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[wierd]

I can ride a horse adeptly... even without a saddle, and can break horses to ride...

But I don't know about breaking a giant man-eating bird to ride.

(Significantly farther to fall when shook off... and I'm getting old.)

[Oliolli]

Enough rope around me and the GCSwallow.

[KodKod]

I'm sure she will enjoy tormenting a sentient being for a change.

"A change"? Oh my, no.

-snip-

...And even in a game of dwarf fortress Oliolli insists on aggravating me. Revenge!

[Silverbit]

Interesting thread...
I volunteer!
Expert Woodcutter
Expert Wood Burner
(wood burning stove operator)

Competent Animal Trainer (If controlling two ferrets counts)
Competant Crossbow/Bowman (can generally hit targets with a bow)
Competant Swordsman (can fence pretty well ,but would probably be useless with a normal sword)

[Talvieno]

Oh and Talvieno, you and I both know my choice of words in my volunteering to be jerkoff of all trades would have been vastly more offencive. did you censor me for the good of those around you?

Lmao Yes.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

*wonders when we will cause universe collapse, by building a turing complete computer system out of vacuum tube valves and ferrite bead based core memory running an approximation of dwarf fortress on it... theoretically, it should be possible to build using the technology shown in game, if we are successful at hydroelectric or wind based electrical generation...*


It would give the jeweler migrants something to do. Ferrite beads being very similar to cabochons, and made of iron ore, like hematite.

("The more you know!", little star flies overhead...)
ferrite beads
core memory
vacuum tube
triode
crookes tube
cathode ray tube

For powered vehicles....

Lead acid batteries are absurdly simple, and hardy. In the simplest form, they consist of 2 lead plates submerged in sulfuric acid. One of the plates needs to be highly oxidized first.

Commercial batteries have several sets of plates wired in parallel to give the "cranking amps" needed to drive high torque starter motors on internal combustion engines.  However, a sufficient number of them in parallel will give you high DC voltage, which can be used to drive an EV's high efficiency DC motor, if you don't mind the extra weight.  They are the simplest and easiest rechargable battery chemistry to make, (and I don't know about you, but I refuse to mix the reagents needed to make nickel-cadmium chemistry.)

For genuine internal combustion engines, a sand-cast engine block milled out with a manual electric milling machine can be made to run on gassified fuel stock.  Just about any organic substance can be turned into "syngas", using an appropriate reactor.  However, the equipment needed to make syngas doesn't play well with goblin siegers, and would be very dangerous to keep below ground.

Using refrigeration tech, it would make a great means of eliminating all the thermal waste of the thermionic valve based computer....

syngas

It could concievably be routed through pipes for murderhole flamethrowers with an electric spark gap igniter.... but since carbon monoxide is a primary component, I would be loathe to use it, or route pipes carrying it through or inside the fortress.  Very much a "do this above ground" enterprise.

While that might be possible in theory, Wierd, I can assure you that it would be absolutely impossible within any of our lifetimes. I have what might be considered "competent computer electronics" - you know, integrated circuits, transistors, capacitors, diodes, etc. Vacuum tubes are bad for two real reasons.
1. They're huge. The average computer these days contains well over two and a half billion transistors. Transistors can now be made to be microscopic in size - you can contain tens of thousands within even the smallest integrated circuits (aka computer chips). Assuming we could make vacuum tubes that were 2.5cm by 10cm(one inch by four inches) in size, to create a computer out of vacuum tubes that could match even the one you're sitting at right now, we would need - at minimum (if we never plan on replacing any that go out) - a room 150 meters(450 feet) in height, and 38 meters(115 feet) in width/length. That's around 216,000 cubic meters(six million cubic feet), and if built in DF would be approximately 45 z-levels tall. If we want to be more realistic, with room for us to walk among them, and only tall enough for us to reach, the room would need to be at least 360 meters by 11400 meters(950 feet by 34,200 feet) in size - basically 0.3km by 10.5km(0.2 miles by 6.5 miles). This would be the DF equivalent of a 1-z room that was 95 tiles by 3420 tiles - or, to put it more to scale, a 2 by 69 embark, completely hollowed out on one z-level.
2. They consume far more energy than they put out. Powering so many vacuum tubes would take more energy than we could possibly generate - more than I want to do the math for.  (partially also because that's not one of my strong points, and I don't know the exact numbers.)
Oh, and did I mention they're a lot slower than transistors?

Basically, while possible in theory, it would be completely impractical.


JJtoocool, Silverbit - welcome to the madness. Avoid KodKod, and try not to drink all the beer.


Splint, Oliolli, thanks. Glad you guys liked it. I honestly think my story quality is degrading.


So now a couple questions. 1. Should I continue with the story/simulation, and 2. If I do, what do we do about the elves, given our current state? (about 200 food, 100 drink)

[Loud Whispers]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The solution is simple: Make a quill, use dye for ink, and write our own tales. The Tales of the Twelfth Bay. Written not by a single author, but by those who had the mis/fortune of living there, passing the book between themselves as they came up with  a good story or give thier take on a particularlly jarring event and what led up to it.

It is a massive tome bound in giant kea leather. It menaces with spikes of dog bone and a nondescript grey stone. It is encrusted with various gemcuts. It bears it's words with paper made from quarry bush leaf fibers and a combination of redroot and dimple dye. On the back is an image of a dwarf and picks in in giant kea bone.  the dwarf is surrounded by the picks. On the front is an image of a mountain, a great '12' and humans in yak leather. The humans are surrounding the mountain and both are below the 12. The art relates to the foundation of The Twelfth bay by an unknown group of humans at an unknown time.

Did we just invent religion?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Ah, that would have to be a great tome to Armok, whom the dwarves think is nonexistant.

This is the Great Tome of Armok. It is bound in the finest cat leather, encircled and studded with steel, encrusted with the finest cuts of onyx and obsidian and a great volcano is present upon the front cover above a great 12 in elf bone, with masterfully laid ruby for lava/magma. Upon the back is an image of a strange mechanical device and a human. The human is being sucked into the device. The image is in goblin bone and relates to the will of Armok being carried out. It's words are largely of magma, !!SCIENCE!! and !!FUN!! in the parlence of those who wrote it. it's words are bourne upondog-based parchment of masterful quality. In place of any ink is blood of unknown orgin, theorized to be that of any number of animals, races, or even Armok himself. Upon the inside front cover is an image of a burning dwarf and volcanos in obsidian. The dwarf is surrounded by the volcanos. The dwarf is forcing the volcanos to erupt. The image is theorized to relate to the forging of worlds by Armok, commonly represented as a male dwarf. Upon the inside back cover is one of the Spawn of Holistic in elephant ivory. The Spawn is striking a menacing pose.

Couldn't resist. Also, the dye was just what came to mind first when I thought of what dwarves used to write.

Ah nevermind, we invented the necronomicon.

[KodKod]

So now a couple questions. 1. Should I continue with the story/simulation, and 2. If I do, what do we do about the elves, given our current state? (about 200 food, 100 drink)

Trade them for their goods so that we've got a bit more food and boozeahol to keep us going, but build a retractable bridge with a 1 level drop to cage traps underneath in order to stun and capture them.

Set a couple up in the dining room for morale, so that we can all get happy thoughts from seeing caged animals. Then find the prettiest elf maiden and install her in my room, I want to break her.

[Oliolli]

...And even in a game of dwarf fortress Oliolli insists on aggravating me. Revenge!

left eye
middle eye
right eye
left eye tooth
right eye tooth

...dammit Talvieno...

You know, I got this haunting feeling that eventually our characters in the game will get married... no idea why...

So now a couple questions. 1. Should I continue with the story/simulation, and 2. If I do, what do we do about the elves, given our current state? (about 200 food, 100 drink)

1. Yes.
2. Let them into the depot, then deconstruct the depot. Then what KodKod said.

[Loud Whispers]

-snip-

On the topic of Elves... No diplomat = Kill caravan please

[KodKod]

You know, I got this haunting feeling that eventually our characters in the game will get married... no idea why...

How dead would you like to be, Mister Oliolli?

[Talvieno]

...And even in a game of dwarf fortress Oliolli insists on aggravating me. Revenge!

You know, I got this haunting feeling that eventually our characters in the game will get married... no idea why...

This might be a good time to mention that in the game, our dwarves actually don't match our genders. I couldn't exactly choose who got which gender, and for the great majority of everyone I didn't actually know the gender. If there's an external program that can genderswap and reset lovers, that would be somewhat useful, but as far as romance goes, I'll be adding that into the story manually, and I'm very open as to suggestions.
With the exception of Girlinhat and Saltmummy. That was luck.

[KodKod]

as far as romance goes, I'll be adding that into the story manually, and I'm very open as to suggestions.

Whatever you do, keep me away from any romance. I've got more important things to do, like inflicting a world of pain on that pretty pampered princess prisoner I want.

[Oliolli]

Keep me away from such things as well. In reality I'm an asexual misanthrope, so I can't really see any reason game-me would even be friends/lovers with people.

[wierd]

Oh and Talvieno, you and I both know my choice of words in my volunteering to be jerkoff of all trades would have been vastly more offencive. did you censor me for the good of those around you?

Lmao Yes.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

*wonders when we will cause universe collapse, by building a turing complete computer system out of vacuum tube valves and ferrite bead based core memory running an approximation of dwarf fortress on it... theoretically, it should be possible to build using the technology shown in game, if we are successful at hydroelectric or wind based electrical generation...*


It would give the jeweler migrants something to do. Ferrite beads being very similar to cabochons, and made of iron ore, like hematite.

("The more you know!", little star flies overhead...)
ferrite beads
core memory
vacuum tube
triode
crookes tube
cathode ray tube

For powered vehicles....

Lead acid batteries are absurdly simple, and hardy. In the simplest form, they consist of 2 lead plates submerged in sulfuric acid. One of the plates needs to be highly oxidized first.

Commercial batteries have several sets of plates wired in parallel to give the "cranking amps" needed to drive high torque starter motors on internal combustion engines.  However, a sufficient number of them in parallel will give you high DC voltage, which can be used to drive an EV's high efficiency DC motor, if you don't mind the extra weight.  They are the simplest and easiest rechargable battery chemistry to make, (and I don't know about you, but I refuse to mix the reagents needed to make nickel-cadmium chemistry.)

For genuine internal combustion engines, a sand-cast engine block milled out with a manual electric milling machine can be made to run on gassified fuel stock.  Just about any organic substance can be turned into "syngas", using an appropriate reactor.  However, the equipment needed to make syngas doesn't play well with goblin siegers, and would be very dangerous to keep below ground.

Using refrigeration tech, it would make a great means of eliminating all the thermal waste of the thermionic valve based computer....

syngas

It could concievably be routed through pipes for murderhole flamethrowers with an electric spark gap igniter.... but since carbon monoxide is a primary component, I would be loathe to use it, or route pipes carrying it through or inside the fortress.  Very much a "do this above ground" enterprise.

While that might be possible in theory, Wierd, I can assure you that it would be absolutely impossible within any of our lifetimes. I have what might be considered "competent computer electronics" - you know, integrated circuits, transistors, capacitors, diodes, etc. Vacuum tubes are bad for two real reasons.
1. They're huge. The average computer these days contains well over two and a half billion transistors. Transistors can now be made to be microscopic in size - you can contain tens of thousands within even the smallest integrated circuits (aka computer chips). Assuming we could make vacuum tubes that were 2.5cm by 10cm(one inch by four inches) in size, to create a computer out of vacuum tubes that could match even the one you're sitting at right now, we would need - at minimum (if we never plan on replacing any that go out) - a room 150 meters(450 feet) in height, and 38 meters(115 feet) in width/length. That's around 216,000 cubic meters(six million cubic feet), and if built in DF would be approximately 45 z-levels tall. If we want to be more realistic, with room for us to walk among them, and only tall enough for us to reach, the room would need to be at least 360 meters by 11400 meters(950 feet by 34,200 feet) in size - basically 0.3km by 10.5km(0.2 miles by 6.5 miles). This would be the DF equivalent of a 1-z room that was 95 tiles by 3420 tiles - or, to put it more to scale, a 2 by 69 embark, completely hollowed out on one z-level.
2. They consume far more energy than they put out. Powering so many vacuum tubes would take more energy than we could possibly generate - more than I want to do the math for.  (partially also because that's not one of my strong points, and I don't know the exact numbers.)
Oh, and did I mention they're a lot slower than transistors?

Basically, while possible in theory, it would be completely impractical.


JJtoocool, Silverbit - welcome to the madness. Avoid KodKod, and try not to drink all the beer.


Splint, Oliolli, thanks. Glad you guys liked it. I honestly think my story quality is degrading.


So now a couple questions. 1. Should I continue with the story/simulation, and 2. If I do, what do we do about the elves, given our current state? (about 200 food, 100 drink)

Oh, I know they are about 10,000% larger than a transistor.  I know they gobble down juice.

The real use I had in mind was for them to control a simple 2.5 axis lithography aparatus. For this a large 8 bit valve based computer running with paper tape would be sufficient. A large gas laser, a vacuum chamber, some photolithography dopants, and some home-made sapphire wafers, and we have the whole computer revolution in 2-3 years, instead of 30.

With electricity, the production of said sapphire wafers is possible.  I somehow doubt that our fortress will need a fullscale batch processing setup for large economies where silicon shines. We could probably get an intel 4004 equivalent cooked up that way pretty reliably. IIRC, it was initially designed by hand with a table-sized master that was hand-scribed and etched. It only has 2.5k transistors.

A single production run of 4004's in the hobby lithograph tank would be enough to completely scrap the valve based system.  The paper tape would probably have to stick around awhile though.

[Garath]

I want to make a lot of friends, then get a strange mood, get all melancholic because I needed cobalt bars, die and cause a tantrum spiral