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Dwarf Fortress => DF Modding => Topic started by: Puresowns on November 30, 2011, 04:44:08 pm

Title: Dwemerifell - a TES mod in progress
Post by: Puresowns on November 30, 2011, 04:44:08 pm
I'm current trying to do a total conversion mod to model the dwarves after the Dwemer from The Elder Scrolls series. This is my first major bit of modding, and the first modded work I'm planning on making public, so there are a few things I quite frankly have no clue how to do or what effect values for certain tags might have. If anyone wants to help me with the aspects of the mod I'm kinda clueless about, I'd be very grateful, and I would be sure to give you a spot in the credits.

Completed: Planning out the civilizations, metals

Currently working on: Metals

What I need help on:Values for each metal, to show an even progression from iron(which will be the worst weapon/armor metal) up to the vanilla adamantine(which is being left in to be a possible explanation for the fall of the Dwemer). (just go ahead and post here if you want to help, I'll send you what I have done of the raws+ how the progression of improvement should work)

Planned for the final mod: All races having individual civs to interact with(including certain blind ex-slaves), importable dwemer machines(Spider worker+variants,Dwemer Sphere+variants,Dwemer Centurion+variants) at a HIGH cost, flora/fauna being changed to match known species in each biome of Tamriel, metal items requiring multiple items to make(iron dagger= 1 iron ingot+1 leather strip or Orcish sword= 1 iron ingot+ 1 leather strip+ 2 orichalcum ingots) making these items have values independant from the metls used if possible(prevents having multitudes of alloys), more as I think of it.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: JediaKyrol on November 30, 2011, 05:30:02 pm
you mean like this?

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=48197.0

Deon has let it sit and molder for a year though...and it never hurts to have multiple takes on something...just pointing it out.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on November 30, 2011, 05:56:55 pm
I'm afraid I (and Deon) beat you to it.
(link in sig)

If you still want to go with this, I guess I should warn you that there is no way to create (or import) creatures.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Seriyu on November 30, 2011, 09:02:34 pm
To be fair neither of them have been updated in quite some time. :P
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Puresowns on November 30, 2011, 09:03:03 pm
Hmm, didn't notice those, but as you stated, the Deon mod is over a year old so it doesn't have the benefit of Skyrim's lore. Also, Deathscope, the scope of your mod seems to be a little different for what I'm hoping to end up with, I'm planning as close to 100% as possible.

I plan to have the dwarven 'bots imported like pets from the capitol(I'll say that the creation process is too intense for the outpost to achieve) You can ask the liaison to send animals, so modding in a mechanical "animal" with the attributes I want shouldn't be difficult.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Protactinium on November 30, 2011, 11:56:32 pm
The existence of someone else's mod that shares its theme with yours shouldn't stop you by any means. Go for it, I love the "extinct but still world-affecting" nature of the Dwemer.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 01, 2011, 06:11:34 am
Quote from: Puresowns on November 30, 2011, 09:03:03 pm
Also, Deathscope

It's Deathsword, by the way.


Frankly, I suggest you go on right ahead. Just change the name, since that's what Deon named his.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Puresowns on December 01, 2011, 11:30:14 am
Ah, sorry 'bout that. I wrote that last reply on 3 hours of sleep. If anyone has a better idea for a name for this ting, I'm all ears.

On a semirelated note, I'm still tinkering with the metal raws, but I don't know what I need to be doing to the numbers effecting weapon effectiveness.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 01:44:44 pm
how about Dwemerifell?  Dwemeri was what they called themselves...and the -fell suffix means "city" or "home" ...from what I remember from Morrowind...

and for the constructs...I did a bit of work on Deon's robots for Wasteland...I wouldn't mind helping you if you'd like.

and...from the DF wiki...
    Density: Used in conjunction with other factors - heavier weapons (higher numbers) hit with more force, light weapons tend to have less penetration.
    Impact yield: Used for blunt-force combat; higher is better.
    Impact fracture: Used for blunt-force combat; higher is better.
    Impact elasticity: Used for blunt-force combat; lower is better.
    Shear yield: Used for cutting calculations in combat; higher is better.
    Shear fracture: Used for cutting calculations in combat; higher is better.
    Shear elasticity: Used for cutting calculations in combat; lower is better.

Dwemer stuff is basically DF Adamantine but super dense as well...and Glass is pretty much Adamantine but with much lower fracture points.  Ebon is friggin Slade that you can mine...Daedra is friggin Slade that has been boosted by magic...pretty much everything else already is in DF...
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Deon on December 01, 2011, 01:48:03 pm
Yep, I am guilty in long update times here. I will make Dwemer Fotress alive soon again using Genesis as base (since I like many of my material balances and most of options). I would love if you let me keep the Dwemer Fortress name and invent another one, but I won't be angry if you still want to call your mod Dwemer Fortress :).
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 01, 2011, 01:58:21 pm
Quote from: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 01:44:44 pm
how about Dwemerifell?  Dwemeri was what they called themselves...and the -fell suffix means "city" or "home" ...from what I remember from Morrowind...

and for the constructs...I did a bit of work on Deon's robots for Wasteland...I wouldn't mind helping you if you'd like.

Vvardenfell = City of the Strong Shield. But identifying wich part is "city" may be a bit of a problem.

I hope we eventually end up with 3 TES mods, with, hopefuly, different styles regarding how it's played. One of the thing I really liked in Skyrim is that they finally revealed where soul gems come from, thus making placing them in DF easier. About bloody time.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 02:19:05 pm
well...Hammerfell used to be Volenfell which translated to "City of the Striking Hammer"
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 01, 2011, 02:26:44 pm
Quote from: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 02:19:05 pm
well...Hammerfell used to be Volenfell which translated to "City of the Striking Hammer"

Uh... no. It was called Volenfell because that's where the hammer Volendrung, which then belonged to a clan-lord, fell. But I think that last part may have been simply a myth created by the dwemer to justify naming the place after the hammer.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 02:34:30 pm
well pbbt on my brain then...but even then...Volenfell and Volendrung share "Volen" that leaves "fell" which is shared between Volenfell and Vvardenfell...meaning fell has to mean city!  I mean sure...that wouldn't work with a real language...but this is a made up language made by some guys in Maryland...

Volendrung probably means "Big Ass Hammer"

this is the best thing I could find on the Elder scrolls languages
http://www.imperial-library.info/content/translation-dictionary/F
-fell is a common suffix across all languages meaning "city", and it's mentioned in the book "Aedra and Daedra"...in pretty much every Elder Scrolls game
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 01, 2011, 02:38:10 pm
Actually the "fell" part in Volenfell is really just the verb "fell"

Here's something regarding that. (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Volenfell#History)


EDIT: fixed the url
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: JediaKyrol on December 01, 2011, 03:15:33 pm
Quote from: Deathsword on December 01, 2011, 02:38:10 pm
Actually the "fell" part in Volenfell is really just the verb "fell"

Here's something regarding that. (http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Volenfell#History)


EDIT: fixed the url

yeah...I didn't know/remember about Volenfell...but that wiki says too...that the -fell suffix means city
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Ehlnofex_Languages

still no word on what -drung means...so my stance on "big ass" holds

hmm...looking at those wikis...what about Dweruhn (Dwe = Under/Smart, Ruhn = Hearth Hall..."Underground Hall" that's the closest to "dwarf fortress" that I could see)
Title: Re: Dwemerifell - a TES mod in progress
Post by: Puresowns on December 02, 2011, 07:00:40 pm
Name changed. I'm just going to post the raws for the metal bars as I currently have them, which admittedly isn't much. I basically have the colors, monetary values, and what the metals can actually be used for set in stone, everything else is a little out of my league.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Note that the only metal non-native to the TES universe is adamantine, and even that shows up in the name Adamantine Tower. My next step is to try and figure out how to make custom reactions for weapons in such a way that each weapon type for each metal is distinct(an iron sword isn't really used for slicing as much as it is causing blunt damage along a focused line to tear muscle and break bone, but an elven sword has a razor sharp edge, used for cutting at things, and an orcish blade would ideally be somewhere in between. The weapons should also have a "recipe" to follow, such as an iron sword requiring a certain amount of iron and some leather strips(for the handle, leather strips will be produced in the same manner as in skyrim, cut from tanned hides)

Once I have all of the weapons and armor down(and hopefully balance tested), I'll move on to modelling the civilizations, though I suspect I won't be able to accurately model citizens of the various races joining the imperials/cyrodiilics without making them babysnatchers or some such.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Deon on December 03, 2011, 04:52:35 am
I see you've got the metal framework from Skyrim :P.

I am not sure whether dwemer metal is closer to bronze or to steel... But for the gameplay better have it close to bronze, because if we make spiders and centurions out of steel, they will be greatly overpowered and almost impossible to take down.

About races: just focus on major ones (imperials, bretons, argonians etc.), let the game decide the race composition. That's what DF is about: alternate history for your favourite TES world :).
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 03, 2011, 06:48:11 am
Regarding adamantine, it appeared in tribunal, and it was considered medium concerning armor.

You may want to make centurions out of something that's not the same dwemer metal your dorfs dwemer will be using. Give it the same name, but lower stats.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Deon on December 03, 2011, 08:14:05 am
One moment, why is the corundum a metal? It's a mineral-stone which has iron, chromium and other stuff. It cannot be smelted.

Quote from: Deathsword on December 03, 2011, 06:48:11 am
Give it the same name
Bad idea for a couple of reasons.

Also you could make them out of copper or bronze.
Title: Re: Dwemer Fortress
Post by: Teneb on December 03, 2011, 09:32:31 am
Quote from: Deon on December 03, 2011, 08:14:05 am
One moment, why is the corundum a metal? It's a mineral-stone which has iron, chromium and other stuff. It cannot be smelted.

For some reason, you can smelt it in Skyrim.
Title: Re: Dwemerifell - a TES mod in progress
Post by: Puresowns on December 03, 2011, 10:54:01 am
I was planning the smaller creations to be made of the equivalent of copper, and the Centurions to be made of Dwemer metal, but to have a couple of weak spots. The soulgem, centurion core, and boiler come to mind.

I'll also note that sense creatures cannot be "constructed" I'll have to make all of these importable from the capitol, and set them up to be incapable of breeding. The costs associated with importing them should be rather high. I'm hoping to make the Centurions worth around 100k.
Title: Re: Dwemerifell - a TES mod in progress
Post by: Puresowns on December 03, 2011, 05:54:26 pm
This is what I currently have for the iron sword raw:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Basically identical to the original short sword raw with changed names and a couple of attacks removed(at least until I figure out if it's possible to make them more or less likely to occur in battle. At that point I'll reintroduce them depending on the weapon's material base) There are, however, some points I'm not quite clear on.

How should I go about making an iron sword not as good for cutting or stabbing as much as tearing?(I plan the opposite to be true on most other swords, but I don't exactly see an iron sword keeping a razor sharp edge long enough for said edge to be relevant in battle. Steel and up should be much better at keeping an edge, and will reflect this point) What would be some decent minimum size and two hand sizes to ensure an almost human sized being can wield the sword easily in one hand, without it being comically small? These sizing numbers aren't helping me picture the scale very easily. I'm planning on making the Dwemer slightly shorter than the average for Cyrodiilic humans(probably about equal with nords, in keeping that colder invironments tend to make for slightly shorter, stockier people), but I'm not sure where about that number should end up.
Title: Re: Dwemerifell - a TES mod in progress
Post by: Protactinium on January 17, 2012, 04:45:05 pm
Quote from: Puresowns on December 03, 2011, 05:54:26 pm
I'm planning on making the Dwemer slightly shorter than the average for Cyrodiilic humans(probably about equal with nords, in keeping that colder invironments tend to make for slightly shorter, stockier people), but I'm not sure where about that number should end up.

Quote
Bergmann's Rule

In 1847, the German biologist Carl Bergmann observed that within the same species of warm-blooded animals, populations having less massive individuals are more often found in warm climates near the equator, while those with greater bulk, or mass, are found further from the equator in colder regions.  This is due to the fact that big animals generally have larger body masses which result in more heat being produced.  The greater amount of heat results from there being more cells.  A normal byproduct of metabolism in cells is heat production.  Subsequently, the more cells an animal has, the more internal heat it will produce.

I quoted this from this site (http://anthro.palomar.edu/adapt/adapt_2.htm). Make of it what you will.

No apologies for the necro, either! This thread was sleeping, but far from dead.  :P