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Author Topic: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension  (Read 524297 times)

Frumple

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #240 on: January 09, 2014, 03:18:01 pm »

Empowerment doesn't improve blesses, no. Insofar as the bless effects go, what you start with is what you're stuck with. The normal magic skill bonuses (increased armor or whatev', blazes if I remember the specifics) still go through, of course.

... regardless, empowerment is kinda' ridiculously expensive, and generally something you want to avoid if at all possible, at least potentially until very late game when you're chain wishing or something and rolling in so many gems you have literally nothing better to do with them. Blood empowerment is quite possibly the only potential exception to that, and that's only because blood income in a dedicated blood economy is pretty hefty. Still something you might do to get that one extra point of magic level needed to open up booster forging or something, but not something you'd do a lot, or repeatedly.

High domain early on is generally to supercharge a bless strat (i.e., get out more sacred units per turn) and/or go for/defend against an early dominion kill. Also potentially to spread dominion effects (High death, ferex) around to deter invasion or whathaveyou.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 03:19:47 pm by Frumple »
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nenjin

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #241 on: January 09, 2014, 03:19:33 pm »

Magic Levels on your Pretender at creation also give your sacred troops bonuses based on those magic paths. I think the bonuses still only start at 2 or 3, and if you want them at good levels, you'll want magic paths of 4.

Basically what Frumple said.

Plus, higher magic paths is just that fewer gems you need to spend in game. Once you're getting +20 to +30 gems a turn, the cost isn't so prohibitive. But it takes a long time to get there and by the time you're pulling in that kind of gem income, you've got all sorts of other expensive projects competing for those gems too.
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Karlito

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #242 on: January 09, 2014, 03:46:14 pm »

Minor bless effects start at 4 and increase every even level after. Major bless effects come into play if your pretender has 9 or more in a path.
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nenjin

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #243 on: January 09, 2014, 04:04:38 pm »

I forget, is there a spell that makes all troops on the battlefield sacred for the duration?

Otherwise, investing in magic at Pretender Creation, to me, is all about the availability of sacred units for your nation. I think it pays higher dividends in smaller maps where there is less distance between your capital and the action, as most sacred units can only be recruited there. (Or at least, the ones worth it. Mictlan has Jaguar Men but they kinda suck compared to the guys wearing actual armor.)
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Bluerobin

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #244 on: January 09, 2014, 04:06:25 pm »

Mictlan has Jaguar Men but they kinda suck compared to the guys wearing actual armor.

Hehe. It's funny because Mictlan's jaguarmen are some of the best sacreds. I've never used them myself, but I think just about any double bless makes them really scary.
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Frumple

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #245 on: January 09, 2014, 04:07:23 pm »

I forget, is there a spell that makes all troops on the battlefield sacred for the duration?
That would be ridiculously powerful if there was, hah. There definitely wasn't in D3, and I haven't noticed anything like that in D4, yet.

Re: Mict's Jaggies: Throw a fire bless on 'em or somethin'. Tear through armor like they tear through everything else, unless they got nerfed in D4 or something. Ridiculous bless beasties in D3, though.
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USEC_OFFICER

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #246 on: January 09, 2014, 04:09:37 pm »

I forget, is there a spell that makes all troops on the battlefield sacred for the duration?

I don't think so, but if it does exists it's probably a very high-level spell, both in terms of research and magic levels. Should probably go through the manual and check.

Mictlan has Jaguar Men but they kinda suck compared to the guys wearing actual armor.

Hehe. It's funny because Mictlan's jaguarmen are some of the best sacreds. I've never used them myself, but I think just about any double bless makes them really scary.

Re: Mict's Jaggies: Throw a fire bless on 'em or somethin'. Tear through armor like they tear through everything else, unless they got nerfed in D4 or something. Ridiculous bless beasties in D3, though.

If I remember correctly, the Jaguar warriors are kinda glass cannons, but their ability to transform into a werecreature gives them much needed durability, since they always take at least two hits to kill. Or something along those lines.
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nenjin

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #247 on: January 09, 2014, 04:10:56 pm »

I don't really see them decimating in D4, but maybe I just don't have the right blessings. (IIRC D4, N4, B4, A3.) They're relatively cheap for sacred troops compared to the armored ones, but they don't seem to last as long. The lack of armor means they get wounded pretty much instantly.

Although I will say it's sort of impressive to have a legion of jaguar with 4+ afflictions a piece that are still fighting. Their commitment to the Teotl is truly admirable.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
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Culise

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #248 on: January 09, 2014, 04:12:09 pm »

I forget, is there a spell that makes all troops on the battlefield sacred for the duration?

Otherwise, investing in magic at Pretender Creation, to me, is all about the availability of sacred units for your nation. I think it pays higher dividends in smaller maps where there is less distance between your capital and the action, as most sacred units can only be recruited there. (Or at least, the ones worth it. Mictlan has Jaguar Men but they kinda suck compared to the guys wearing actual armor.)
I don't think there are spells that make even one unit sacred.  For mass Bless, you can use Divine Blessing, which is accessible to Priest 3 - so, basically, just your Prophet for most nations.  For equips, you can use Shroud of the Battle Saint if you have Astral 1, 5 gems, and have researched Con 4, which occupies the Armor slot on a commander and makes that commander sacred - this is mostly used to get E9 blesses on non-sacred mages, since nations with common S1 mages are also typically compatible with communion strategies. 

EDIT: Also, regarding Jaguars - F9W9.  W9 gives Quickness, which gives blessed units an extra attack and 50% more action points per turn.  F9 gives Flaming Weapons, which is armor-piercing, magical, and reduces the target's AP as well.  Turns sacred soldiers into little buzzsaws. 
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 04:15:45 pm by Culise »
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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #249 on: January 09, 2014, 04:13:53 pm »

I don't think there are spells that make even one unit sacred.  For mass Bless, you can use Divine Blessing, which is accessible to Priest 3 - so, basically, just your Prophet for most nations.  For equips, you can use Shroud of the Battle Saint if you have Astral 1, 5 gems, and have researched Con 4, which occupies the Armor slot on a commander and makes that commander sacred - this is mostly used to get E9 blesses on non-sacred mages, since nations with S1 priests are also compatible with communion strategies.

...

That's an incredibly smart idea, actually. I will have to keep that in mind for future use.
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Frumple

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #250 on: January 09, 2014, 04:15:06 pm »

I don't really see them decimating in D4, but maybe I just don't have the right blessings. (IIRC D4, N4, B4, A3.) They're relatively cheap for sacred troops compared to the armored ones, but they don't seem to last as long. The lack of armor means they get wounded pretty much instantly.

Although I will say it's sort of impressive to have a legion of jaguar with 4+ afflictions a piece that are still fighting. Their commitment to the Teotl is truly admirable.
Yeah, I think a W9 bless is fairly standard for th'jaggies, and possibly an F9 or somethin' and then additional junk. Lets 'em get in there and abuse that second form (which has multiple attacks and fairly high strength) even better. They're usually involved with a major bless or two, at least. Sometimes even three, banking on jaguar rush decimating everything (and a triple bless hoard of jaguar warriors will wreck serious face, especially before notable battlefield magic hits the floor) and blood saccing keeping domain issues under control before the utter crap scales wreck you.
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Karlito

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #251 on: January 09, 2014, 04:17:17 pm »

I don't really see them decimating in D4, but maybe I just don't have the right blessings. (IIRC D4, N4, B4, A3.)

That bless is waaay too weak. The Air paths aren't even contributing. Try something like F9W9 and you'll be much more impressed.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 04:39:07 pm by Karlito »
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nenjin

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #252 on: January 09, 2014, 04:19:24 pm »

It's true, I don't think I've done a Pretender yet with 9 anything in their Blessing. Mostly because, like I said, I'm being a generalist and I think in a long SP the advantage from a beneficial dominion makes for a smoother game.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #253 on: January 09, 2014, 04:23:09 pm »

It's true, I don't think I've done a Pretender yet with 9 anything in their Blessing. Mostly because, like I said, I'm being a generalist and I think in a long SP the advantage from a beneficial dominion makes for a smoother game.

I'm pretty sure that Mictlan doesn't really need good scales. You can only recruit so Jaguars a turn, and I'm pretty sure that their middle/late game is focused on blood sacrificing anyways. So all they really need is good growth and the high-magic paths for early expansion until they can get the slaves flowing.
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Toady Two

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Re: Dominions 4: Thrones of Ascension
« Reply #254 on: January 09, 2014, 04:24:46 pm »

Claiming certain thrones can improve your bless. This is usually a bad thing because these thrones are useless for anything else so if you don't utilize sacreds then there is no point claiming them.
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