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[Remalle]

If we do end up Left Stoning Alice, should we convert Rox as well, then let them continue their relationship?  Probably best to ask her about it if we end up Left Stoning her, but if she says yes I think it would be a good idea to.  It would gain us a useful and loyal consort, and help ensure Alice's friendship.

[Mlamlah]

I am *very* against left stoning Alice, i would much rather create a night troll with the natural desire to create children ALONGSIDE the duty to procreate.
My official vote is battle lust, as it enhances rather than conflicts with her abilities.

[Thecard]

I think we should stone Alice.
...
Oh, you mean give her, the lesbian, the gift that will only work to full potential if she has sex with men?
Hell naw.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Again all that real world-modern time-human morals logic.
I am sure that even if Nightclaw will directly order us to convert Alice majority will be against that because "lesbians can't have kids!"

[Mlamlah]

It's not even about morals, it's just about not making a whole lot of sense. We don't want to have to babysit alice all of the time and force her to have children, it's one more thing to worry about. If we're going to give such a powerful gift it should be to someone who's going to use it of her own volition and with eagerness instead of disgust.

[Corruptor]

It's not even about morals, it's just about not making a whole lot of sense. We don't want to have to babysit alice all of the time and force her to have children, it's one more thing to worry about. If we're going to give such a powerful gift it should be to someone who's going to use it of her own volition and with eagerness instead of disgust.

Agreed.

As for Alice's gift - she's a subtle character with a cunning mind and many out-of-combat skills - the battle-lust gift may ruin that potential, imo we should wait to use it on a subject possessed of more physical and martial abilities. *Grins* or a pacifist, for ze cruel irony.

The Inferno Gift would potentially work, but I believe that the Phoenix gift would be most prudent. With wings of flame she will be a loyal and essential scout / messenger, in addition to her other useful skills. The wings are also very outwardly impressive, Foghorn is bound to be pleased that we gave his daughter such power and may reward us in some way.

Finally, as a useful agent and link to our most crucial ally, losing her would be a major setback - a setback that we could undo once, with the Phoenix's ability to be reborn from the ashes a single time.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

That "force" is what making me laugh.  The whole idea that we need a hive mother, not a sister and ally is a a pure minmaxing (IMO, bad minmaxing)

BTW, I prefer lesbian to nymphomaniac. I am sure that Alice will use her brain when choosing partners. Not the place between her legs (could use, I am sure that we will consort Alice and then minmaxers  will advocate raping her to make nice kids, while absolutely ignoring our relationships)

She may have less kids (she will, it's just not in her character to become a hive mother and be pregnant 100% of time.) but she will be a very good, friendly and loyal matriarch

Alice is so close friend to us , that making her effectively a sister is logical and much more respecting than adding to our harem.

[Grek]

I personally vote for Phoenix for Alice, Left Stone for Kieplmar and (if Rox agrees) Inferno's Embrace for her. That is the properly romantic thing to do.

[Mlamlah]

i think Rox might just be on loan to us

Wait... what... happened to those bears?

[Mlamlah]

That "force" is what making me laugh.  The whole idea that we need a hive mother, not a sister and ally is a a pure minmaxing (IMO, bad minmaxing)

BTW, I prefer lesbian to nymphomaniac. I am sure that Alice will use her brain when choosing partners. Not the place between her legs (could use, I am sure that we will consort Alice and then minmaxers  will advocate raping her to make nice kids, while absolutely ignoring our relationships)

She may have less kids (she will, it's just not in her character to become a hive mother and be pregnant 100% of time.) but she will be a very good, friendly and loyal matriarch

Alice is so close friend to us , that making her effectively a sister is logical and much more respecting than adding to our harem.

It's not minmaxing, it's using resources with at least some degree of logic.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Yeah, Alice will be happy if we fuck her love and magically add her to our harem, veeeeery romantic

Let's introduce our human friend to the Goddess, then we may decide

And the "using resources" is a clear sign of minmaxing

[Mlamlah]

We have plenty of other mates to use, so we should never need to impregnate her except in great need.
And i disagree, giving her the gift of left stone just doesn't make sense. Pretty much any other female of some capability and ambition is better, Gwen would have been better, for instance. I'm not minmaxing, i'm merely advocating banking the ability until a better oppurtunity happens by, and disagreeing with an action that i feel makes no sense in the long run. We're the last hope of the night troll race, the very last hope, we need to think in the long run.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

We have plenty of other mates to use, so we should never need to impregnate her except in great need.

Then there are two  problems  if we don't impregnate her
1) We will remove some gift from the common genocode
2) She will stay magically tied to us to the end of world. Not the way to treat a friend

Pretty much any other female of some capability and ambition is better

Ambition = potential enemy. Why don't you value loyalty at all?

Gwen would have been better, for instance

If we found a way to ensure her loyalty... And I am quite sure that Alice would get more useful traits.

We're the last hope of the night troll race, the very last hope, we need to think in the long run.

That's we  need to put fate of our race in the hands of someone we trust. Not someone random. That's obvious logic for the character.


I can't understand why do you think that first mother should produce many daughters. First mother should have nice traits and give birth to the future mothers with good, hand picked traits. This daughters  may go that "flood the world with babies" route. In fact even one first daughter may be enough

As for converting the mermaid -  it's absolutely useless in a short term period, we may even kill her if we attempt to convert her on land

[Mlamlah]

I do value loyalty, but we arn't really in control of a whole lot right now, an ambitious night troll does not have a lot to gain by turning on us.
I do see some of your points though, unless we somehow keep her human i suppose that either way it would probably have to come down to someone having a child with her, which is very sad.

Just as a note for the future, for now i think that we should focus on getting our domestic affairs in order. Gwen and the child are our priority right now, and we should speak with the newly free willed Gwen once she's had the child, explain to her that we shall care for her and treat her kindly for the duration of both of our lives. On the issue of night troll babies, do they spring up fully grown? If so we have quite a bit of work on our hands in the immediate future.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

1) If Alice will be female night troll she may choose mate(s) but as a consort her options are too limited. And sex between friends is bad, bad, bad for friendship

2) Treacherous  matriarch gains quite a lot - right to be the supreme night troll. Right to set rules That's like a fight inside a wolf pack I suspect that Alice will don't want to rule all the night trolls

3) Later situation will change and matriarch will get more reasons to betray

4) Gwen will not become free right after the birth, the child need to grow up first

5) And I agreed to not spend the left stone without blessing of the goddess. I reluctant to go on the religious path, but that is unavoidable