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[assimilateur]

Edit: By happenstance, I found Footkerchief quoting a place where Toady said that the quality-based skill modifications are, in fact, still applicable. Bottom of this post. So, the question is still open (not answered, as such, since damage-over-time with no-quality and MW-quality from sparring isn't clear, but rather open).

I don't think I get it. What exactly is the controversy, after you've established that weapon quality increases effective skill levels, for some applications (keeping in mind that the risk of sparring injuries seems inversely proportional to weapon skill)?

[Phantasma]

Do strange mood dwarfs always become legendary upon creating an artifact? I've had 3 artifacts createn now but only 1 dwarf has become legendary.

[NecroRebel]

I don't think I get it. What exactly is the controversy, after you've established that weapon quality increases effective skill levels, for some applications (keeping in mind that the risk of sparring injuries seems inversely proportional to weapon skill)?

The risk of sparring injuries is inversely proportional to weapon skill, and thus also weapon quality, but the intensity of sparring injuries (damage) is directly proportional to weapon quality. So, the question is whether bigger, less frequent hits (due to high-quality weapons) is safer than smaller, more frequent hits (due to low-quality weapons).

So I'm just wondering whether or not the skl*5+5 modifier more than halves the number of real hits. If it less than halves that number, the doubled damage from a MW weapon over a no-quality weapon would make it less safe (since damage total would be *2/x, where x<2; total damage increases). If it exactly halves the number of real hits, it's really no safer (where damage is *2/2), whereas if the chance of real hits is reduced by more than half it would be safer (*2/x, where x>2; total damage decreases).

I'm not really sure how to explain it better than that  Part of the problem is that I'm not sure how to put it into mathematical formulas to show it more clearly, which makes describing math stuff hard. Basically, though, number of real hits isn't the only thing you have to worry about in sparring, which is why MW adamantine weapons are still comically unsafe.

Do strange mood dwarfs always become legendary upon creating an artifact? I've had 3 artifacts createn now but only 1 dwarf has become legendary.

There are several forms of mood, each of which gives different messages when it begins and when you scroll over the workshop. You, it would seem, have gotten the message "Urist McMoodydwarf has been possessed!" in big purple letters twice, which means that your dwarf has entered the type of mood known as Possession. Possessions do not give skill boosts, while every other type of mood does.

So... No, strange mood dwarves become legendary only if their mood is not a possession.

[assimilateur]

So, the question is whether bigger, less frequent hits (due to high-quality weapons) is safer than smaller, more frequent hits (due to low-quality weapons).

That's more or less what I was thinking. Perhaps I wasn't fully awake when I didn't fully get your previous post.

We'd need to know what sort of damage resistance an exceptional or masterwork suit of steel armor provides. It might be enough to fully deflect hits of silver weapons regardless of their quality. I figure that info might be found in that thread about attack rolls you've linked to; I'll get around to reading it thoroughly later on.

[Phantasma]

Ah yes I remember they were both possessed. Just bad luck I guess. Thanks for the answer.

[NecroRebel]

We'd need to know what sort of damage resistance an exceptional or masterwork suit of steel armor provides. It might be enough to fully deflect hits of silver weapons regardless of their quality. I figure that info might be found in that thread about attack rolls you've linked to; I'll get around to reading it thoroughly later on.

Well, damblock for armors is in the raws... If I'm reading everything in the raws and on the wiki's Armor Tokens page, it looks like a full set of layered MW steel chain and plate with greaves, gauntlets, a shield, high boots, cap, and helm would give effective damblock 31.92 on the torso, 39.9 on the upper legs, 53.2 on the upper shield arm, 37.24 on the upper weapon arm, 42.56 on the head, 15.96 on the lower weapon arm and hand, 31.92 on the lower shield arm and hand, and 34.58 on the feet and lower legs. Hmm... Seems odd that the protection on the torso is so low, but that's largely because the torso armor protects everything around it for more stacking while nothing else stacks to the torso.

Now, the actual damblock taken into the attack formula is a random number between 0 and the effective damblock, but if I'm reading the formula right, a MW silver warhammer has a damage rating of 12, so to have an even chance of damaging a flawlessly-steeled sparring partner a dwarf would have to have 4 strength, and that would only be a hit on the weapon arm and wouldn't be very severe. It would take an Ultra-Mighty+25 to give an even chance at a headwound, so unless you're sparring with Morul you're not having much of a problem.

But yeah, if I'm reading my numbers right, with the best armor your champions are essentially immune to damage from anything short of a steel weapon or a big size difference. Good to know.

[assimilateur]

Thanks for that analysis, mate. That pretty much settles it: MW silver weapons for sparring it is, then.

[NecroRebel]

Thanks for that analysis, mate. That pretty much settles it: MW silver weapons for sparring it is, then.

That doesn't... Wait. Riiiiight, negligible damage either way means that MW weapons are in fact better, especially since they're better if you have to go into battle unexpectedly. Though MW copper, bronze, or even iron weapons might be even be better, since they also have great difficulty hurting the steel-clad soldier and are even better if you don't switch out for real battle. Layered steel armor is just ridiculously powerful, and that's a major determinator for what's safe to spar with.

[Slipstream]

Hi guys, I've been playing DF for a while now and I've been searching around for an answer to this question:

Why can't I seem to start multiple fortresses in the same world?  I can swear I've done it before but the option of only "continue playing" is available.

Am I missing something completely obvious?

[smjjames]

Just make a copy of the region file you are using and paste it into the save folder. That easy.

[assimilateur]

MW weapons are in fact better

Yes, I've based that conclusion on both their negligible damage and the fact that they increase the effective weapon skill of their users, supposedly leading to fewer sparring accidents.

[Skorpion]

Seth, build a bridge over a large 10-z chasm (designate c(h)annels to make a chasm) and set it on repeat. Let a few elves fall in and die, but let some escape to tell the tale.

Skorpion, how about this: Have a few guys train for a massive time, silver weapons only. Have a bunch of squads have constant vigilance like you said. When the trainers become champions, switch them out to constant vigilance and switch a squad in for training.

That's what I'm doing. Assigning armour and weapons to migrants, and then stuffing them in the champion squads when they hit legendary in something.

[Cheddarius]

Yaaaay

[Mr.Lee]

Is there a way to make a new weapon and domestic creatures.

[Skorpion]

Yeah, just slot them into the raws.

DON'T LEAVE DUPLICATE ENTRIES. That will cause the world to go crazy. Alligators living in houses. Embarking as purring maggots that bleed plump helmets and molten iron.