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Author Topic: Dwarf Fortress Revised (v2.1.0 for v0.44.12) (Hiatus)  (Read 47337 times)

Taffer

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Dwarf Fortress Revised (v2.1.0 for v0.44.12) (Hiatus)
« on: December 10, 2016, 01:44:23 pm »

This is my editor's pass over Dwarf Fortress: I've rewritten the description of every creature in the game and collected bug fixes, name changes, combat improvements, and more. I want to make the game more pleasant to read and play, without straying too far from the original.

You'll need a v44.12 Dwarf Fortress installation. If you have a saved world, delete it.

You'll need to use a better text editor to edit these files in Windows.

DOWNLOAD & REPOSITORY

Your game might be more fun to read:
* every creature has a new description. (Taffer, Toothspit)
* there are far more words in the language files. (GoblinCookie & Amostubal)
* helpful tooltips explain many reactions. (Button, Meph, & Taffer)
* many creatures and items have simpler names. (Taffer & Deon)
* the text is edited throughout: for example, you smelt metal, you don't make it. (Taffer, Button, Dirst, & Deon)

Your game might be more fun to play:
* chitin yields chitin leather by default and scaly creatures yield scale leather; intestines can be dried and made into gut thread.(Taffer & Lofn)
* leather from furry creatures is called fur, leather from birds is called feather, and leather from humanoids is called hide. (Taffer)
* small creatures no longer yield leather; a few large creatures don't either, such as blizzard men and grimelings. (Taffer)
* weapons and armor now cost more, depending on the size of the item. (Sver)
* humanoids are mortal and have two genders, unless they're automatons. (Taffer)
* fruit seeds are edible to keep them from stockpiling, for better performance. (Doom Onion)
* organic materials rot, improving performance. Unnatural fire rots sputters out on its own. (Button, Sver, & Taffer)
* creatures that should have been mounts or beasts of burden now are. (Button)
* giant creatures that aged too quickly now live longer and are worth taming. (Anonymous & Taffer)
* goblins that live among their kind are playable in adventurer mode. (Taffer)
* creatures that were required to kill neutral characters now simply like to. (Anonymous & Taffer)
* arrows and bolts can be carved out of bone in adventure mode. (Wanderer)
* mussels and oysters provide pearls, like they're supposed to. (Button)
* many more creatures will steal food, items, and alcohol. Beware monkeys. (Warlord255)
* aquatic humanoids can survive on land and can be talked to. They have limbs, after all. (Warlord255)
* feather tree eggs can be gathered and eaten. (Button)
* oat beer can be brewed, not just dreamed of. (Button)
* buckets of water can be emptied. (Button)

There's fewer bugs:
* animal people don't lay eggs, avoiding the bugs associated. (Taffer)
* amphibious mounts are now war trainable instead: they kill anybody riding them. (Button)
* slow creatures and creatures that curl up are also bad mounts. (Button)
* color schemes with a blue-tinted green won't have blue vomit. (Taffer)
* fixed some creature products from being listed several times. (Button)
* tameable animals without CHILD tags can now be tamed. (Button)
* many creatures that couldn't be trained now can be, including all giant creatures. (Button)

Combat is better:
* weapons are better balanced and have different attacks. Read more about it here. (Sver)
* unarmed combat isn't as deadly anymore. Pick up a damn weapon. (Button, Taffer, & Sver)
* shoulders and hips are now considered 'internal limbs', separating limbs from the body by one step. Clothing and armor is adjusted to compensate. Necks and tails are now protected by default. (Taffer & Grimlocke)
* UBSTEP is capped at 3 to prevent body armor from protecting toes due to a bug. (Taffer)
* bodies aren't quite so fragile: skulls, joints, spine, muscle, sinew, and nerve is tougher, for example. Ribs protect more, and skin is thicker. (Sver, Grimlocke, & Taffer)
* internal organs and eyeballs bleed a lot more. (Sver, Grimlocke, & Taffer)
* fat has a slightly higher melting point. It also no longer bleeds and doesn't feel pain; this behaved poorly in high temperatures. (Sver)
* eyes are located above noses, which are located above mouths. Your throat is in front of your neck. (Taffer)
* several large spiders and spider people that couldn't trap with their web now can. (Button)
* bird people have had their talon scratch and kick attacks combined: both attacks already used feet. (Button)
* elves wield stronger—and more sensible—wooden weapons. (Coherent Weapons)
* creatures without claws or talons can't scratch. (Grimlocke & Taffer)
* many creatures with horns now head butt or gore with them. (Button)
* predators and violent humanoids won't easily run away. (Wanderer)
* compound eyes have a wider field of view. (Button)
* unlikely or unusual attacks are now used less often. (Button)
* giant predators eat dwarves, and many ambush prey. (Button)
* many tissues now heal naturally. (Button)
* many giant creatures can bite. (Button)
* most humanoids won't bite. (Taffer)
* plump helmet and sponge people now have knees and elbows. (Taffer)
* minotaurs are hooved. (Taffer)

Things have been fixed that you never would have noticed were broken:
* intelligent humanoids that were supposed to steal items now can't, to prevent them from turning around as soon as they arrive. (Warlord255)
* minor fixes to plants, from strawberries not being edible whole to many plants having pods. (Button)
* animal people and giant animals that spawn in pools spawn in lakes instead. (Button)
* many creature tags that shouldn't apply to animal variations now don't. (Button)
* some creatures can now be trained only for war or hunting, not both. (Button)
* mosquito men have a unique, non-bloodsucking probiscis attack. (Button)
* many previously common pets have been made into exotic pets. (Button)
* all plants either have obtainable seeds or baggable growths. (Button)
* giant animals and animal people always need to be butchered. (Button)
* anacondas and hungry heads are too small to eat dwarves. (Button)
* bark scorpions and their variations have mouths. (Button)
* a few creatures had teeth but didn't bite with them. (Button)
* litter sizes have been adjusted where appropriate. (Button)
* snail people and cave fish people are legless. (Button)
* several creatures that should have horns now do. (Button)
* animal people don't need to eat a specific food. (Button)
* animal people don't meander. (Button)
* animal people with legs can always jump. (Button)
* more insects are considered vermin. (Warlord255)
* toads, lice, and frogs are carnivores. (Button)
* seeds can be harvested from seedpods. (Button)
* many flying vermin hunters dive hunt. (Button)
* gremlins appear more often. (Warlord255)
* more creatures will eat vermin. (Warlord255)
* hippos and orcas aren't benign. (Button)
* magma crabs have crab bodies. (Button)
* worms can be found underground. (Button)
* guineafowl appear naturally in savanna, shrubland, desert, and grassland. (Button)
« Last Edit: April 26, 2019, 05:18:06 pm by Taffer »
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Taffer's Tilesets: better colours, improved yet faithful graphics.
Dwarf Fortress Revised: balance, fixes, and convenient features. Every creature has a better description!

Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for DF 0.43.05
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2016, 01:47:29 pm »

EDIT: I've closed the poll. I won't be making this change. Thank you so much to everyone who commented or voted!

It's pretty jarring (in my opinion) looking at what the game labels a "hyena man", only to realize that it's actually a "hyena woman". This has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with consistency.

I'm thinking of renaming all animal people to daemons, so that hyena man becomes hyena daemon, as does hyena woman. It would be consistent for all animal person variations. Another option, suggested by Teneb, is to rename them " hyena folk", or "eagle folk" . The automatons might be renamed from eg "gabbro man" to "gabbro golem", or I might leave them the way they are.

I'm very open to ideas here. I considered "djinni" but decided that was too exotic. "Hyena sprite" is great but I didn't think people would like that as much. "Hyena person" or "hyena humanoid" are both options but both seem a little forced.

What I'm fixing is shown below.

« Last Edit: March 13, 2019, 01:20:24 pm by Taffer »
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Taffer's Tilesets: better colours, improved yet faithful graphics.
Dwarf Fortress Revised: balance, fixes, and convenient features. Every creature has a better description!

WolfRaider

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised (0.43.05)
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2016, 02:08:19 pm »

Sounds interesting, but .zip file only contains readme file.
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised (0.43.05)
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2016, 02:13:26 pm »

Sounds interesting, but .zip file only contains readme file.

Oops! That's fixed now. Thank you!
« Last Edit: December 10, 2016, 02:55:45 pm by Taffer »
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Zerim

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Re: Dwarf Fortress *Revised* for 0.43.05
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2016, 08:16:32 am »

Quote
• nail scratch attacks have been removed entirely. Combatants without talons or claws scratching each other to death is silly. (Grimlocke)
 • bite attacks have been removed from most humanoids, with the exception of bird people, cat people, canine people, and a few bug people. Biting your opponent as a humanoid is silly. (Taffer)

I'm not sure how I feel about this. It's not silly, it's a desperate combat situation. Wrestling, being cornered, arms/legs are injured, they have more use than someone faffing around biting people.
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress *Revised* for 0.43.05
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2016, 10:22:45 am »

I'm not sure how I feel about this. It's not silly, it's a desperate combat situation. Wrestling, being cornered, arms/legs are injured, they have more use than someone faffing around biting people.

I know that it's probably one of the more controversial elements to my mod, but hear me out. They don't use those attacks only in desperate combat situations.

Nail scratches don't make sense to me: if you can scratch them you can also gouge or hit them. Almost by definition, if a creature has nails long enough to do much damage, we usually call it a claw or a talon. I can see somebody with long nails scratching an opponent in a desperate situation, but to be blunt I don't think the combat system "uses this attack responsibly". I'd rather have a slightly less realistic combat system that's better balanced and makes sense more often.

Humanoids will also bite even in situations when they shouldn't, and it can be absurdly powerful: as Grimlock reports here, bite attacks can sometimes just ignore armour. In the Dwarfmoot video, Tarn talks about one of his favourite bugs being a Hammerer with two broken arms that decided to bite his own arm off and carried it around in his mouth for months. That's just absurd: no dwarf should have a bite strong enough to bite a limb clean off, or have a jaw powerful enough to carry something heavy for months without tiring. This entire side of combat has always been a little silly, and personally I'd rather just remove it until Today fixes it.

This is a combat system that models noses, eyelids, and eyeballs, but then doesn't have helmets capable of protecting them. I'm just trying to make things as realistic as I can get away with, without adding new weapons or features. I originally wanted to remove bite attacks from the game, but I erred on the side of caution and only removed them from most humanoids. Many giant creatures actually have bite attacks added.

Thank you kindly for the feedback!
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 12:43:08 pm by Taffer »
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress *Revised* for 0.43.05
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2016, 11:13:17 pm »

After some git confusion, I've released version 1.1. Putnam's Microreduce has been integrated: it does a great job at easing some of the more annoying micro that can happen in Fortress mode. On second thought, I also removed the Fantastic module (secrets and curses, materials plus) for ease of maintenance. I decided that it didn't have much to do with the rest of the mod and that it wasn't worth maintaining separately from Putnam. This is still a great mod, so go try it! My 1.0.3 posted release is 1.1 with the Fantastic module intact, so if you appreciate the description updates and little fixes I made then you can still download it.

I also removed these minor fixes, reverting things to vanilla.

 • wooden blocks are now called planks. (Modest Mod) 
 • moon snails can now also be found in tropical biomes. (Modest Mod)
 • rabbits don't hibernate in the winter. (Modest Mod) 
 • swan, duck, and goose bites are no longer edged. (Modest Mod) 

Wooden blocks were still referred to as blocks by the workshop even before this change, and renaming them could be confusing. (It asks for a block but I only have these planks, do they count?) The moon snail and rabbit bugs might as well just be creative interpretation on Toady's part and are of little consequence. The swan, duck, and goose non-edged bites also didn't seem worth keeping, and certainly weren't mentioned in the bug tracker.

There are a few more minor fixes I'm on the fence about, but at least leopard gecko teeth and bark scorpion mouths also apply to animal people and giant variations.

If you're upset by these reverts, please let me know.
If you dislike any of the fixes that remain, please let me know.
If you have any feedback, please let me know.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2016, 11:59:33 pm by Taffer »
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burrito25man

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Re: Dwarf Fortress *Revised* 1.1 for 0.43.05
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2016, 02:09:24 pm »

Taffer you are a gentleman and a scholar. This is right along the lines of what I do myself, many thanks!  :D
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress *Revised* 1.1 for 0.43.05
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2016, 06:10:11 pm »

Taffer you are a gentleman and a scholar. This is right along the lines of what I do myself, many thanks!  :D

Thank you kindly, and you're welcome. If you have any comments or criticism, please let me know. I've had no input on this yet.

I'm hoping to put even more polish into this mod (and my tileset pack) in the next while. I'm finishing my rewritten creature descriptions (excruciatingly slow at times, there's just so many of them), and I'm already sitting on a new version. Just waiting for permission from a mod author before posting it.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2016, 06:17:27 pm by Taffer »
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2016, 10:10:34 pm »

Another release (1.2), this time to bring Coherent Weapons into the flock. I stupidly waited a while for permission from Jazzpirat!, completely failing to notice that permission was already given in the last sentence of the post. Thank you, Jazzpirat!

I'm slightly hesitant about this release: I'm worried that I diverged too much from vanilla with the changes to elven weapons. I'm happy to revert things if people request it. I don't mind straying some from the game's lore, but I don't intend to stray far. I consider rebalancing to be an important part of the mod though, and I've considered elves to be weak in the past. This also gives them a neat flavour, in my opinion. Let me know if you disagree.

Also, notably, bone arrows and bone bolts can now be crafted in Adventure mode. I'm not going to add more Adventure mode interactions unless they're requested, but ammunition really can be scarce at times in adventure mode.

I might have missed something obvious during testing of course, so speak up if I'm wrong about something.

Major Combat Improvements
 • elves now siege and wield better—and more primitive—weapons such as clubs, specialized spears, and atlatls. (Coherent Weapons) 

Minor Combat Improvements
 • long swords have an increased minimum size requirement for one-handed use, a greater contact area when slashing, and also have a new half-sword attack. (Coherent Weapons) 
 • scimitars are larger, and slashing with them is more forceful and has a greater contact area. (Coherent Weapons) 
 • short swords and spears have smaller contact areas. Short swords penetrate better. (Coherent Weapons) 
 • whips have been weakened by increasing their contact area and need more material to be created. (Coherent Weapons) 

Major Bugfixes & Improvements
 • bone arrows and bone bolts can now be carved in adventure mode. (Wanderer) 
« Last Edit: December 22, 2016, 12:43:16 am by Taffer »
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2017, 02:08:52 pm »

Another update. I rewrote many of the comments. Every comment prefix has been changed from "Revised" to "Revision".

The following fixes have been reverted. I want the included fixes to improve gameplay, not simply make things "more realistic". Most weren't documented in the description.

  • leopard geckos no longer have teeth, just like vanilla.
  • sheep are back to having horn gore attacks, rather than new head butt attacks.
  • whether flies are water vermin or not is of little consequence, so they now spawn in pools again.
  • hippos now gore again, not bite.
  • giant tortoise bites are no longer edged, just like vanilla.
  • magma crabs are no longer trainable, just like vanilla. (How would they survive away from magma?)
  • purring maggots products aren't available for embark anymore, just like vanilla. As mentioned in the modest thread, this was a deliberate change by Toady.
  • ostriches, cassowaries, grey parrots, and emus no longer have talons, just like vanilla.
  • if it's benign in vanilla, it's now still benign in Revised. If it's not benign in vanilla, it's not benign in Revised. I'd rather defer to Toady than realism here.

A few changes were made for consistency.

  • I'd forgotten some of Wanderer's NOFEAR and DISCIPLINE changes, so I've remedied that.
  • goblins can no longer bite, just like most humanoids in Revised.

There's more that I wanted to do, and more that I wanted to revert. I decided I was being too aggressive, however, so this release is significantly scaled back from the original release. None of this made it in, but it's still being considered:

  • I integrated, tested, and improved Wanderer's tiered and standardized leather and standardized wool. Reverting it again was painful.
  • the domestication changes were almost all reverted, but I decided to keep them in. They do improve gameplay.

Please consider letting me know why you're using⸺or not using⸺Revised, and how you want me to proceed. I'm trying to balance contradictory goals of "balance" and "minimalism", and I'm not sure how far to go in either direction.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2017, 05:02:00 pm by Taffer »
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Dwarf Fortress Revised: balance, fixes, and convenient features. Every creature has a better description!

Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2017, 01:17:06 am »

In the off-chance somebody's paying attention, what do people think about more generic animal names? Deon's "Essential DF" did something similar. I'm not interested in standardizing materials, but simplifying some of the names would make many leather products less ridiculous sounding. There's no reason why somebody in-universe would name storks "white storks", rather than just "storks", given that there's only one kind of them.

For example:
  • red-winged blackbirds would become blackbirds
  • white storks would become storks
  • grey parrots would become parrots (or at least gray parrots)
  • brown recluse spiders become recluse spiders
  • monarch butterflies become butterflies
  • peach-faced lovebirds become lovebirds (masked lovebirds remain masked lovebirds)

In other news, I'm still working on the creature descriptions. Yes, it's taking me many months. No ETA yet, but the end is in sight if I continue working on it well.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2017, 10:08:49 am by Taffer »
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Dwarf Fortress Revised: balance, fixes, and convenient features. Every creature has a better description!

Grimlocke

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2017, 03:49:24 pm »

Heh, it seems your running into some of the problems I ran into with my own mod, in that adjusting the game's balance very quickly causes a sprawl of modifications all throughout the vanilla raw files.

One way of balancing this out is splitting the mod into modules, preferably at points where it won't be too much work to keep them separate.

As for reduced animal names, it might be a nice lighter weight alternative to material standardization mods (for the purpose of less silly names). I would probably use it, but it will be quite a lot of different vanilla file edits so compatibility could end up being a hassle. A middle route would be to leave the creature names, and only rename the leather material adjective. For instance by changing 'white-faced gibbon leather' to just 'gibbon leather'. By only changing the adjective, it should still show up as 'white faced gibbon leather' in stocks or when its a tanned hide item. This approach would save you from having to decide which gibbon is going to be 'generic gibbon'.

Fake edit: Changing just the creature adjective name might have the same effect and extend to meat, bone, misc items as well. (so [NAME:white-browed gibbon:white-browed gibbons:gibbon])

Actual edit: Changing the creature name adjective does not work :(

None of that will make things like chicken leather cloaks any less silly, but it would be one step forward.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2017, 03:54:35 pm by Grimlocke »
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NedeN

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2017, 02:23:02 am »

I'm not sure if you're aware, or maybe it is just me, but I can't seem to target an individual for conversation [k]. So went to vanilla DF to double check and it works fine. All I get in this mod is the option to "begin performance", "shout out to everybody", and the deity option.
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Taffer

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Re: Dwarf Fortress Revised for 0.43.05
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2017, 04:05:33 pm »

I'm not sure if you're aware, or maybe it is just me, but I can't seem to target an individual for conversation [k]. So went to vanilla DF to double check and it works fine. All I get in this mod is the option to "begin performance", "shout out to everybody", and the deity option.

It's just you. I can target people for conversation with [k]. I just tested an elf, a goblin, and a dwarf: I only lack those options when mousing over things I can't speak with. Are you using 0.43.05? Are you using any other mods?

Thank you kindly for commenting!
« Last Edit: February 27, 2017, 04:37:31 pm by Taffer »
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Dwarf Fortress Revised: balance, fixes, and convenient features. Every creature has a better description!
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