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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 857569 times)

PatrikLundell

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2415 on: September 10, 2019, 02:44:08 am »

When there are more types of secrets and magic, will there be more ways to gain magic abilties or will it mostly come from reading slabs/books?
The Myth&Magic arc should introduce new ways to gain magic abilities. At the least divine/infernal connections, but probably a whole set of new ways eventually (research, study as an apprentice, innate ability, sphere influence/effect [with some magic dependent on spheres, so if the sphere goes, so does the magic, even if the learning process is not a sphere effect itself {I think the latest Threetoe story has magic that disappeared when the spheres were rearranged in the past}]). Introducing more avenues before that arc would probably be a waste of efforts, as it would probably have to be re-implemented to fit in with Myth&Magic.
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AliceRed

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2416 on: September 10, 2019, 12:59:03 pm »

Yeah, IIRC basically all the current magic stuff will be going in the trash once Myths and Magic gets rolling. They're mostly here as a stopgap until then.
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MadMonkey

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2417 on: September 10, 2019, 01:46:18 pm »

I knew it wouldn't be until mythgen. Maybe I should rephrase my question to what are some of the possible secret gaining avenues.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2019, 02:15:02 pm by MadMonkey »
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2418 on: September 10, 2019, 01:59:15 pm »

I knew it wouldn't be until mythgen. Maybe I should rephrase my question to what are some of the possible secret gaining avenues.

Toady won't reveal his hand that easily, it could be any number of things depending on how gods in the Myth and Magic Arc bestow their abilities or even manifest in the finished product. Also retrospective questions probably won't be heard unless they too are lime but its not too much of a deviation of the first question's answer & reply as is.

From our information sources for Toady's perception, the creation myths, sliders, and magical items and artifacts will have some weight on whether you can practice backyard necromancery in one world using magic accessible to laymen and everyone else, or whether magic is very rare and closeted onto tablets as it is currently. Gaining more secrets? I wouldnt know any further than what someone could suggest and what Toady's conversely suggested like magical bloodlines, books, word of mouth? spontaneous blessings? its really open to debate.
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Immortal-D

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2419 on: September 11, 2019, 05:04:29 pm »

Can you tell us any details about what the Steam tutorial will look like?  Are you going to cover specific key/menu navigation (build vs. designate), or more general concepts like 'how to farm'?
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2420 on: September 11, 2019, 05:58:28 pm »

Can you tell us any details about what the Steam tutorial will look like?  Are you going to cover specific key/menu navigation (build vs. designate), or more general concepts like 'how to farm'?
I imagine planning hasn't gotten much further than this interview about it.
https://www.pcgamer.com/tutorials-and-mouse-support-could-make-dwarf-fortress-on-steam-vastly-easier-to-play/
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squamous

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2421 on: September 14, 2019, 06:05:59 am »



1. How will food management work for adventuring parties. If we're able to control them all, will we need to take their food and water supplies into account? Will they get food by themselves or will we need to manually control them to feed them/put food in their inventory?

2. Will it be possible for adventurers or armies to travel across mountains in the near future? Right now they can isolate huge portions of the map from each other, so I was wondering how it would affect things like criminal conspiracies and new traveling agents like exiled religions/player-sent minions. Will they be able to move across the world or just their local region?

3. What exactly are the things that influence whether an animal man population will join a civilization? So far I am fairly sure a high respect for nature influences it but everything else is guesswork.

4. You mentioned new interactions like creating fog. Will there be any interactions that allow you to heal missing limbs besides the current werebeast method?
« Last Edit: September 21, 2019, 11:46:46 am by squamous »
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2422 on: September 14, 2019, 07:25:14 am »

Will it be possible for adventurers or armies to travel across mountains in the near future? Right now they can isolate huge portions of the map from each other, so I was wondering how it would affect things like criminal conspiracies and new traveling agents like exiled religions/player-sent minions. Will they be able to move across the world or just their local region?


I have no idea how palatable the solutions could be but you could fly (innately, or with a mount, to which flying raids might be a big deal versus players who isolate themselves on islands but still draw the jealous eyes of the world.) or you could go through the mountain in a subterreanean way.

Depends how Toady will seek to address this but the terrain re-write might make the pathing more preferable and completely suspend mountains as a no go zone. Alternatively people might be able to start fortresses below ground in the future where being inside the depths of a mountain could be preferable (maybe not in the mouth or lava of a volcano by accident)
« Last Edit: September 14, 2019, 07:28:27 am by FantasticDorf »
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Silverwing235

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2423 on: September 14, 2019, 08:03:20 am »

About adventurer party sizes, in particular: Is the current limit of 6 hardcoded, or planned to be user-adjustable? (I speak with the viewpoint of one who has designs on a proper "Thorin & Company"-style setup, post mythgen.) 
« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 11:03:53 am by Silverwing235 »
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Doomblade187

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2424 on: September 17, 2019, 10:41:53 am »

Is there any plans to implement dwarven nurseries, to potentially provide "proper" childcare for dwarves, and potentially lower the number of warbabies? Related quote and suggestion from Scriver and others below.

It would be nice to have nurseries just not for war babies but children in general. Combine with burrows to make "safety zones" for them to retreat to during battles or sieges a la Helm's Deep.

But yes as iconic as the Battle-Bred Babies of DF is I really think the game could use a nursery function. Both for dwarves to temporarily leave their babies at (in case of violence) and for nobles to be assholes about child rearing with (lol take care of my own offspring? You must be joking).

Then again I would also give children an inclination to want to hang around their parents and make them able to learn their parents' professional skills by proxy from being present while the parent work. Maybe have them limited to some low skill level but then make their parents work a little faster by having them around (simulating them helping in the workshop).
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iceball3

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2425 on: September 17, 2019, 07:36:26 pm »

Will it be possible for adventurers or armies to travel across mountains in the near future? Right now they can isolate huge portions of the map from each other, so I was wondering how it would affect things like criminal conspiracies and new traveling agents like exiled religions/player-sent minions. Will they be able to move across the world or just their local region?


I have no idea how palatable the solutions could be but you could fly (innately, or with a mount, to which flying raids might be a big deal versus players who isolate themselves on islands but still draw the jealous eyes of the world.) or you could go through the mountain in a subterreanean way.

Depends how Toady will seek to address this but the terrain re-write might make the pathing more preferable and completely suspend mountains as a no go zone. Alternatively people might be able to start fortresses below ground in the future where being inside the depths of a mountain could be preferable (maybe not in the mouth or lava of a volcano by accident)
I remember asking a bit on this sometime last year or so, the notion was that mountains being no-go zones are kind of a placeholder at the moment, as you'll notice that mountain biomes often have quite a lot of foraging options, and are nowhere near insurmountable as the terrain shifts only very mildly, and the biomes don't span far enough distances in the current iteration to make even adventure-mode scale travel unable to sustain off their own pack-food.
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voliol

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2426 on: September 18, 2019, 02:21:55 am »

Will it be possible for adventurers or armies to travel across mountains in the near future? Right now they can isolate huge portions of the map from each other, so I was wondering how it would affect things like criminal conspiracies and new traveling agents like exiled religions/player-sent minions. Will they be able to move across the world or just their local region?


I have no idea how palatable the solutions could be but you could fly (innately, or with a mount, to which flying raids might be a big deal versus players who isolate themselves on islands but still draw the jealous eyes of the world.) or you could go through the mountain in a subterreanean way.

Depends how Toady will seek to address this but the terrain re-write might make the pathing more preferable and completely suspend mountains as a no go zone. Alternatively people might be able to start fortresses below ground in the future where being inside the depths of a mountain could be preferable (maybe not in the mouth or lava of a volcano by accident)
I remember asking a bit on this sometime last year or so, the notion was that mountains being no-go zones are kind of a placeholder at the moment, as you'll notice that mountain biomes often have quite a lot of foraging options, and are nowhere near insurmountable as the terrain shifts only very mildly, and the biomes don't span far enough distances in the current iteration to make even adventure-mode scale travel unable to sustain off their own pack-food.
Non-player adventurers in adventurer mode easily scale mountains though. I had this problem the other day when I was stalking some performers traveling to the big city, and I had to exit fast travel as soon as the mountains appeared in our path, not to lose them by going around.

DG

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2427 on: September 19, 2019, 09:05:08 am »

How far away is the villain system from producing a stereotypical fantasy thieves guild? In my mind it can be boiled down to a criminal organisation that might not actively invent or undertake plots but who's permission (and a tax) is required before professional criminal activity is undertaken in their sphere of influence. It may or may not have some sort of tacit agreement with a legitimate government. Is a thieves guild something you'd like to see come up in certain gens?
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2428 on: September 19, 2019, 10:15:59 am »

Is there any plans to implement dwarven nurseries, to potentially provide "proper" childcare for dwarves, and potentially lower the number of warbabies? Related quote and suggestion from Scriver and others below.

It would be nice to have nurseries just not for war babies but children in general. Combine with burrows to make "safety zones" for them to retreat to during battles or sieges a la Helm's Deep.

But yes as iconic as the Battle-Bred Babies of DF is I really think the game could use a nursery function. Both for dwarves to temporarily leave their babies at (in case of violence) and for nobles to be assholes about child rearing with (lol take care of my own offspring? You must be joking).

Then again I would also give children an inclination to want to hang around their parents and make them able to learn their parents' professional skills by proxy from being present while the parent work. Maybe have them limited to some low skill level but then make their parents work a little faster by having them around (simulating them helping in the workshop).

I think there's a public mandate for it given how often it turns up in suggestions, but not a declared devlog one given the direction towards the big goals in the Magic Arc and how much of a detour it could end up being. I personally would support the 'idea' of a player set safe area but i think given there's been no hint of a devlog for a while on the matter it would be best consigned to the suggestions forum for elaborations.

Committing to doing nursuries/etc. might compel players to ask for more depth regarding children in their interim period of obscure uselessness before adulthood, like academic public/private tutoring to broaden minds etc or to touch on the subjects of childhood and adolescence more, but this is a pitfall i feel that Toady could get well sunk into given the normal amout of detail with everything connected that DF strives to achieve.
  • Also the horrible daycare experiment implications of player's Spartan like approaches to childcare, in the hopes animals or child snatchers would take away nursery babies stationed outside, babies aren't even born with knives to defend themselves anymore  :P
Rushing to add everything now might leave post-magic arc when everything is in place to be built upon rather than pulled out quickly and started again
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2429 on: September 19, 2019, 03:53:22 pm »

How far away is the villain system from producing a stereotypical fantasy thieves guild? In my mind it can be boiled down to a criminal organisation that might not actively invent or undertake plots but who's permission (and a tax) is required before professional criminal activity is undertaken in their sphere of influence. It may or may not have some sort of tacit agreement with a legitimate government. Is a thieves guild something you'd like to see come up in certain gens?
Rather far, I would guess. You'd really need an economy for a thieves guild to have a place (although it obviously doesn't stop companies, embezzling, and other economic activities to happen in an economic vacuum with the Villains arc). It also would benefit from a foundation of Law & Customs that might give them a place in the society and some explanation for why they exists.
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