Holy shit. And no shorten?Rules:
- Day Phases will Last for up to 14 days, and Nights for up to 2 days.
yes. lynching shortens the day and if you guys are okay we can shorten night to 1 day.
Sounds like...yes. lynching shortens the day and if you guys are okay we can shorten night to 1 day.
Does this mean hammers are in effect?
No, that's what mountainous means. No PRs.Where'd that come from?
pisskop's experience is from elsewhere, where they are more common :PAh.
Yes............................So.... Why are you giving them an NK?
Two Mafia and four town. Okay.Why put a vote on yourself if we don't know your town?
...
Huhm.
TheBiggerFish
Filipk:Why put a vote on someone you don't know is town?
As far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.Fair point I thought about it a bit more and agree with you
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Why put a vote on myself if the town isn't convinced I'm town yet?Yeah I don't read the rules very thoroughly all the time, skipped over them when I first signed up, went over them when the game began.
Because town or scum I still want to get lynched anyway and I don't have any better targets.
I'm quite concerned that you felt it necessary to even ask that question.
PPE:...Yeah, uh, filipk, you just now figure that out?
As far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Hahahaha No. unvoteAs far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Reasonable conclusion, and I assume you arrived there by halving the number of votes it takes to hammer. Or hammer-2.
Arguably not so much a reasonable conclusion, seeing as though there are two scum. That's enough for a self-vote and a quick hammer by their partner (further assuming they're not already on the wagon)
Seeing as I want to get lynched, though, let's put me at:
hector13, Lynch-1
fillipkThey both implicate me as scum however one implicates Imic too while the other puts him against me. I have no strong feelings one way or the other for this question (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ussCHoQttyQ)
If you were to choose, would you like everyone to think you're buddying up to Imic or distancing yourself from him?
As far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Reasonable conclusion, and I assume you arrived there by halving the number of votes it takes to hammer. Or hammer-2.
Arguably not so much a reasonable conclusion, seeing as though there are two scum. That's enough for a self-vote and a quick hammer by their partner (further assuming they're not already on the wagon)
Seeing as I want to get lynched, though, let's put me at:
hector13, Lynch-1
As far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Reasonable conclusion, and I assume you arrived there by halving the number of votes it takes to hammer. Or hammer-2.
Arguably not so much a reasonable conclusion, seeing as though there are two scum. That's enough for a self-vote and a quick hammer by their partner (further assuming they're not already on the wagon)
Seeing as I want to get lynched, though, let's put me at:
hector13, Lynch-1
Here's my thought process:
If there are two votes on someone, there are two options. If they are town, it's good to get them closer to getting lynched (but scum will do everything they can to avoid hammering anyway). If they are scum, then the most scum can do is do a quick self-vote followed by a hammer from the other scum (or vice versa). But that would immediately flag the second scum as scum because it's really suspicious to put someone at L-1 with so little info. So the second scum has to either wait a bit to vote or convince someone from the town to hammer.
so hector, two questions:
Why did you self-vote? I mean yes, we all want to get lynched, but why did you think self-voting would make someone else vote for you?
lol no unvote hector13
Hahahaha No. unvote
And a second question: How many votes can safely be on someone with no further info tomorrow?
Honestly, my plan is to get me out of the way so the better players will keep going.As far as I can tell, it's safe to put two votes on someone but not any more in case they are scum.
hector13, what do you think of this conclusion and how did I arrive at it?
Reasonable conclusion, and I assume you arrived there by halving the number of votes it takes to hammer. Or hammer-2.
Arguably not so much a reasonable conclusion, seeing as though there are two scum. That's enough for a self-vote and a quick hammer by their partner (further assuming they're not already on the wagon)
Seeing as I want to get lynched, though, let's put me at:
hector13, Lynch-1
fillipk
If you were to choose, would you like everyone to think you're buddying up to Imic or distancing yourself from him?
TBF
You seem to be trying to play an optimum game. What are your plans heading forward?
No, you just said it was, with no further actual explanation.
Yes but that means your not doing anything with your vote when its on you, strikes me as a passive scum play who doesn't want to do anything too rash. Just Intial thoughts though
@hector13:Most likely, yes.
I'm the only person I'm sure is town. With that in mind, it is better to keep my vote where it might do some good.
::)
Since when did I say I wasn't going to help figure things out?You never said that but your actions have been very passive, like your trying to make as little of a splash as possible as to not give away any tells. Are you afraid of giving away tells, I mean you shouldn't be right?
::)Wasnt his first post Hector
@FillipkSorry forgot to get back to you on this, it was random that was the point, We need more proactive play in this game otherwise we won't find scum or do anything, there are no night actions so delaying does nothing, we just need people to post.
I don't mind. Bread for the bread god, I suppose. I mean, I don't know who's who, that is the point of the game after all. Why are you even doing this anyway? It seems random.
How are you going to do that then?Watch everyone else do things and comment when I feel is necessary or when I have a good point to make.
But I'm not asking you to give away information I'm asking you to take a more proactive play style and try to get other people to post, instead of relying on other people to do this for you as you are now. As to giving away information, what information is there to give away? Seriously we have good players here so nothing I said hadn't already been realized or won't have been realized if they thought about it so its better to get the information out there so the town knows not to do something stupid. If your talking about roles, they don't exist and even if they did playing passively is worse as that appears to be anti-information which is a scum thing to do. Another thing that happens on day 1 is crazy gambits like Hector's self vote which panics people to respond without thinking too much, which gives us a lot of information. And then there are questions which creates dialogues between people like this one right here. So please do something with your time and bring us closer to deciding who to lynch day 1.How are you going to do that then?Watch everyone else do things and comment when I feel is necessary or when I have a good point to make.
@filipk:You are correct in that I don't like to act until I can be decisive. Giving away information only helps scum adjust their play.
Hey, what do you mean hector's crazy gambit?Putting himself at L-1, what would you call that.
Sane.No it wasn't. He still needed someone else to vote for him and by doing that he makes that even more unlikely, there was no intention to get lynched right then and there in that. He was doing that just to test and see how we would react so its a gambit. It could have backfired heavily and made us very unlikely to lynch him. If he was trying to be lynched then and there it would be like checking your opponent in chess by moving your Queen into danger, a very stupid move if you don't have a back-up plan.
We're trying to get lynched.
How do you know that, exactly?What exactly are you waiting for? I mean your talking about the "rest of the day" as if something is magically going to happen that will reveal who is scum or who is town, that's not going to happen so do something, actually who do you think is most likely to be scum right now?
I presume the backup plan was "the rest of the day".
Honestly, you.Now why would that be?
Deadline is paused at 4 days until a replacement for TheWetSheep is found
fillipkJust a random vote, as stated before my vote doesn't mater unless it gives someone the ability to self hammer so I did it to get these questions asked and see how people would respond to a random vote in a mountainous mafia.
In the first post of the game, you voted for Hector13.
Why hector?
TDS, fillipkGut reaction to him being at L-12. Don't know why TDS unvoted, I'm asking him the same thing.
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?
Hector13I second this question, though i have an idea as to why i would do that.
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
RVS coming in the next post I guess
Conveniently, this setup allows me to issue ultimatums (it lets you do so too).I'd say its townsided because the mafia has a hard time coming back from any mistake they make, thus the best strategy is to just have everyone generate lots of content and create the most opportunities for mafia to make mistakes. As for my ultimatum: I will not seriously vote for any player not engage in a meaningful discussion with the rest of the players. If you are less active but post on a regular basis with decent content that is fine.
I will not vote for any player who has not adequately outlined their position on the following (agreeing with another player is fine):
Is this setup townsided?
If not, is there any reason not to use the 'unlynchable martyr' technique and just have a town player claim, avoid lynches, and generate the lynches for the town using random.org (or w/e)?
fillipk1. Hell if I know
Why did TDS unvote?
Why did Hector13 switch the post order of you and TDS? Was it really just an honest mistake caused by quoting while in the post window? Is there such a thing?
Why did Hector13 unvote?
Why am I asking you so many questions?
Why am I voting TheBiggerFish
Hector13
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
Fun fact: when reading over this thread before it went up for replacements, I felt the gut instinct to hammer Hector13. If I was playing from the start, I would have done so.
Hector13
Which players would have, in your opinion, not put themselves at L-1 if they were scum.
TDS, fillipkGut reaction to him being at L-12. Don't know why TDS unvoted, I'm asking him the same thing.
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?Hector13I second this question, though i have an idea as to why i would do that.
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
RVS coming in the next post I guess
fillipk1. Hell if I know
Why did TDS unvote?
Why did Hector13 switch the post order of you and TDS? Was it really just an honest mistake caused by quoting while in the post window? Is there such a thing?
Why did Hector13 unvote?
Why am I asking you so many questions?
Why am I voting TheBiggerFish
2. Not likely an honest mistake as it was a super formatted post, thus the reason I think he did it was to try and change the narrative and see who went along with it, if TDS was scum he might have tried to promote the idea that he unvoted first and I'm the scum because of that, it was just another test which is what we should be doing all the time.
3. No reason to leave the vote on, he could be doing something else with his vote during the day to find scum and it makes it more convenient to do that if you are not voting.
4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
Oh and before I forget Hector13
So I do have questions of my own back here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161581.msg7343298#msg7343298)
fillipkTDS, fillipkGut reaction to him being at L-12. Don't know why TDS unvoted, I'm asking him the same thing.
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?Hector13I second this question, though i have an idea as to why i would do that.
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
RVS coming in the next post I guess
Do you not have questions of your own?
These things happened before doll was in the game, why wait 'til now to bring it up?
I offered my opinion because I was asked and I shared the reasons why I would do such things if I was in their position.fillipk1. Hell if I know
Why did TDS unvote?
Why did Hector13 switch the post order of you and TDS? Was it really just an honest mistake caused by quoting while in the post window? Is there such a thing?
Why did Hector13 unvote?
Why am I asking you so many questions?
Why am I voting TheBiggerFish
2. Not likely an honest mistake as it was a super formatted post, thus the reason I think he did it was to try and change the narrative and see who went along with it, if TDS was scum he might have tried to promote the idea that he unvoted first and I'm the scum because of that, it was just another test which is what we should be doing all the time.
3. No reason to leave the vote on, he could be doing something else with his vote during the day to find scum and it makes it more convenient to do that if you are not voting.
4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
You offered your position on questions 2-4, despite not being privy to the whys behind them.
Why did you not answer the first question, especially considering the question pertains to something you also did, and answered one later on the same subject?
As an aside, you think too highly of me :P
Maybe I'm building a strawman of you as someone who is taking gambits and risks in an attempt to find scum. Or even if they weren't gambits in the first place they can be used as one and I'm crediting you with those, even if you didn't intend that. As for answer two, you never mentioned that you posted from phone so I am to assume you posted from a computer where you could format, thus the only reason you would put TDS first is if you were lazy or you were trying something, you don't seem lazy so I assumed you were trying something and thus I shared my thoughts on what that may be Anyway your my top pick for town right now, your reactions and answers have been too honest to be hiding something, that's why I'm voting for you.Oh and before I forget Hector13
I don't like it when it's not immediately obvious why someone is voting for someone else.
You defended me over the weekend citing your thoughts on my reaction test (it wasn't a gambit as I had nothing to lose from someone else hammering me there) even though I hadn't really made them clear beyond "I don't think anyone is going to hammer anyone else during RVS" so you weren't really open to my thought process.
The vote could be an extension of that, but that seems a lot like buddying... particularly in light of your answer to question 2 from doll.
Just a random vote, as stated before my vote doesn't mater unless it gives someone the ability to self hammer so I did it to get these questions asked and see how people would respond to a random vote in a mountainous mafia.Sure
Why didn't you think this gut reaction through before changing your vote?TDS, fillipkGut reaction to him being at L-12. Don't know why TDS unvoted, I'm asking him the same thing.
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?
Of course you have an idea.Hector13I second this question, though i have an idea as to why i would do that.
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
RVS coming in the next post I guess
In your view then, activity is the primary marker of townhood in this game?Conveniently, this setup allows me to issue ultimatums (it lets you do so too).I'd say its townsided because the mafia has a hard time coming back from any mistake they make, thus the best strategy is to just have everyone generate lots of content and create the most opportunities for mafia to make mistakes. As for my ultimatum: I will not seriously vote for any player not engage in a meaningful discussion with the rest of the players. If you are less active but post on a regular basis with decent content that is fine.
I will not vote for any player who has not adequately outlined their position on the following (agreeing with another player is fine):
Is this setup townsided?
If not, is there any reason not to use the 'unlynchable martyr' technique and just have a town player claim, avoid lynches, and generate the lynches for the town using random.org (or w/e)?
[/quote]fillipk1. Hell if I know
Why did TDS unvote?
Why did Hector13 switch the post order of you and TDS? Was it really just an honest mistake caused by quoting while in the post window? Is there such a thing?
Why did Hector13 unvote?
Why am I asking you so many questions?
Why am I voting TheBiggerFish
2. Not likely an honest mistake as it was a super formatted post, thus the reason I think he did it was to try and change the narrative and see who went along with it, if TDS was scum he might have tried to promote the idea that he unvoted first and I'm the scum because of that, it was just another test which is what we should be doing all the time.
3. No reason to leave the vote on, he could be doing something else with his vote during the day to find scum and it makes it more convenient to do that if you are not voting.
4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
Oh and before I forget Hector13
Why?From my point of view:
I've never played with you before, but your posts in the theory thread suggest you have a fair amount of experience with mafia, and that you're also a thoughtful, rational player.
Hammering someone in RVS doesn't strike me as something an experienced and/or logical player would do :P
fillipkOh and before I forget Hector13
I don't like it when it's not immediately obvious why someone is voting for someone else.
You defended me over the weekend citing your thoughts on my reaction test (it wasn't a gambit as I had nothing to lose from someone else hammering me there) even though I hadn't really made them clear beyond "I don't think anyone is going to hammer anyone else during RVS" so you weren't really open to my thought process.
The vote could be an extension of that, but that seems a lot like buddying... particularly in light of your answer to question 2 from doll.
dollMissed this.Hector13
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
What makes the order of the posts important? I was addressing a similarity, so put the posts next to each other sans fluff so others could see it.
I was posting using my phone at the time, and I was responding to TDS, so it was convenient for me to take the particular quote from the post that I had already quoted first, and then proceed to editing in fillipk's.
Conveniently, this setup allows me to issue ultimatums (it lets you do so too).1. Yes, see my analysis below.
I will not vote for any player who has not adequately outlined their position on the following (agreeing with another player is fine):
Is this setup townsided?
If not, is there any reason not to use the 'unlynchable martyr' technique and just have a town player claim, avoid lynches, and generate the lynches for the town using random.org (or w/e)?
TDS
Where did you go?
The probability for a win from this is exactly even.Spoiler: ugly calculations with worse annotations (click to show/hide)
TDS, fillipk
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?
Spoiler: probability tree (click to show/hide)
Which is what I put here:The probability for a win from this is exactly even.Spoiler: ugly calculations with worse annotations (click to show/hide)
As hector self-voted, I saw him as much more scummy. Hence, I unvoted to signal that.I was going to say 'but scum can't hammer without outing themselves, which is autolose', but we had not at that point decided as a group to ostracize (reverse policy lynch) the speedhammerer of scum.
Wow.Spectacular contribution my man.
fillipk has confirmed multiple times that I am town in his mindFor clarification because this turns the lack of hunting into an actual scum slip rather than anti-town behavior, check this out:
4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong4. Yes, he stated blandly that I do not know his role in a mountainous game.
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
I'm pretty sure there's an error in the following, my additions in Bold PurpleSpoiler: probability tree (click to show/hide)
Which is what I put here:The probability for a win from this is exactly even.Spoiler: ugly calculations with worse annotations (click to show/hide)
Whoops, you're right.
However, I suppose I would prefer to by lynched D2. It's another layer of safety (from my point of view) and fillipk has confirmed multiple times that I am town in his mind and his vote is on Hector13, so I know that he should have no problem with a Hector-Doll lynch order. If he changes his mind about me after slipping so strongly, I'll be even happier to assume he's scum.
Incidentally, my gut feeling is that Hector13 and fillipk have been acting like a corny mid-grade scumteam, the sort of thing you see in a BM where the better player ends up bussing the other fairly quickly due to legitimately hunting and pushing on their poor play. If this is true, then fillipk is still scum and all is good so long as we don't lynch him.
Unvote
Vote Hector13
So you had concerns about hector being scum. Then why vote for him?
doll, explain why you thought hector was town?These have the same answer:
TDS didn't hammer. Hector did.Hector hammered himself, which every player would do as soon as they saw the thread.
You were the one that proclaimed him town...
Was there anything suspicious about TDS's 'hammer' post?
Are you concerned by the fact that he hammered while questions were unanswered, and so quickly after I took responsibility for the lynch?
I can get behind a Hector13 lynch. Mostly to find out info about everyone else. I am slightly concerned that doll still sees himself in the running for being lynched, though - if hector flips scum I'm going to take a very careful look at what doll has done so far.Can I just point out the stupidity of going after the person wanting to be unlynchable for being scum, especially before seeing Hector flip scum. This is literally just throwing shade at Doll for no good reason what so ever. What's Doll's plan now if she's scum, wait till there's like 3 people left and try to get herself lynched, never going to fly as she wanted to be unlynchable so she can't bring up anything about wanting to be lynched without looking scummy.
Here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161581.msg7341458#msg7341458)Why didn't you think this gut reaction through before changing your vote?TDS, fillipkGut reaction to him being at L-12. Don't know why TDS unvoted, I'm asking him the same thing.
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?
At what point exactly (give a link) did you realize the supremely obvious fact that quick hammering scum would make you a pariah?
Most importantly: why did you respond with "I don't know" rather than speculating in a game which has no mechanical information.I mean what do you want me to speculate. I literately see no town reason for him to do such a thing, especially the way he did it
I don't even buy this, especially since he didn't put that when he unvoted, he did exactly the same thing I did, laughed at it and unvoted.TDS, fillipk
Why did you unvote hector?
Why did you both unvote, when he wasn't at L-1 after fillipk unvoted?
As hector self-voted, I saw him as much more scummy. Hence, I unvoted to signal that.
You asked me that question when you asked me the 5 questions and I answered it then.Of course you have an idea.Hector13I second this question, though i have an idea as to why i would do that.
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
RVS coming in the next post I guess
Why don't you post it?
One of them, yes. It also gives more information to analyze which helps us figure out who the scum are. So while being active isn't the end all to being town it prevents scum from hiding behind a low post count.In your view then, activity is the primary marker of townhood in this game?Conveniently, this setup allows me to issue ultimatums (it lets you do so too).I'd say its townsided because the mafia has a hard time coming back from any mistake they make, thus the best strategy is to just have everyone generate lots of content and create the most opportunities for mafia to make mistakes. As for my ultimatum: I will not seriously vote for any player not engage in a meaningful discussion with the rest of the players. If you are less active but post on a regular basis with decent content that is fine.
I will not vote for any player who has not adequately outlined their position on the following (agreeing with another player is fine):
Is this setup townsided?
If not, is there any reason not to use the 'unlynchable martyr' technique and just have a town player claim, avoid lynches, and generate the lynches for the town using random.org (or w/e)?
Oh you mean when I asked all the active players a question, you weren't in the game then, if you want me to ask you a question fine How would you go about winning as scum right now.1. Then speculate on it.fillipk1. Hell if I know
Why did TDS unvote?
Why did Hector13 switch the post order of you and TDS? Was it really just an honest mistake caused by quoting while in the post window? Is there such a thing?
Why did Hector13 unvote?
Why am I asking you so many questions?
Why am I voting TheBiggerFish
2. Not likely an honest mistake as it was a super formatted post, thus the reason I think he did it was to try and change the narrative and see who went along with it, if TDS was scum he might have tried to promote the idea that he unvoted first and I'm the scum because of that, it was just another test which is what we should be doing all the time.
3. No reason to leave the vote on, he could be doing something else with his vote during the day to find scum and it makes it more convenient to do that if you are not voting.
4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
Oh and before I forget Hector13
2. Is TDS scum with Hector?
3. Why is being unvoted different from leaving your vote on yourself?
4. Actually, it's because of your activity pattern. Is this (activity pattern) a good or bad thing in my view?
5. Actually I'm voting TBF because out of the active players town stands the least to gain from his continued presence. I lean toward suspecting that he might be scum. Why am I voting for a player I lean toward suspecting to be scum?
fillipk
Why didn't you ask me a question?
Do you not care about finding out my role, say, because you already know it?
1. Oh please he claimed he was posting from his phonefillipkOh and before I forget Hector13
I don't like it when it's not immediately obvious why someone is voting for someone else.
You defended me over the weekend citing your thoughts on my reaction test (it wasn't a gambit as I had nothing to lose from someone else hammering me there) even though I hadn't really made them clear beyond "I don't think anyone is going to hammer anyone else during RVS" so you weren't really open to my thought process.
The vote could be an extension of that, but that seems a lot like buddying... particularly in light of your answer to question 2 from doll.
Your response to this contributes nothing other than literal WIFOM about whether or not a player was posting from phone, and even that you back away from almost straight away.
Why are you so desperate not to push on another player?
Why are you now voting Hector13?
I was posting using my phone at the time, and I was responding to TDS, so it was convenient for me to take the particular quote from the post that I had already quoted first, and then proceed to editing in fillipk's.No WIFOM created at all as i was explaining my thoughts behind answer two as I didn't have this piece of information when i answered it.
Can I just point out the stupidity of going after the person wanting to be unlynchable for being scum, especially before seeing Hector flip scum. This is literally just throwing shade at Doll for no good reason what so ever. What's Doll's plan now if she's scum, wait till there's like 3 people left and try to get herself lynched, never going to fly as she wanted to be unlynchable so she can't bring up anything about wanting to be lynched without looking scummy.Actually, my only plan for getting lynched now was to wait until there were three people (probably you, TDS, and myself) and get you to lynch me.
I mean what do you want me to speculate. I literately see no town reason for him to do such a thing, especially the way he did itSo was it a mistake or was it scummy?
One of them, yes. It also gives more information to analyze which helps us figure out who the scum are. So while being active isn't the end all to being town it prevents scum from hiding behind a low post count.Is TheBiggerFish or Imic scummier?
You never asked all players in the game a general question.1. Then speculate on it.Oh you mean when I asked all the active players a question, you weren't in the game then, if you want me to ask you a question fine How would you go about winning as scum right now.
2. Is TDS scum with Hector?
3. Why is being unvoted different from leaving your vote on yourself?
4. Actually, it's because of your activity pattern. Is this (activity pattern) a good or bad thing in my view?
5. Actually I'm voting TBF because out of the active players town stands the least to gain from his continued presence. I lean toward suspecting that he might be scum. Why am I voting for a player I lean toward suspecting to be scum?
fillipk
Why didn't you ask me a question?
Do you not care about finding out my role, say, because you already know it?
1. I did in this post
2. I'd go with yes now, seeing as Hector flipped scum, first off he backed off Hector without even saying he thought Hector was more scum just saying lol no after there was no possibility of a quick hammer. Second, as i pointed out at the top of the post he throws shade at Doll before Hector flips scum, in fact it was part of the last content of the day which could just be a coincidence. But since Doll is happy to claim unlynchable, and I'm happy to put her there implying Doll might be scum makes very little sense except to make the town trust Doll less.
3. Just personal preference the answer to that question was me putting my views on TBF, however I mostly had issue with this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161581.msg7343335#msg7343335) by TBF where he implies that he's just going to use his words to try and fine scum.
4. You seem to think its bad calling out my play as negative or anti-town due to lack of hunting, I'm not sure I agree with you when it comes down to a lack of hunting
5. I'd say its because you don't suspect him of being scum that much, after all your only leaning that way.... wait a minute TBF has done less hunting then me and your telling everyone I'm scum for less scum hunting, anything else you would like to add into why you think I'm scum?
No WIFOM created at all as i was explaining my thoughts behind answer two as I didn't have this piece of information when i answered it.Sure, except you never mentioned that at the time and that's not what I was calling you out on WIFOMing in.
dollHector13
Why did you quote TDS before fillipk in your post, when your post raises the concern of their similarity where the order of the posts is extremely important?
What makes the order of the posts important? I was addressing a similarity, so put the posts next to each other sans fluff so others could see it.
I was posting using my phone at the time, and I was responding to TDS, so it was convenient for me to take the particular quote from the post that I had already quoted first, and then proceed to editing in fillipk's.
Maybe I'm building a strawman of you as someone who is taking gambits and risks in an attempt to find scum. Or even if they weren't gambits in the first place they can be used as one and I'm crediting you with those, even if you didn't intend that. As for answer two, you never mentioned that you posted from phone so I am to assume you posted from a computer where you could format, thus the only reason you would put TDS first is if you were lazy or you were trying something, you don't seem lazy so I assumed you were trying something and thus I shared my thoughts on what that may be Anyway your my top pick for town right now, your reactions and answers have been too honest to be hiding something, that's why I'm voting for you.Except, I was wrong from the start.
I have to ask though, why wouldn't you take credit for the gambits I'm saying you did?
Defintiely scummy in my opinion, like you have called me out for it just creates WIFOM if or if not Doll was scum trying to get their scum buddy lynched or if they were town and made an honest mistake. When you consider the fact that it was the hammer vote it makes this even worse as we get to think about that during the night and probably focus our examinations on you instead of anyone else.I mean what do you want me to speculate. I literately see no town reason for him to do such a thing, especially the way he did itSo was it a mistake or was it scummy?
Until he responds to my question as to why he thinks I'm scum he is right now. but I don't have a read on Imic so that's why I suggested TBF to be lynched today. TBF has been playing this new town scummy style of low scum hunting, passive voting, almost active lurking that reads as new town or scum in my book, Its not any one singular action he took but all his actions which basically did nothing on day 1. I will update this after TBF responds a bit more.One of them, yes. It also gives more information to analyze which helps us figure out who the scum are. So while being active isn't the end all to being town it prevents scum from hiding behind a low post count.Is TheBiggerFish or Imic scummier?
Why?
Is TDS activelurking?
Neither has anyone else but you.You never asked all players in the game a general question.1. Then speculate on it.Oh you mean when I asked all the active players a question, you weren't in the game then, if you want me to ask you a question fine How would you go about winning as scum right now.
2. Is TDS scum with Hector?
3. Why is being unvoted different from leaving your vote on yourself?
4. Actually, it's because of your activity pattern. Is this (activity pattern) a good or bad thing in my view?
5. Actually I'm voting TBF because out of the active players town stands the least to gain from his continued presence. I lean toward suspecting that he might be scum. Why am I voting for a player I lean toward suspecting to be scum?
fillipk
Why didn't you ask me a question?
Do you not care about finding out my role, say, because you already know it?
1. I did in this post
2. I'd go with yes now, seeing as Hector flipped scum, first off he backed off Hector without even saying he thought Hector was more scum just saying lol no after there was no possibility of a quick hammer. Second, as i pointed out at the top of the post he throws shade at Doll before Hector flips scum, in fact it was part of the last content of the day which could just be a coincidence. But since Doll is happy to claim unlynchable, and I'm happy to put her there implying Doll might be scum makes very little sense except to make the town trust Doll less.
3. Just personal preference the answer to that question was me putting my views on TBF, however I mostly had issue with this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161581.msg7343335#msg7343335) by TBF where he implies that he's just going to use his words to try and fine scum.
4. You seem to think its bad calling out my play as negative or anti-town due to lack of hunting, I'm not sure I agree with you when it comes down to a lack of hunting
5. I'd say its because you don't suspect him of being scum that much, after all your only leaning that way.... wait a minute TBF has done less hunting then me and your telling everyone I'm scum for less scum hunting, anything else you would like to add into why you think I'm scum?
You asked TWS a truly trivial RVS question.
You only asked me a question, a despite my being a new and active player, after I prompted you, at a time when I am under policy-do-not-lynch.
The question you did ask me is pointless WIFOM, at a time when we're discussing actually relevant events.
Allow me to drill this into your mind:
I pick who comes with me into the final two.
If you are town, you lose (and so does everyone else).
If you are scum, you lose.
Convince me that you are town. Because that's not what you're doing right now.
2. Actually, TDS seemed to be considering the fact that I didn't actually claim unlynchable, just say that I would do so if necessary. You've forced me into the role of unlynchable now. If I could pick the final two, I would have had some doubt who else to put with you, but outside of a truly stellar game from now on it's you and me. If you're saying that yes, TDS is scum then that means that you think I'm not scum and yet you're tunneling me into being unlynchable.
Would you therefore accept a final two of you and TDS, knowing that that means that scum loses if he is scum?
4. A lack of hunting is anti-town. That's not why I picked up on you as scum, though.
5. Wrong.
I'll say it again.
I think that fillpk (that's you) is scum because he appeared to know that I was town.
A lack of scumhunting contributes to this thought.
Fun fact: you also started D1's lynch on scum.
Interesting, I didn't notice that, though I would like you to explain my thoughts if i was his scum buddy and i only focused on getting him lynched, what's my follow up plan to convince people that I'm not scum seeing as the only person I voted turned up scum. Whats my follow up plan, especially considering me and Hector would have been communicating all day and fleshing out this plan. You said it yourself Hector is a decent player, so even if I wasn't he would have helped me with this plan.Hector is a decent player so he took what he could get.
Just so its not just me how do the rest of you (Doll you should answer this too please) feel about making Doll unlynchable, explain why pleaseI don't intend to be lynched before the last day. This is so that I can keep you in the game.
The above is the core of my case against you.Quote from: mefillipk has confirmed multiple times that I am town in his mindFor clarification because this turns the lack of hunting into an actual scum slip rather than anti-town behavior, check this out:4. Probably because you think I'm [redacted] and want to confirm those suspicions or prove them wrong4. Yes, he stated blandly that I do not know his role in a mountainous game.
5. To try and get me to think you agree with him that I'm scum even though he has put out no evidence for that point, you could have your own reasons and if you do I'm sure to find them out now.
5. Yes, he actually said that.
fillipk has confirmed multiple times that I am town in his mind and his vote is on Hector13, so I know that he should have no problem with a Hector-Doll lynch order. If he changes his mind about me after slipping so strongly, I'll be even happier to assume he's scum.
Incidentally, my gut feeling is that Hector13 and fillipk have been acting like a corny mid-grade scumteam, the sort of thing you see in a BM where the better player ends up bussing the other fairly quickly due to legitimately hunting and pushing on their poor play. If this is true, then fillipk is still scum and all is good so long as we don't lynch him.
TDS you were last active Today which is more then 24 hours after I asked you for your reads. You made a post on the Games Threshold and Discussion List 4 hours after I asked you for reads within 24 hours so I'm pretty sure you saw it. So what gives?
TheDarkStar
Is there any chance that TheBiggerFish or Imic are scum?
doll - probably town due to activity and scumhunting, but I'm still worried because he/she sees a possibility of being lynched later on after claiming the unlynchable spot and directing lynch yesterday. As this game seems to be heading towards a day 4 with me/doll/fillipk, doll's vote will likely decide who wins.I'll comment here for clarity:
imic - Left, but I'm pretty sure he's town. If he was scum, he wouldn't have left so close to winning. He hasn't done all the much in general, though - if he's still alive to be replaced, I intend to question his replacement a lot.I can't disagree with any of this.
TBF - more town leaning, but he hasn't been that active today either.TheDarkStar
Is there any chance that TheBiggerFish or Imic are scum?
Imic - no, see my read.
TBF - we don't have much info from him and I'm much more comfortable with an imic lynch. Mostly, I'd like to see his reads.
Anyway, right now I think imic is the safest lynch for reasons stated above.
Sorry I didn't post at all today guys, was having a bit of a... Thing. Anything I need to do something about immediately tomorrow?Hammer Imic.
Just a reminder that Im still here and still looking for a body to fill a slot. Deadline is paused, and I may go asking around other sites if it gets bad enough. Sorry for the delay.((Put 'needs 1 replacement' in the title or something.))
So the three of us who least trusted each other (me/doll/fillipk) were all town :PI thought you were town, but I was of the opinion that if the scum was either Imic or TBF that they would be literally unreadable (they were) and there would have been no way to tell (there wasn't). While it was suspicious that there was no information on them, I never expected to have information on them.