mutually. We do not have enough information to make a lasting commitment - though we appreciate your cause, caution is warranted in such situations. If pressed, mention that we DO have some information that could be of use in exchange of a commitment, perhaps in the place of a commitment - the location of an artifact. (Don't actually reveal it, just see how he responds for now)

We need to strongly consider what turning him down outright will mean - not only a lack of knowledge as a result, but perhaps more importantly a lack of influence. The other necromancers, regardless of their behaviour, may end up being potential allies later if their own goals don't line up with the mystery man here.
Logged

Nerjin

  • Bay Watcher
  • A photo is worth 1,000 words... all: Guilty!
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1226 on: October 15, 2012, 04:40:19 pm »

I was under the impression we were a good necromancer. We shouldn't fall to temptation. I vote we remain allied with the forces of good.
Logged
The demon code prevents me from declining a rock-off challenge.

Is the admiral of the SS Lapidot.

Angle

  • Bay Watcher
  • 39 Indigo Spear Questions the Poor
    • View Profile
    • Agora Forum Demo!
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1227 on: October 15, 2012, 05:24:00 pm »

yeah, let's not ally with her. The whole "make the world safe for necromancers by killing everyone else" thing seems a little crazy. We should answer her by saying that we want nothing to do with necromancers like Curo Nightroar, and as such we feel we cannot work with her.
Logged

Agora: open-source platform to facilitate complicated discussions between large numbers of people. Now with test site!

The Temple of the Elements: Quirky Dungeon Crawler

GlyphGryph

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1228 on: October 15, 2012, 05:29:44 pm »

In case you haven't noticed, the forces of good seem to be fairly outgunned. There are apparently 3! necromancers AND a god of death aligned against them. I don't want to actually help them reach their goal, but playing along is by and far our best chance of preventing exactly that outcome. We don't need to actually assist them with anything - just take everything of value they can offer and avoid getting ganked.

If we are going to stop them we need to:
a) Learn more about them and get to know them - possible sowing dissension among them or maybe even finding an ally. We know the Pirate King is ambitious, for example, but we do not know if he is evil. And even if he IS evil, evil + ambitious is potentially useful. Allies are the key to victory, and right now we have none - pulling some from the enemy ranks would be amazingly useful.
b) Jump at every opportunity for learning more about our powers and the situation as possible - Knowledge is power, after all, and everyone but us has a head start. And if we are going to restore our homeland, this dude? He's the most likely to have some idea how.
b) Not attract undue attention. As I mentioned, everyone else has a head start - even if we don't learn anything or find any allies in this little group, we need to keep them off our back, and badly. Letting them think we're either not a threat, or willing to work with them, is the best way to insure that happens.

Under NO circumstances should we say we are allied with the forces of good. For one thing - we aren't. We have no allies at the moment. Our goals are good, yes, but it's hard to say we're "allied" with the forces of good when those forces would kill us without hesitation. The very furthest we should go is to remain neutral in this conflict... for the time being.

And he made it clear some of the other gods of Death are still around - we might be able to figure out how to contact them, through him, and make a more beneficial alliance if their goals are closer to our own.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2012, 05:32:35 pm by GlyphGryph »
Logged

Grek

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-5
« Reply #1229 on: October 15, 2012, 06:53:06 pm »

If we agree to help her, we will have to tell her where we are. And then, if she is evil like most people are assuming, she will tell Curo who will then send his undead army to eat us.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 80 81 [82] 83 84 ... 155