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Author Topic: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics  (Read 57560 times)

Duuvian

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #600 on: January 12, 2025, 11:45:17 am »

Newspaper for sale, any buyers?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/10/telegraph-sale-process-house-arrest/

I want to say that I usually skip over the opinions on the Telegraph because the headlines alone are somewhere between usually and nearly always making me want lettuce. That's the opinion section though; while articles are also leaning some of the time in a political direction, in the year or so I've had it bookmarked the newspaper does however cover military procurement in particular rather well without seeming overtly political in this subject (I would be concerned more about supply-side in these but I haven't seen much out of the ordinary from my limited experience as an article reader, and the articles are well written and have supporting information that does not conflict with what little I am aware of), so I kept it bookmarked.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2025, 12:25:42 pm by Duuvian »
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FINISHED original composition:
https://app.box.com/s/jq526ppvri67astrc23bwvgrkxaicedj

Sort of finished and awaiting remix due to loss of most recent song file before addition of drums:
https://www.box.com/s/s3oba05kh8mfi3sorjm0 <-zguit

Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #601 on: January 12, 2025, 01:41:59 pm »

Newspaper for sale, any buyers?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/10/telegraph-sale-process-house-arrest/

I want to say that I usually skip over the opinions on the Telegraph because the headlines alone are somewhere between usually and nearly always making me want lettuce. That's the opinion section though; while articles are also leaning some of the time in a political direction, in the year or so I've had it bookmarked the newspaper does however cover military procurement in particular rather well without seeming overtly political in this subject (I would be concerned more about supply-side in these but I haven't seen much out of the ordinary from my limited experience as an article reader, and the articles are well written and have supporting information that does not conflict with what little I am aware of), so I kept it bookmarked.
LOL OSBORNE

He rainmakered them. "Yes wealthy Abu Dhabi family, I am a respected Tory politician. Give me a blank cheque and I'll make sure it rains"

"Ah yes, I know it's not raining yet, but if you give me more money, it'll surely rain"

"Well yes, there were rains, but only a light rain. I'm telling you, I'm making real progress with the rain - just a few more £££ and the torrential downpours are just around the corner!"

*EDIT
Another MP arrested for alleged noncery
« Last Edit: January 12, 2025, 01:54:24 pm by Loud Whispers »
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Starver

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #602 on: January 13, 2025, 11:19:02 am »

*EDIT
Another MP arrested for alleged noncery
Ex-MP, as of a while ago. And, more recently, ex- of his party.

Whether or not the above predilictions were the reason for that latter part of his ex-ness, we don't really know. It could be separate, or non-chargable rumours (which would have been open to a charge of defamation, if voiced openly, leaving those who dealt with dismissal in an awkward situation).

If it was to go against the proposed new law (which the Opposition are trying to strategically[1] quash/corrupt, for their own reasons) of enforcing the reporting of certain crimes, then it starts to look bad for the now-Government to have to have had a third-party 'sting operation' make it actionable, though there's no reason to suppose that he indeed hadn't been having an eye kept on him, until he actually got this careless/unlucky to be caught out sufficiently...


In non-political UK news... Double-digit temperatures, pretty much (with rain on the way, at least over here). And not more than a couple of days since it was negative-double-digits! (Without looking out of the windows, I might not actually know which drips that I'll be hearing on them[2] are from rain, against the ones that have been coming from the thawing over the last 24hours-ish.)


[1] Was going to say "hypocritically". But they were trying to quash it when it was their law to pass, so it's actually fairly consistent, and the hypocrisy is really only in how they're framing everyone else as not doing what they already were effectively trying to make not happen... Which is business as usual. Ah, politics. Such a fun game!

[2] Well, not on the windows. But water trickling off from various upper-windows windowsills tend to land on some of the lower-window windowsills and transmit the racket they produce inside, sometimes as if my guttering was failing (which it isn't).
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Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #603 on: January 13, 2025, 12:36:05 pm »

Ex-MP, as of a while ago. And, more recently, ex- of his party.

Whether or not the above predilictions were the reason for that latter part of his ex-ness, we don't really know. It could be separate, or non-chargable rumours (which would have been open to a charge of defamation, if voiced openly, leaving those who dealt with dismissal in an awkward situation).

If it was to go against the proposed new law (which the Opposition are trying to strategically[1] quash/corrupt, for their own reasons) of enforcing the reporting of certain crimes, then it starts to look bad for the now-Government to have to have had a third-party 'sting operation' make it actionable, though there's no reason to suppose that he indeed hadn't been having an eye kept on him, until he actually got this careless/unlucky to be caught out sufficiently...
Yeah I also don't know how it'll affect the prosecution case given the involvement of vigilantes. IDK what the status is on our entrapment laws here. But then again, he's already beansed himself with the jury if he really was showing up to meet up with someone he thought was a 15 year old boy wearing a trench coat and baseball cap, and it seems if he was kicked out of the party before, he was probably already under investigation

In non-political UK news... Double-digit temperatures, pretty much (with rain on the way, at least over here). And not more than a couple of days since it was negative-double-digits! (Without looking out of the windows, I might not actually know which drips that I'll be hearing on them[2] are from rain, against the ones that have been coming from the thawing over the last 24hours-ish.)
Aw yeah. Don't need to dress like a victorian gentleman indoors to stave off the cold malevolent spirits of Christmas past. Now it's by choice

[1] Was going to say "hypocritically". But they were trying to quash it when it was their law to pass, so it's actually fairly consistent, and the hypocrisy is really only in how they're framing everyone else as not doing what they already were effectively trying to make not happen... Which is business as usual. Ah, politics. Such a fun game!
My favourite UK political gaffa was a Tory MP who helped squash the legal aid to have your legal fees paid if you were falsely accused of committing a crime. Later on he was accused, found not guilty on all accounts and forced to sell his house to pay the legal fees

Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #604 on: February 23, 2025, 09:07:27 pm »

Conscription; yey or ney?

My opposition is twofold:
1. The armed forces do not want conscription. They want enough active personnel and war machines to make it through the next 20 years with the ability to deploy anywhere in the world. Adding millions of 4 year contracted conscripts with rifles would significantly expand costs without any increase in budget to accommodate 21st century warfare. Every officer I've spoken to said they prefer people who want to be there over wrangling people who want to run away, which yeah, no shit. Just feels like the government keeps ignoring the armed forces every time they ask for more tanks or destroyers, offering them instead teenagers that they'll have to pay for out of budget.
All because the labour party picked up the tory manifesto and believed war cabinet = popularity. Our defence procurement strategy is just an incoherent mess where in the last 15 years we've had a PM say we don't need tanks because there'll never be a land war in europe, had a chancellor of the exchequer ask if the royal marines need marine warfare capabilities or ask how aeroplanes launch off carriers, it just does not make sense to make a complete departure from the expeditionary model of the armed forces when the budget remains limited

2. The young lad makes a good point on values. Wtf would young people be dying for? What are they dying to protect? The FTSE 500? The aristocratic landholders? Both the MP and the older chap, neither of whom have fought in any wars, are the ones telling the younger generation to suck it up and die in order to protect a society where they are not stakeholders. It rubs me the wrong way when the people who have grown up in times of unexampled prosperity tell the young they deserve to pay the bill for a party they weren't invited to. The argument that loyalty matters more than self-interest falls apart when you try to extent loyalty to that which has no loyalty.
You can't be loyal to a company, you can't be loyal to a government, nor an economy, you can only be loyal to people. The generations of 1939 fought for their people. The younger generations can see that whether in times of peace or war, we are not fighting for them. Why would we still ask them to fight for us? It's like how I felt with the whole clap for the NHS heroes shit. I was a terrible cynical grinch throughout the whole thing because I thought they were treating us for fools. Do not clap for everyone we lost, their sacrifices were not necessary. If you gave firefighters flammable uniforms you wouldn't applause their deaths as noble. Sure enough, the moment the pandemic was over, nurses became unskilled and doctors lazy. The hypocrisy of the ideal servants and ideal masters; the servants are disloyal and lacking in values when they ask for a roof over their head in exchange for their sacrifice, but the masters are noble and sacrificing when they offer the sacrifices of everyone but themselves.

Could probably add a finer point on whether the UK's foreign policy has served the UK's interests in a loooooooooooong time.

"The year is 1842. Britain's exhausted troops are withdrawing Afghanistan from for the last time."

"The year is 1880. Britain's exhausted troops are withdrawing from Afghanistan for the last time."

"The year is 1919. Britain's exhausted troops are withdrawing from Afghanistan for the last time."

"The year is 2021. Britain's exhausted troops are withdrawing from Afghanistan for the last time."


I find there is just such a disconnect between the dailymail generation that decries everyone else for their lack of patriotism, sacrifice and loyalty. Meanwhile we can only watch when our government betrays those who fought and died for us. I remember watching this debate where they were arguing over whether doctors and nurses were paid enough. The government advisor started waffling on about how a royal navy underwater anti-mine warfare specialist was only paid £28,000 despite doing incredibly dangerous, difficult, taxing and high-skilled work.

Pay that guy more then?

ChairmanPoo

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #605 on: February 23, 2025, 10:20:10 pm »

Quote
It's like how I felt with the whole clap for the NHS heroes shit. I was a terrible cynical grinch throughout the whole thing because I thought they were treating us for fools. Do not clap for everyone we lost, their sacrifices were not necessary. If you gave firefighters flammable uniforms you wouldn't applause their deaths as noble. Sure enough, the moment the pandemic was over, nurses became unskilled and doctors lazy. The hypocrisy of the ideal servants and ideal masters; the servants are disloyal and lacking in values when they ask for a roof over their head in exchange for their sacrifice, but the masters are noble and sacrificing when they offer the sacrifices of everyone but themselves.

QFT
Not only the (British) NHS.
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martinuzz

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #606 on: February 23, 2025, 10:28:12 pm »

This age requires a new form of conscription.
Like, students remotely controlling drones and killing a few hundred people a week as a side job next to uni.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #607 on: February 23, 2025, 10:37:58 pm »

This age requires a new form of conscription.
Like, students remotely controlling drones and killing a few hundred people a week as a side job next to uni.
HL2 manhack lore

Starver

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #608 on: March 04, 2025, 09:39:46 am »

Haven't really wanted to talk about this too much, I don't want to scare our own host too much (if he's not already openly aware and considering if it applies to him then I'd rather he have deniable ignorance of the matter while he picks up on the connotations regarding B12), but one of my other haunts just got (imminently) hit by UK law: https://urbandead.com/shutdown.html

Edit: Hmmm, probably says a lot about me that only the above is what drive me to break my typical usual silence on this matter, rather than merely internally SMHing.

My current presence there is almost fifteen years old. That was a login created after two or three years absent, the forgotten (both password and username) original must have joined within months of it starting up (and I had a Borehamwood(?) account there, during the time of that spin-off "no revives" map).

Can I imagine 'issues' with the wide-open nature of interactions and sign-ups? Yes. Have I ever seen anything that looks like a Nut of the kind the legal Sledgehammer involved was designed for? No. Moreover, can I imagine anybody successfully grooming anyone on that platform? No. Especially given that prospective 'victims' are largely indistinguishable from far more savvy members of the playerbase, so a predatory login is going to find it hard not to wade through plenty of targets that are as likely to be able to reverse the deception, and out-gambit them, as anything.

Really, there's more chance of abuse starting on a wiki I frequent (even though it's a friendly and sensible place, currently, and there's no expectation of privacy within its own system, to commit any related offences by). Though, in that case, there appears to be no way to comply-or-shut-down, as there's no active administrator with that level of access, only 'baseline' moderators who can only react as much as (and a tiny bit more than) everyday editors.

The whole "user-to-user" focus always seemed like overreach. And though the threat of offcom intervention[1] is apparently not going to be immediate £18million fines[2] on the operator(s), nor the blocking, all I personally will see is the voluntary dismantling (or locking down) of good-faith platforms that never had the problems that the "Big Few" social media platforms more clearly suffer from, and seemingly have no actual way of complying[3].


Yes, there are problems to solve. As to whether more of these problems will be solved than babies thrown out with the bathwater, I highly doubt. European regulation with practical responses (c.f. device data/power-connectors, perhaps GDPR) can shift the world, UK regulation just doesn't have the required heft to it. "Ignore or avoid" is probably going to be the response from the RoW, out there, leaving the rest of the Wild Wild Web just as bad as it always was (see also what happened in .au, and other territories[5], from their attempts to regulate known internet-related issues).



[1] Whoops, there goes unfettered UK access to 4chan! ...not saying that's a bad thing, but gonna be as much Whack-A-Mole in the end as apparently was ThePirateBay and its imitators for copyright issues.

[2] More if they actually have significant site-revenue, but thst doesn't apply to any of the places I do actually care about.

[3] Except for total exclusion of the UK, such as Apple's move with its encryption options.

[4] Though I'm not sure how many "do you want our cookies?" popovers actually are to both spirit and letter of the given laws, in the end.

[5] The most provably capable probably being China. But hardly an equivalent model, or one to aspire to.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2025, 09:47:23 am by Starver »
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Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #609 on: March 04, 2025, 06:43:10 pm »

Lol I first learned about that when I saw JD Vance nagging Keir Starmer to be nicer to twitter

Great Order

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Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #611 on: March 23, 2025, 04:29:43 pm »

We've had a Lib Dem cross the floor.
I bet she broke 15 ancient bylaws dating back to Cromwell in one minute

Great Order

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #612 on: April 09, 2025, 09:58:30 am »

So the man who burned a Quran outside the Turkish Embassy in February is being prosecuted for, quote, "intent to cause against [the] religious institution of Islam, harassment, alarm or distress"

Oh yeah, it's blasphemy law time!
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I may have wasted all those years
They're not worth their time in tears
I may have spent too long in darkness
In the warmth of my fears

Loud Whispers

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #613 on: April 09, 2025, 12:32:36 pm »

So the man who burned a Quran outside the Turkish Embassy in February is being prosecuted for, quote, "intent to cause against [the] religious institution of Islam, harassment, alarm or distress"

Oh yeah, it's blasphemy law time!
Oh FFS the Americans will never stop mocking us for being a shitty communist island if we keep doing shit like this. A man gets nearly stabbed to death and we arrest the guy who got stabbed. Just like in Germany when they had the knifeman get tackled by some random civilian, then the police arrested the civilian, only for the knifeman to get back up and stab the policeman. I find burning books pretty offensive and burning religious books pretty damn tasteless, but it's in the same category as when artists soak crosses in piss. The guy was protesting Erdogan, and however offensive it is to insult someone's religion, the state should be protecting the people who do so from being stabbed to death. Not sending them to prison, where they'll be stabbed to death by prison gangs who seem to care a lot about blasphemy in between living a life of utter haram tings. Je suis hebdo everyone says, except they're not

Great Order

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Re: United Kingdom Bunker Thread - Politics & Economics
« Reply #614 on: April 09, 2025, 12:39:51 pm »

Basically. Muslims seem to be very much treated with kiddie gloves here for some reason. I'm not here advocating for their explicit persecution, but some consistency please? Either treat everyone the same way (Don't, that'd cause chaos) or treat them the same as everyone else. This blatant folding every time they get upset with something has the total effect of emboldening the nuttier elements rather than calming them.

EDIT: Oh yes, the other thing. This is also why right-wing reactionary parties are gaining ground. The UK government sees stuff like this and goes "Huh, that seems fine" while the citizenry go "Hang on, this is fucked"  among other issues. Then in comes the right-wing reactionary party saying "Hey, this is fucked" and, quelle surprise, people vote for the right-wing reactionary party.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2025, 12:49:03 pm by Great Order »
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I may have wasted all those years
They're not worth their time in tears
I may have spent too long in darkness
In the warmth of my fears
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