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Author Topic: American Election Megathread - It's Over  (Read 391751 times)

Helgoland

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9885 on: November 23, 2012, 09:38:56 pm »

I thought it was all the gay orgies that go on in the secret boards.
Oh, those are only illegal in 32 states.
Outright copyright violations, on these boards? I could see people skirting the edges of legality in relation to copyrights, but actual violating them? I don't think toady allows that.
One nation under copyright! Copyright is indivisible; and if one work is copied, all works are harmed.
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Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

Nadaka

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9886 on: November 23, 2012, 09:39:32 pm »

I thought it was all the gay orgies that go on in the secret boards.

The first rule of orgy club is that you don't talk about orgy club.
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Descan

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9887 on: November 23, 2012, 09:48:41 pm »

I thought it was all the gay orgies that go on in the secret boards.

The first rule of orgy club is that you don't talk about orgy club.
The second rule is don't forget the lube.
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Karnewarrior

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9888 on: November 24, 2012, 02:28:40 am »

I thought it was all the gay orgies that go on in the secret boards.

The first rule of orgy club is that you don't talk about orgy club.
The second rule is don't forget the lube.
Third Rule is Karne is not invited ever.

Third point fifth rule is Seriously, don't.



you guys can be mean sometimes.
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Dutchling

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9889 on: November 24, 2012, 06:26:30 am »

I thought it was all the gay orgies that go on in the secret boards.
The first rule of orgy club is that you don't talk about orgy club.
The second rule is don't forget the lube.
Third Rule is Karne is not invited ever.
I am sigging this so hard.
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Kogan Loloklam

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9890 on: November 24, 2012, 07:54:23 am »

Dictator means "one who dictates"
it's just dictate with an -or ending.
It's applied to totalitarian rulers because such people have the right by their laws to dictate anything, including execution or jail of their opponents.
Putin and Obama cannot jail people who don't break the law on their soil, so not Dictators.

On to third Parties...
Maniac, how many hours have you put in?
I've put in a few hours for third parties. I've met people who have put in 8 hour days for decades to the Green Party.
There is absolutely a barrier to entry for third parties established by the two party system. It begins at the state level. The republican and democratic parties generally have a promised slot in every race in the nation and do not face stiff criticism of weakening the vote for the "real candidate". If the third party somehow overcomes this, their next barrier is money. The big two have an established system to fund their "grass roots", this funding exists because there is a return on investment. Third parties don't have a tradition of victory, so aren't able to build this support that funds otherwise weaker candidates. This means even third party candidates that are head and shoulders above the local two still face a tougher fight than otherwise would happen. Let's just say that this theoretical candidate has both gotten on the ballot in spite of regulation that makes it hard and the outside money didn't materialize. Now we run into an apathy wall. The majority of US citizens hold some views of each party. Very few are really solidly behind one side. A lot of these people are jaded by things that make them feel their vote doesn't count, so you don't get large turnouts. Who is likely to turn out though? Those who go for one of the two, so a larger portion of people who are against the election being "spoiled" than are really represented in the population.
What does this mean? It means the entry level jobs for politicians aren't third party friendly.
Q: OH, but what about...(enter argument here)
A: There was no Law in 1890 that barred women from work in factories, discrimination doesn't need to be in law, the minds of those in charge is usually enough.
So, no entry, no dominance. More of my friends liked Jill than Mitt or Barak, yet they still didn't vote 3rd party. A lot didn't vote. I don't know how that was better than "throwing your vote away", but it was their choice.
Still, you are right in the need to change things at a local level. Encourage IRV and proportionate electorial college distribution in your local states, and you'll see larger turnouts and more third party support. To say it's not rigged is probably false though. A system that isn't rigged will usually show accurate representation accross the board. There are enough registered independant and third party that government should have more from the lowest offices to the highest. Strangely, what is true for the country isn't true for the representation. Hence third parties crying foul.
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Helgoland

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9891 on: November 24, 2012, 07:57:29 am »

Yeah, the system needs reform. One thing though: Compared to Europe, the US have a rather high turnout; I guess it's because it's a winner-takes-all/no-coalitions deal.
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Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9892 on: November 24, 2012, 09:54:07 am »

Nader's Ticket to the Debate

Okay, this was very difficult to watch through the wave of bullshit that Nadar was throwing up but here is what I was able to guesstimate.  It appears to me that Nadar did not have a ticket to the debate.  He was given a ticket by a student and told by fox news to talk to them.  However the tickets are non-transferable.  Fox news doesn't have the power to give out tickets.  He therefore had no right to enter the grounds.  The big showdown was him acting like a passive aggressive twerp.  If I had been there I would have punched him in the face.  It's a good thing I'm not a cop.

Maybe you want to say that Nadar should have been given a ticket.  But it is certainly not the case that he was turned away.  Rather he tried to get on the grounds illegally and was stopped.  He was on a list because it seemed likely he would try something like this.  Seems like that list was a pretty good prediction.

Nadar is pissing in the well for real 3rd party candidates.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2012, 09:55:45 am by mainiac »
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Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM
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Kogan Loloklam

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9893 on: November 24, 2012, 02:31:46 pm »

Nader pissing into the well doesn't change the fact that there is a well of politics that is different from "first party" candidates, and that it is underrepresented.
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9894 on: November 25, 2012, 12:25:15 am »

I'd be more sympathetic to that view if the third parties actually did grassroots organizing and ran candidates in the many state and local elections that they should theoretically be capable of winning if they do indeed represent the views of most Americans.
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Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM
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Nadaka

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9895 on: November 25, 2012, 02:16:57 am »

I'd be more sympathetic to that view if the third parties actually did grassroots organizing and ran candidates in the many state and local elections that they should theoretically be capable of winning if they do indeed represent the views of most Americans.
They are, and they loose all the time due to the structural inequity of the system. more than 2/3 of my local/state offices had independent candidates.
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Kogan Loloklam

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9896 on: November 25, 2012, 07:22:18 am »

Misha Luzov
Doug Lamborn
James Pirtle
Kenneth Harvell
David Anderson
George Allen Cantrell (write-in)
2 were first party candadates. 1 was an independant. The rest were third parties.
There are more other and unaffiliated in this district than the minority first Party. In 2010, the minority first party candidate got 29.3% of the vote. 65.8% went to the majority first party. Third parties got 2.5% and 2.4%

So, what happened this time?
The Republican write-in didn't get a statistically significant amount.
The Republican Incumbant got 65.3% with 191198 votes.
The Independant got 17.4%
The Libertarian got 7.3%
Green Party 5.9%
Constitution 4.2%
I don't know where the extra 0.1% came from, but I suspect California. (or rounding)
And no, the Independant wasn't the best match for a "Democrat" platform.
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9897 on: November 25, 2012, 01:28:22 pm »

And?
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Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM
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Owlbread

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9898 on: November 25, 2012, 02:39:13 pm »

Ron Paul/Jesse Ventura 2016



Now how would that go
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Jervill

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Re: American Election Megathread - It's Over
« Reply #9899 on: November 25, 2012, 03:18:58 pm »

If you're going to upload a picture of Former Governor Ventura, use his official portrait:

Its awesomeness has to be seen to be believed.
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