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[Girlinhat]

So, while talking about dwarven sugar and sweet pods, the thought occurred to me that we have all the ingredients for candy under our noses.  Honey, ground sugar, fruits, etc.  A quick google revealed that the earliest candies were fruits, nuts, and seeds rolled in honey as a preservative, and were very likely used by marching armies due to honey's unique property in the way it doesn't really go bad.  Later on, hard candies became popular, basically made from sugar and water and boiled and processed down into a hard nub that was often mixed with spices to create a sort of cinnamon mint variety, and often eaten as it was believed to settle an upset stomach (which happened a lot when these became popular, because not all food was fresh).  Then, with factories, cocoa, milk chocolate, and gelatin, a wide variety of candy became available thanks to production line factories.

Now, all this in mind, we have honey and strawberries, prickle berries, and plump helmets.  Those are fruits, right?  A simple process of combining fruit and honey can produce a simple candy.  More complex candies, like marshmallows, would require gelatin made from bone, heating using fuel, and of course a bag of milled sweet pods.  We have all of the needed tools and materials here, they're just not put together yet.  Candies could have a higher value multiplier, but also need more resources, like 2 strawberries per candy, instead of 1:1 for everything, so they could be a viable trade good, which is believable.  Some places like Switzerland probably make a lot of money exporting chocolate (no numbers on hand, but one may assume).

Sweets were also used to preserve food by rolling the ingredients in honey or sugar, and doctors very frequently (and still do) mask the taste of medicine with something sweet.  Shelf-life and hospital changes are outside of raw-modding capacity though.

So, any ideas on this to throw out?  The basic idea right now is "alternative food source" of sorts, so they'd be used exactly like regular food, because there's no way to mod in a sweet tooth for dwarves.

[Flaede]

So, while talking about dwarven sugar and sweet pods, the thought occurred to me that we have all the ingredients for candy under our noses.  Honey, ground sugar, fruits, etc.  A quick google revealed that the earliest candies were fruits, nuts, and seeds rolled in honey as a preservative, and were very likely used by marching armies due to honey's unique property in the way it doesn't really go bad.  Later on, hard candies became popular, basically made from sugar and water and boiled and processed down into a hard nub that was often mixed with spices to create a sort of cinnamon mint variety, and often eaten as it was believed to settle an upset stomach (which happened a lot when these became popular, because not all food was fresh).  Then, with factories, cocoa, milk chocolate, and gelatin, a wide variety of candy became available thanks to production line factories.

Now, all this in mind, we have honey and strawberries, prickle berries, and plump helmets.  Those are fruits, right?  A simple process of combining fruit and honey can produce a simple candy.  More complex candies, like marshmallows, would require gelatin made from bone, heating using fuel, and of course a bag of milled sweet pods.  We have all of the needed tools and materials here, they're just not put together yet.  Candies could have a higher value multiplier, but also need more resources, like 2 strawberries per candy, instead of 1:1 for everything, so they could be a viable trade good, which is believable.  Some places like Switzerland probably make a lot of money exporting chocolate (no numbers on hand, but one may assume).

Sweets were also used to preserve food by rolling the ingredients in honey or sugar, and doctors very frequently (and still do) mask the taste of medicine with something sweet.  Shelf-life and hospital changes are outside of raw-modding capacity though.

So, any ideas on this to throw out?  The basic idea right now is "alternative food source" of sorts, so they'd be used exactly like regular food, because there's no way to mod in a sweet tooth for dwarves.

Hmmm. you could make gelatin a glob, made in a cauldron-based workshop out of hooves or bones?
Possible problem: I don't know if we can use items in containers yet. I don't think so. This would make it dangerous to let dwarves stock these globs in barrels, as I think they would be wont to do.

Question: Can one make edible "bars"?

[Girlinhat]

Glob is a good idea.  Perhaps given [EATEN_RAW] you could eat candy that never goes bad.

You can specify containers, at least in .19 (which involves honey, so most of the candy talk is .19)  Look up the raws on brewing mead, and you'll see contained items in action.  Either way, this doesn't matter, because the dwarf will take the candy glob out of the barrel and go utilize it.  Tallow and fat are globs, and are handled by hand.  Only liquids like booze and honey need a permanent container.

[Flaede]

Oh. Man. I am behind the times. used to be dwarves couldn't (for custom reactions only) see items within containers. Blocks in bins and globs in barrels made me very angry.

So. Yes. A new material like tallow only called gelatin as a reactant. Honey (yummm). aand then various other ingredients to taste. I like it.

Also, aas for glazes - I just found: "Shellac is a resin secreted by the female lac bug, on trees in the forests of India and Thailand. It is processed and sold as dry flakes (pictured at right), which are dissolved in denatured alcohol to make liquid shellac, which is used as a brush-on colorant, food glaze and wood finish."

I am working on adapting "milkable" and will test to see if one can "milk" things taht aren't "MILK_TEMPLATE" but, say, "SHELLAC_TEMPLATE". We shall see how this goes. I want this, ultimately, for many things, so this is as good a test as any.

Spoiler: somethings not right with this yet (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

[CREATURE:LAC_BEETLE]
[DESCRIPTION:A tiny insect that can be found almost anywhere outside.]
[NAME:Lac Bug:Lac Bug:Lac Bug]
[CASTE_NAME:beetle:beetles:beetle]
[CREATURE_TILE:250][COLOR:4:0:0]
[NATURAL]
[BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[VERMIN_SOIL][FREQUENCY:100]
[UBIQUITOUS]
[VERMIN_NOTRAP]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:250:500]
[SMALL_REMAINS]
[SPEED:2900]
[PREFSTRING:getting shellacked]
Could be FLIER but leaving it off so they crawl around.
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[NO_SLEEP]
[HOMEOTHERM:10071]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MUNDANE]
[NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[NOBONES]
[BODY:INSECT:2EYES:HEART:GUTS:BRAIN:MOUTH:2WINGS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CHITIN_MATERIALS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CHITIN_TISSUES]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXOSKELETON_TISSUE_LAYERS:CHITIN:FAT:MUSCLE]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_HEAD_POSITIONS]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SINEW:SINEW_TEMPLATE]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SINEW:200]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SINEW:200]
[HAS_NERVES]

[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:MILK:SHELLAC_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:raw shellac]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:raw shellac]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:melted raw shellac]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:raw shellac]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling shellac]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling shellac]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[MULTIPLY_VALUE:2]
[MILKABLE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MILK:20000]

[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:ICHOR:ICHOR_TEMPLATE]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:ICHOR:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:PUS:PUS_TEMPLATE]
[PUS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:PUS:LIQUID]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1]
[MAXAGE:1:1]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:CHITIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:RED:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:chitin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BLACK:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]

=================================ALSO=====================================

[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SHELLAC_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:YELLOW]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:shellac]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:raw shellac]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:YELLOW]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:melted shellac]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:YELLOW]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:n/a]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:n/a]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:1]
[SPEC_HEAT:1000]
[IGNITE_POINT:10508]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10250]
[COLDDAM_POINT:9900]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:NONE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:500]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:NONE]
[MOLAR_MASS:NONE]
[IMPACT_YIELD:200000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:200000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:200000] copied bone
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:200000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[TENSILE_YIELD:115000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:130000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[TORSION_YIELD:115000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:130000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[SHEAR_YIELD:115000] copied bone
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:130000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[BENDING_YIELD:115000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:130000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[MAX_EDGE:1000]
[ABSORPTION:100]
[REACTION_CLASS:MILK]
[MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CHEESE_MAT:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:CHEESE]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[ITEMS_HARD]
[LIQUID_MISC_CREATURE]

There is also POWDER_MISC_CREATURE, but milk template has LIQUID MISC CREATURE. I think it may work even if the product isn't technically a liquid. I think the powder one would end up like the "mashed firefly" I see in Nightbeast lairs in Adventure mode.

EDIT: though perhaps I should just skip straight to the alcohol-dissolved liquid thing, and finally have a use for CREATURE_ALCOHOL? I would totally not allow it to be consumable, though ("shellacked dwarf" jokes aside). Can reactions also use liquids in containers? or is that still a barrier?
EDIT x2: I am curious what I could do with the MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT thing. (obviously I should not leave it as "cheese")

[Sarudak]

Actually dwarves can't see the honey in containers still if it's in a stockpile. Which is apparently why it's so difficult to make mead.

[Flaede]

Hm. Well I think this one's going to turn out as a glob. I think, but if not I may have to make it a powder and find out how that all works.

Are powders ok? or is using sand in a bag still not possible either?

[Uristocrat]

Now, all this in mind, we have honey and strawberries, prickle berries, and plump helmets.  Those are fruits, right?

Err, plump helmets are mushrooms, unless I'm sadly mistaken.  Then again, Dwarves would probably like honey mushroom candy, so what do I know?

[EmperorJon]

Honey mushroom candy. This.

[Assassinfox]

Ahem.

* points to sig *

 

[Grimlocke]

Honey curing is an interesting idea, though a bit redundant due to stockpiles rendering everything eternaly preservable.

All you would have to add is a seperate material for it for each plant you want to use, a reaction class tag to the plants structure material (since you cant filter them on edibilty. Honey cured dimple cups, yeach) and the appropriate reaction.

Might do this actualy.


EDIT: done it! I can now take a jug of honey and some raw edible plant, and make candy out of it.

Spoiler: Reaction (click to show/hide)

[REACTION:CURE_HONEY]
   [NAME:cure plants with honey]
   [BUILDING:KITCHEN:CUSTOM_C]
   [REAGENT:honey:30:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:HONEY_BEE:HONEY]
      [UNROTTEN]
   [REAGENT:honey container:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE]
      [CONTAINS:honey]
      [PRESERVE_REAGENT]
      [DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
   [REAGENT:edible plant:1:PLANT:NONE:NONE:NONE]
      [HAS_MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CURE_MAT]
   [PRODUCT:100:1:CHEESE:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:edible plant:CURE_MAT]
   [SKILL:COOK]

Spoiler: Plant material tags, to be added at the end of structural material definition. (click to show/hide)

      [MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CURE_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:CURE]
   [USE_MATERIAL:CURE:STRUCTURAL]
      [MULTIPLY_VALUE:3]
      [STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:candy]

Spoiler: example plant (click to show/hide)

[PLANT:BERRIES_PRICKLE]
   [NAME:prickle berry][NAME_PLURAL:prickle berries][ADJ:prickle berry]
   [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:STRUCTURAL_PLANT_TEMPLATE]
      [MATERIAL_VALUE:1]
      [EDIBLE_VERMIN]
      [EDIBLE_RAW]
      [EDIBLE_COOKED]
      [MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CURE_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:CURE]
   [USE_MATERIAL:CURE:STRUCTURAL]
      [MULTIPLY_VALUE:3]
      [STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:candy]
   [BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
   [PICKED_TILE:58][PICKED_COLOR:2:0:0]
   [DRY][BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
   [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:DRINK:PLANT_ALCOHOL_TEMPLATE]
      [STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen prickle berry wine]
      [STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:prickle berry wine]
      [STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:boiling prickle berry wine]
      [MATERIAL_VALUE:1]
      [DISPLAY_COLOR:2:0:0]
      [EDIBLE_RAW]
      [EDIBLE_COOKED]
      [PREFIX:NONE]
   [DRINK:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:DRINK]
   [SPRING][SUMMER][AUTUMN][WINTER]
   [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:SEED_TEMPLATE]
      [MATERIAL_VALUE:1]
      [EDIBLE_VERMIN]
      [EDIBLE_COOKED]
   [SEED:prickle berry seed:prickle berry seeds:2:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
   [FREQUENCY:100]
   [CLUSTERSIZE:5]
   [PREFSTRING:precise thorns]

And of course you need an entity tag.

Might change the name. I might also have to be less lazy with adding the materials to get around the fact that the candy rots now.

[Girlinhat]

The idea was to make candy a glob (which doesn't rot) but add the [EDIBLE_RAW] token (which conventional globs don't have).  Thus, candy would be stored in the glob stockpile, or left where it is because it won't rot.  Tallow and Fat are globs, for example, and don't decay.

Excellent work on the reaction!  Could stand to have a custom workshop though, methinks?  Granted, the kitchen doesn't serve much use when meals aren't being made, so the added value of a kitchen is nice, but then again, everyone will want a dozen candy labs to make their own Willy Wonka's Factory.

[Seriyu]

I wonder if it'd be possible to candy various vermin. (Crickets in suckers and whatnot.)

Although I don't think it's possible to select specific vermin, like ants or whatnot, and a rat in a sucker sounds significantly less okay.

[Girlinhat]

Hmm, perhaps...  I've heard of (and seen) candied crickets and worms, but, I'd rather NOT include that in my game...

[Assassinfox]

Although I don't think it's possible to select specific vermin, like ants or whatnot, and a rat in a sucker sounds significantly less okay.

Never read Discworld?  Rat On A Stick is an iconic Dwarven delicacy.

[Flaede]

Although I don't think it's possible to select specific vermin, like ants or whatnot, and a rat in a sucker sounds significantly less okay.

Never read Discworld?  Rat On A Stick is an iconic Dwarven delicacy.

Honey-glazed rat on a stick!

I don't know the detail with which you can manipulate after-reaction item naming. Can a Vermin corpse use source reaction and add the "honeyed" adjective?

....wait. there are glazing reactions provided for in the raws. Can you Glaze anything? Or just decorateable craft type things. Because a reaction that uses any food and "honey glazes" it would be sweet.