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Author Topic: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-36 Decisions, Decisions  (Read 320305 times)

Angle

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2010 on: April 17, 2015, 08:14:33 pm »

Yeah, that's a good idea. We'll probably need to take a moment to build empathy with it in order to do so, however. Anyone have any idea on how to do that?
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Parisbre56

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2011 on: April 17, 2015, 08:33:12 pm »

We don't want to use command undead without examining the thing first, perhaps using see vitality to ensure it doesn't have anything non necromantic in it. Could even ask Eko if he has any divinations that could help. Commanding it is just wasting mana.
But if we do command it, we should first check its previous orders.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2015, 08:34:58 pm by Parisbre56 »
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Andres

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2012 on: April 17, 2015, 08:50:48 pm »

We should definitely See Vitality just to get a better understanding of the thing before we do anything with it. Get Eko to bring Omo's body to us. Omo's body is probably lighter than the thing's and we'll need the body on hand if we need to do an emergency soul transfer.
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monk12

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2013 on: April 17, 2015, 10:15:47 pm »

Yes! Still alive! I was so afraid to click the link, thinking I might find a giant "YOU ARE DEAD! PLAY AGAIN? Y/N".

Don't worry, I promise you were never in danger of seeing that screen. Of course, that's because it would have said "YOU ARE DEAD! THANKS FOR PLAYING!" instead, so maybe you should still be a little afraid.

But Omo is still in danger.

Probably either see vitality or command undead... We could use see vitality to compare its vitality with things around that, but we're not sure if that will work or provide anything immediately useful. Probably better to focus on Omo. But we don't want to waste too much mana... I need to think about this. If the thing starts destroying Omo's soul...

Wait, when you say new, you mean it wasn't there before or that we couldn't see how intricate it was before?

When I say new, I mean you did not notice it at all on your previous glimpse.

RAM

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2014 on: April 18, 2015, 02:27:16 am »

I am in favour of casting see vitality, it is cheap, may reveal things we have missed, particularly souls, and we may be able to improve the spell, or learn an improved version, now that we have such a complex specimen.
If we can locate Omo's soul, then attempt to return it directly, learning whatever method is necessary.
 If we cannot locate Omo's soul, then Attempt to control the beasty and have it cease any soul processing and perhaps release its most recent food.

Also, avoid manhandling it too much. It is still armed, and may be able to make sufficient inferences by way of whatever faculties remain to initiate an attack. Also note that if its weapons are disabled then it cannot simply reverse the process that it used to take the soul.
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Andres

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2015 on: April 18, 2015, 02:36:47 am »

If we cannot locate Omo's soul, then Attempt to control the beasty and have it cease any soul processing and perhaps release its most recent food.
-1! Oh my god! Its current "soul processing" might be the thing keeping the soul inside its body (unless I missed something in the update and it is tearing it apart) and simply getting it to release the soul would leave it free in the open air where it would stick around as a ghost at best or move on at worst. "Releasing" is not an option. Grabbing it and manipulating it around like we would vitality would be safer.
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Deep Waters

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2016 on: April 18, 2015, 09:46:10 am »

Everyone else has already suggested the sort of things I would suggest, so let's keep it relatively simple while hopefully covering all our bases: Examine the creature's vitality more closely, paying special attention to anything that might allow us to separate the more intricate ball of vitality from the rest of the creature without harming the ball (perhaps checking to make sure the vitality ball isn't interconnected with the creature's vitality network in any way, and if so taking note of weak points in the connections in the hopes we can sever them cleanly). Also, ask Eko if he can do any divinations on it.

Do not do anything that would reveal our nature just yet-- not only could we potentially cause problems if we rush into things without having the slightest hint of what we're doing, but we don't know how Eko would react. Let's not risk revealing ourselves unless it's necessary. However, if the creature appears to be affecting the ball in any way (destroying it, processing it, etc.), immediately try commanding it to stop. Saving Omo's soul is ultimately more important than our secret.

A few side notes: Those two knobs on the side of its head that are similar to eyes may be its ears. At least, that would explain how well it navigated even without its eyes. I'm tempted to say we should impair those too, just to be safe, but we have our mana reserves to think of... Furthermore, where was the construct trying to run to? Was it following orders to retreat to some predefined safe area if injured, or does it have some rudimentary survival instincts?
« Last Edit: April 18, 2015, 09:53:01 am by Deep Waters »
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Angle

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2017 on: April 18, 2015, 11:45:19 am »

Oh, be careful. There may be more of these things.
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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2018 on: April 18, 2015, 05:24:34 pm »

A few side notes: Those two knobs on the side of its head that are similar to eyes may be its ears. At least, that would explain how well it navigated even without its eyes. I'm tempted to say we should impair those too, just to be safe, but we have our mana reserves to think of... Furthermore, where was the construct trying to run to? Was it following orders to retreat to some predefined safe area if injured, or does it have some rudimentary survival instincts?

This is an interesting question. The fact that it tried to run in a specific direction no matter how hard it had to try to get around an obstacle seems to suggest that it does have a "lair" somewhere. We should note the direction it was fleeing to maybe investigate later after we get things sorted here. On the other hand the enormous complexity of the energy within the construct, on par with a living person's brain, could suggest some sort of specialized but rudimentary intelligence.

It's attack was very programmatic, it came at us from the center of the forest at full speed then attacked the one closest to it: Omo. It presumably intended to do that until we were all downed. But attacking tiny groups of travelers stupid enough to go into the forest wasn't its original purpose. It was put into Aloclesno to destroy Girus the Fox's army: a large group of organized, seasoned, heavily armed Imperial soldiers. Eko broke the construct pretty effectively on his own with his reservist's spear and minimal training (I grant that it was blind and in ill repair) and its attack has enough of a cooldown for us to charge it alone, suggesting it could have been destroyed if it was attacked en masse. An open attack on the army's camp would have been incredibly risky for it but it still managed to attack dozens of men overnight, presumably as they slept or stood watch at the perimeter. That requires stealth and planning to avoid detection, and those both require intelligence. Maybe it hides out in the center of the forest to more quickly reach intruders now, but it operated more fluidly back in the day because its circumstances were different.

It really shows just how skilled Balkoth was to be able to create something like this, but it also raises the question of why would he make something as convoluted (and apparently reversible) as this when the golem could have just killed those men for the same effect? Was it psychological warfare, simple cruelty, or is there more going on here?
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Angle

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2019 on: April 18, 2015, 05:45:02 pm »

Yeah, I have a definite suspicion there are more of these things. We should try and get it inside a ward post-haste.
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Parisbre56

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2020 on: April 21, 2015, 07:09:58 am »

Hm... Could those two knobs be some sort of long range detection method? We know that see vitality tends to be rather limited in range and we know the knobs did not help it navigate through the forest and we know that they somehow knew it the moment we were out of the necromantic-senses-blocking ward. They could be pointing at complex living things like a compass but not giving their exact range or position. Like a radar or those dual antennas they use to find animals they tag with transponders.

Or it could simply help it find its way through he forest, like a GPS, pointing it towards that centre it was running towards.

About actions.... I'll suggest a compromise.

First of all, how did the creature's vitality change during all this? Did it gain any (that we could notice, anyway) when it took Omo's soul? Did it loose any when we impaired it or when Eko hit it?

Eko has a lot of spare mana he is not using. So while we work on the creature, he creates a ward for this area. That should keep us safe from any other creatures that could possibly exist nearby. After that, he can go get Omo (or we can go get him if Eko is not done). I'm saying we should do that because the casting time for a ward will probably be less than carrying the monster back to our current ward.

If he can cast the spell quickly, he should also use detect magic on it, just in case he can sense more than one magic sources in it (meaning there is perhaps another spell or enchantment or similar on the creature).

If possible and necessary (that means, if there's any chance of the creature escaping the area in the next 20 minutes), use that rope Omo is carrying to chain the monster to a nearby tree or other sturdy object to ensure it doesn't get away. If there's no chance of it escaping while we try to gain the empathy needed to cast command undead, then wait and do this after trying command undead if we have not managed to stop it. If Omo and his rope is not back yet, then see if we could use a belt or some clothing something, in case we're lucky and it's really close to something that looks sturdy. Try not to touch the golem while doing so (do something like making a noose and then pulling. Nym was a fisherelf, she should know a thing or two about knots). Make sure to note the direction it is going towards, since it could become important later.

Try using command undead again. Maybe use a stick to poke those flaps and get a better look at its insides in order to gain better empathy. Our goal to get an idea of what its orders, memories and capabilities are and to stop it from trying to escape and to stop it from doing anything bad to Omo's soul if possible and to see if it has any limbs or necromantic ropes or similar that could be used to restore Omo's soul.

When Omo is back (or when we bring him back) we should use see vitality to inspect the vitality inside the creature and inside Omo and find where their connecting points are. We should focus on the complex necromantic energy in the "body" of the creature, since that's more likely to be his soul. Then work on transferring that INTACT by maintaining the necromantic energy that holds the network together and enhancing it if need be and then transferring that to Omo's head and connecting it to the appropriate points (use necromantic energy to strengthen the connections if possible, if it looks like they are not re-established automatically). Remember, we don't want an amorphous blob of vitality, we want to preserve its structure. Use the creature if it would help.

If at any point during all this we are low on mana and can't be confident we can continue without hurting ourselves (assume that soul transfer will take twice the MP of steal vitality) drink that mana potion.

Obviously, stop if any of the above assumptions turn out wrong. No need to transfer the golem's soul into Omo's.
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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2021 on: April 21, 2015, 07:33:05 am »

Too much bold text.
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Iituem

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2022 on: April 25, 2015, 04:37:08 pm »

Re-read through the whole thing in one go.  Love this story.  :B
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monk12

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-28
« Reply #2023 on: April 27, 2015, 12:30:09 pm »

Everyone else has already suggested the sort of things I would suggest, so let's keep it relatively simple while hopefully covering all our bases: Examine the creature's vitality more closely, paying special attention to anything that might allow us to separate the more intricate ball of vitality from the rest of the creature without harming the ball (perhaps checking to make sure the vitality ball isn't interconnected with the creature's vitality network in any way, and if so taking note of weak points in the connections in the hopes we can sever them cleanly). Also, ask Eko if he can do any divinations on it.

Do not do anything that would reveal our nature just yet-- not only could we potentially cause problems if we rush into things without having the slightest hint of what we're doing, but we don't know how Eko would react. Let's not risk revealing ourselves unless it's necessary. However, if the creature appears to be affecting the ball in any way (destroying it, processing it, etc.), immediately try commanding it to stop. Saving Omo's soul is ultimately more important than our secret.

A few side notes: Those two knobs on the side of its head that are similar to eyes may be its ears. At least, that would explain how well it navigated even without its eyes. I'm tempted to say we should impair those too, just to be safe, but we have our mana reserves to think of... Furthermore, where was the construct trying to run to? Was it following orders to retreat to some predefined safe area if injured, or does it have some rudimentary survival instincts?
We should definitely See Vitality just to get a better understanding of the thing before we do anything with it. Get Eko to bring Omo's body to us. Omo's body is probably lighter than the thing's and we'll need the body on hand if we need to do an emergency soul transfer.


   "This is the Curse of Aloclesno?" Eko asks uneasily, edging towards the struggling golem. He seems to be out of his element and unsure how to proceed. "I somehow expected more."
   "We're not out of the forest yet." You say decisively. "Let's drag this over to Omo; or better yet, let's bring Omo over here. He probably weighs less than this metal hulk."

   You join Eko in grabbing Omo's limp body by the legs, dragging him over the forest floor. The construct continues its pitiful escape attempts, churning the earth as it drags itself away by inches. With one last pull you lay Omo's body on his back near the construct, his sightless eyes staring at the canopy. You turn away, taking a deep calming breath. It's alright. You can fix this.

   "Okay." You say quietly. "I hope- I think this thing is holding on to Omo's soul, but we need to be sure. Can you cast that spell to check? Diagnosis?"
   "I have nothing to lose by trying." Eko replies. He slips one hand inside a pocket on his pack, withdrawing a stick of white chalk. He hesitates over the construct, then begins tracing his triangle and circle symbol, flinching away whenever the creature lurches forward.

   While Eko begins his spell, you begin casting your own. Casting See Vitality fails to reveal any new insights into the workings of the construct itself, but it does give you a fine basis for comparison between Eko and Omo. Omo's vitality strongly resembles that of the soulless children; a limp ripple trickling from his head, in comparison to the strong surge you can observe in Eko. Like the children, Omo lacks what Ado and Eko have; a bizarre, churning concentration of vitality writhing like a mass of snakes.

   Looking at them side by side, that mass of vitality bears more than a passing resemblance to what you can see in the heart of the construct. They are both immensely convoluted, seeming to turn in on themselves in odd bends and swirls yet almost with a suggestion of underlying order, like an unbelievably intricate knot. Though it does not exactly replicate what you can see in Eko, it is close enough for you to think they must be of a kind.

   However, there are two important differences between what you can see in Eko and what you can see in the construct. The first is that while Eko's ball of vitality is an intrinsic piece of his overall vitality network, the ball in the construct is almost a separate entity; it does not send pulses of vitality to the rest of the construct, nor does vitality flow back into it. The second is that Eko's vitality ball seems... unconstrained. It is a natural pattern within his vitality. The vitality within the construct, however, is bound completely by the same sort of Necromantic energy that gives shape to the vitality in the rest of the construct. While you don't know what gives Eko's vitality its shape, you are confident you could impair the Necromantic energy in the heart of the construct and the vitality within would flow away, losing cohesion and form. You doubt it would maintain its pattern the way Eko's seems to. If the construct's ball of vitality is in the shape of a bottle, then so is Eko's, but without the bottle. You don't see an empty bottle in Omo to fill.

   You take another look at the Necromantic Energy forming the rest of the construct. Unlike the zombies you've encountered which mainly had their "tubes" of Necromantic energy enveloped entirely within the body of the corpse, the construct seems to have a thin web of Necromantic energy across the exterior of the bronze body. The body only, and not the legs which as expected have their Necromantic energy located in the core. You do not know if the construct has some mechanism to open itself to pass the "soul-ball" of vitality through- perhaps the denser stuff near the head- but you are confident that you could impair enough of the construct's "skin" to create a passage you could use.

   "Nym..." Eko says warily, unsure of himself. "This thing is unlike any vitality network I've examined before. It seems simpler in some ways, but there are other things I simply do not recognize."
   "Is there anything that looks like a soul to you?" You ask intently.
   Eko runs a hand through his thin hair. "I don't... maybe. There's something in the heart of this monster that feels like a soul, but it is faint, very faint, almost incomplete." Eko shakes his head, scowling in frustration. "You said that you were a Life Mage; surely you know better than I!"
   Technically you never said any such thing, but you are in no rush to correct that particular misconception. "I felt the same thing. I think that must be the key." You say more confidently than you feel.
   Eko clenches his fists, taking an unconscious step towards you. "Then you can save him! The monster doesn't win this time!"

   You lick your lips nervously, somewhat taken aback by Eko's vehemence. Can you find a way to save Omo? You sense that a mistake here could be costly.

Spoiler: You (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Your Spells (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Omo Thunderjaw (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Eko Cleanvise (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Eko's Spells (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Notable Figures (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Planned Experiments (click to show/hide)
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endlessblaze

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Re: You are a Necromancer! Chapter 2-29
« Reply #2024 on: April 27, 2015, 12:36:39 pm »

establish empathy. do this by picturing us as the creature, hunting souls in accordance with its directive. if we can empathize with a rope, we can empathize with a soul stealing construct.

then using emotions and mental images order it to return omo's soul
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