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[scriver]

Drugs, or any other kind of evidence that could be swallowed.

[Frumple]

So these are things that warrant extrajudicial brutality alongside the risk of death to you. I wouldn't agree even a little, but it's a position you can take.

[anewaname]

There is no surprise that it ended in coercion, because of the context (listed in order of importance):
- "at middle school"
- "accosted another person" (see legal definition of accost)
- "guy disoriented, maybe under the influence" (go ahead and argue this, but don't ignore the rest of the context in favor of arguing just this point)
- "guy puts something in their mouth when confronted by police"

It makes sense that they pulled him out of the car. It is a problem for police that some people try to swallow baggies containing multiple drug doses, then need to be taken to the hospital to have their stomach pumped, all while "in police custody". Stopping them from swallowing multiple doses of some unknown drug is important for multiple reasons.

The context of the struggle itself was not visible in the one body cam video they released. It shouldn't have ended in a shooting but if the guy was grabbing at things on the officer's belt and struggling, the context would have changed.

Really, I want to see the other body cam footage to see how soon the gun got into the officer's hand and how violently the guy was struggling.

[Rolan7]

I understand "Don't swallow that!", not "Oh no you swallowed that, time to use physical force so we can... idk, induce vomiting?  Oops escalation led to officer-involved death"

[Loud Whispers]

Lmao reminds me of the time one of my white anglo friends visited America and got stopped by police. He got out of his car to go talk to the police officer and the police officer drew his gun on him and his American gf had to explain very calmly that it was normal to get out of your car to talk to police in the UK

[jipehog]

I don't know if it is ok but it certainly a far cry from previous description.

You don't know?

Indeed. I am certain that the outcome was bad, a very unfortunate situation, but I am not qualified to speak to the quality of the cop decision, not knowing your exact rules or being privy to his perspective.

I know that one of the top safety tips is to always keeping your hands visible. And given the information available to the cop in that split second of escalation where he lose control of the situation, where a potentially dangerous person turned away and does something inside the car out of their sight is a much more ambiguous situation than you try to pretend. And the pill popping which can be construed as trying to hide or dispose of something (There are narcotics that one pill is enough for charges) didn't help.

[scriver]

So these are things that warrant extrajudicial brutality alongside the risk of death to you. I wouldn't agree even a little, but it's a position you can take.

Nope, and you're being intentionally obtuse. I wouldn't agree, but that is a position you can take.

[nenjin]

The cops claimed they believed he was reaching for a weapon as their reason for killing him. After he put a pill in his mouth. That's when they pulled him out of the car, a struggle ensued and they shot him. After he told them he was unarmed. After they had already been talking to each other.

It's fucking nonsense. Excusing the use of deadly force is only slightly less fucking nonsense.

Oh also this cop has already received other awards for blowing people away.

[EuchreJack]

The cops claimed they believed he was reaching for a weapon as their reason for killing him. After he put a pill in his mouth. That's when they pulled him out of the car, a struggle ensued and they shot him. After he told them he was unarmed. After they had already been talking to each other.

It's fucking nonsense. Excusing the use of deadly force is only slightly less fucking nonsense.

Oh also this cop has already received other awards for blowing people away.

And the System is working as intended

Hence why I am not going down the rabbit hole "but the cops said it was ok". Of course they said it was ok to shot someone that clearly had some mental health issues. The entire Fucking system is designed to kill the most vulnerable of our population.

[jipehog]

So these are things that warrant extrajudicial brutality alongside the risk of death to you. I wouldn't agree even a little, but it's a position you can take.

Nope, and you're being intentionally obtuse. I wouldn't agree, but that is a position you can take.

Yeah. Seems like many people in USA come up with alternative facts for their political notion of greater good.

[hector13]

So these are things that warrant extrajudicial brutality alongside the risk of death to you. I wouldn't agree even a little, but it's a position you can take.

Nope, and you're being intentionally obtuse. I wouldn't agree, but that is a position you can take.

Yeah. Seems like many people in USA come up with alternative facts for their political notion of greater good.

What alternative facts?

The guy got killed for making a mistake, being honest about prior interactions with police, and taking medication. The cop may not have known the guy was taking medication rather than destroying evidence or taking narcotics, but it does not justify the significant escalation of his actions, nor their results.

[Egan_BW]

Mysteriously it's fine for police to escalate to lethal force if they feel vaguely threatened but they're allowed to act as threatening as they want.

[jipehog]

The guy got killed for making a mistake, being honest about prior interactions with police, and taking medication.

I agree, that why it is sad. However, to determine whether the actions of the cop where justified this, like much of other things mentioned, is hindsight bias as well as some preconceived notions of who the villain and victim is.

Honest shmonest as far as the cop knew, he had a middle-aged man in the middle-school's parking lot during kids pickup. Who reportedly was trying to get into multiple cars, became 'aggressive' and was possible 'on something'. The person didn't look too healthy, behave nervously, admitted previous altercations with police, admitted screaming at someone all which substantiate parts of the previous report and would give anyone with common sense a reason for caution at least until more facts can be established about the situation to corroborate different stories. Unfortunately things escalated before even basic identification could be made.

So the whole story is about (1) the split second decision to take control of the situation when the suspect turned away doing something sneaky in the car, with above context in mind; (2) whether the shooting was justified during the struggle that ensued. Note that the cop end up on the floor, seem to be under the suspect for a second, and reportedly hit in the face (for anyone who never been in a fight, that can be disorienting) and felt that the suspect might be reaching for his gun.

Again, I don't know about the answer or whether my impression is correct or based complete facts, but I do know that on politically polarizing issues people often don't care who get thrown under the bus

[anewaname]

There were two things that are important in the part of the confrontation where the officer had the guy on the ground...
- The cop was able to free one hand to grab his gun, showing his confidence that he had successfully pinned the guy
    - he could have used that free hand to further pin the guy's arm
    - he could have used that free hand to grab a non-lethal weapon
    - instead, he chose to pull a gun while on school grounds
- There was no communications between the two officers
    - he could have requested the other officer use a taser
    - he could have ordered the other officer to tell the guy to stop moving
    - instead he opted to exclude the other officer

I would go so far as to say this guy was showing off, and that it was a macho display for the other officer which is why he didn't communicate with them or treat them like a work partner.

[jipehog]

iirc from their position and the location of the taser that is unrealistic, the rest is speculative (I can come up with counter hero-narrative) but plausible, I don't really care either way my main point here is people jumping to conclusions.