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Morrowind (with Tribunal and Bloodmoon)

124 (58.8%)

Oblivion (with Shivering Isles)

16 (7.6%)

Skyrim

51 (24.2%)

Daggerfall

16 (7.6%)

Arena

4 (1.9%)

Total Members Voted: 209

[Rex_Nex]

I liked the atmosphere of Morrowind more then the other two games, if that helps.

[towerdude]

That's... pretty silly mate. Just ask my five themed roleplay characters who all have distinct different playstyles and quests completed in their own unique ways.

 Being like real life means absolutely nothing. It means so little of nothing that simply bringing it up drives me to make this post. I don't care about realism. I don't care if you have to restrict your choices and have to get specific skills to do well. I want the freedom to make a character that smashes things with a mace and throws lighting with the other hand before putting on an artifact armor despite being the wrong type for my skill. To just wear clothes as a fighter character and have it be viable.

 I want to roleplay without the clunky mechanics holding me back.

The exact opposite, Morrowind doesn't hold you back to do that, it only means that you have basic limits like you can win the game in 1 second, and can't blow up the continent. You could be a necromancer with a horde of undead, wearing plate mail, and use crossbow. However if you want be like that you have to pay the price, unusual character are harder to master.

On the contrary in Skyrim you couldn't really be anything but a shouting, dragon killing barbarian, what gets old fast. I can even finish the Morrowind main story 3 different ways, let alone the thousands of faction quests. Or is it hard to shallow, that you have mission what make you unable to do a mission of an enemy faction?

In Morrowind you have your choices. In Skyrim you have your directions.

ps.: he was the one who pressed the real life stuff by saying, in real life you wear light armor under heavy, then why do we have multiple armor types in the game, and why don't a heavy instanly knows light armor too.

pss.: play Calvinball if you like really unrestricted games

[towerdude]

I greatly dislike Morrowind's leveling mechanics but other features are better than Oblivion and Skyrim.

Also this thread can be summed up as:

Person A states his opinion.
Person B states his opinion that is opposite of that of Person A.
Person A states his opinion on why Person B's opinion is invalid.
Person A states his opinion on why Person A's opinion that Person's B opinion is invalid is invalid.
And so on.

My friend the whole history of our species is about arguments. Without different arguments a group for example could come to the conclusion that their view is the most perfect and the only one. This would only mean that their chance of survival in an unfamiliar situation is lower. However if there are two or more group that stimulate each other, this can be avoided. For instance see why Europe the continent wich was the second last to be settled, got conquered almost all of the world. Europe is the most divided continent, this gives many small defendable areas, that give rise to many nations, topple that with climate: four season that require the most ingenuity, because of the constantly changing, but not too demanding environment (like the arctic or a desert).

ps.: I only started to play Morrowind, because its leveling was unique and unusual compared to the casual grind for xp on monsters.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Objectively speaking, Morrowind is the best Elder Scrolls game and any opinion to the contrary is wrong.

Also, there was no reason to remove the Unarmed and Medium Armor skills, Bethesda.

[Rex_Nex]

Unarmed was fun. Medium armor wasn't fun at all, it was only redundant.

Also, I like how I can look up Morrowind on google and get this thread.

[towerdude]

Unarmed was fun. Medium armor wasn't fun at all, it was only redundant.

Also, I like how I can look up Morrowind on google and get this thread.

Maybe redundant, but it could give you a challange to collect all the best medium armor. Nothing worse like creating a challange to play Adventure Mode as a pacifist, or build a fortress without digging.

[towerdude]

Objectively speaking, Morrowind is the best Elder Scrolls game and any opinion to the contrary is wrong.

Also, there was no reason to remove the Unarmed and Medium Armor skills, Bethesda.

Basically they could have just made a few perks like in Oblivion for skills, like medium armor would give you some unique advantage. For example like the balance in Star Craft between the three races. There should be no best builds, but different builds, that have a "high score" differently. As I said there are good aspects in the first 4 TES games (even if a few in Arena), that could have been all collected, and made into the fifth game.

[Biag]

That's... pretty silly mate. Just ask my five themed roleplay characters who all have distinct different playstyles and quests completed in their own unique ways.

 Being like real life means absolutely nothing. It means so little of nothing that simply bringing it up drives me to make this post. I don't care about realism. I don't care if you have to restrict your choices and have to get specific skills to do well. I want the freedom to make a character that smashes things with a mace and throws lighting with the other hand before putting on an artifact armor despite being the wrong type for my skill. To just wear clothes as a fighter character and have it be viable.

 I want to roleplay without the clunky mechanics holding me back.

The exact opposite, Morrowind doesn't hold you back to do that, it only means that you have basic limits like you can win the game in 1 second, and can't blow up the continent. You could be a necromancer with a horde of undead, wearing plate mail, and use crossbow. However if you want be like that you have to pay the price, unusual character are harder to master.

On the contrary in Skyrim you couldn't really be anything but a shouting, dragon killing barbarian, what gets old fast. I can even finish the Morrowind main story 3 different ways, let alone the thousands of faction quests. Or is it hard to shallow, that you have mission what make you unable to do a mission of an enemy faction?

In Morrowind you have your choices. In Skyrim you have your directions.

ps.: he was the one who pressed the real life stuff by saying, in real life you wear light armor under heavy, then why do we have multiple armor types in the game, and why don't a heavy instanly knows light armor too.

I don't mean "Why wouldn't a plate mail wearer be an expert in leather," I mean "Why is that such an interesting choice that it is worth restricting the player's freedom?" Were I arguing on a "realism" basis, I would point out characters in all Bethesda games can wear the heaviest armor in the world indefinitely without suffering from heat stroke or exhaustion or dehydration. But I don't care about that, because that would not be a fun addition to the game.

I agree with Duke. I love roleplaying. When I get the chance to actually effectively play a character in an RPG it makes me all giddy and fuzzy inside. But my character is not interesting because I had to pick between Strength and Dexterity, my character is interesting because I have a self-imposed rule that my character only has one arm and so I can only ever have one one-handed item equipped. Or my character is interesting because I've decided he hates magic and he kills all magic-users on sight. Or my character is interesting because he is magically bound to never lethally harm another living being and so relies entirely on fists and summoned creatures.

Skyrim was a little too liberal with the number of invincible characters, and I found that extremely frustrating a few times. But even though Morrowind gives me more control over the game world, Skyrim gives me more control over my own character.

Also, like I said, Morrowind isn't fun for me and Skyrim is. We are each free to have our own experiences and they are equally valid.

NINJA EDIT: Fuck yeah though, I want unarmed back. Although the Skyrim VIKING!!! Challenge is still pretty great in an unintended way.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I actually meant Unarmored before, but Unarmed was a good skill as well.

[Rex_Nex]

Unarmed was fun. Medium armor wasn't fun at all, it was only redundant.

Also, I like how I can look up Morrowind on google and get this thread.

Maybe redundant, but it could give you a challange to collect all the best medium armor. Nothing worse like creating a challange to play Adventure Mode as a pacifist, or build a fortress without digging.

Alright, I'm not seeing how this in an argument to keep medium armor though. If the goal is simply to collect it, why would it matter if the label over the armor said medium or heavy? In gameplay terms it was only redundant. One of the better decisions Bethesda made in Oblivion was to remove it.

You know its bad when the best argument you have for keeping an item is that it might be fun to pick it up. I'm sure Bethesda knew this too.

[towerdude]

Unarmed was fun. Medium armor wasn't fun at all, it was only redundant.

Also, I like how I can look up Morrowind on google and get this thread.

Maybe redundant, but it could give you a challange to collect all the best medium armor. Nothing worse like creating a challange to play Adventure Mode as a pacifist, or build a fortress without digging.

Alright, I'm not seeing how this in an argument to keep medium armor though. If the goal is simply to collect it, why would it matter if the label over the armor said medium or heavy? In gameplay terms it was only redundant. One of the better decisions Bethesda made in Oblivion was to remove it.

You know its bad when the best argument you have for keeping an item is that it might be fun to pick it up. I'm sure Bethesda knew this too.

That is why I said this too

Basically they could have just made a few perks like in Oblivion for skills, like medium armor would give you some unique advantage. For example like the balance in Star Craft between the three races. There should be no best builds, but different builds, that have a "high score" differently. As I said there are good aspects in the first 4 TES games (even if a few in Arena), that could have been all collected, and made into the fifth game.

[towerdude]

That's... pretty silly mate. Just ask my five themed roleplay characters who all have distinct different playstyles and quests completed in their own unique ways.

 Being like real life means absolutely nothing. It means so little of nothing that simply bringing it up drives me to make this post. I don't care about realism. I don't care if you have to restrict your choices and have to get specific skills to do well. I want the freedom to make a character that smashes things with a mace and throws lighting with the other hand before putting on an artifact armor despite being the wrong type for my skill. To just wear clothes as a fighter character and have it be viable.

 I want to roleplay without the clunky mechanics holding me back.

The exact opposite, Morrowind doesn't hold you back to do that, it only means that you have basic limits like you can win the game in 1 second, and can't blow up the continent. You could be a necromancer with a horde of undead, wearing plate mail, and use crossbow. However if you want be like that you have to pay the price, unusual character are harder to master.

On the contrary in Skyrim you couldn't really be anything but a shouting, dragon killing barbarian, what gets old fast. I can even finish the Morrowind main story 3 different ways, let alone the thousands of faction quests. Or is it hard to shallow, that you have mission what make you unable to do a mission of an enemy faction?

In Morrowind you have your choices. In Skyrim you have your directions.

ps.: he was the one who pressed the real life stuff by saying, in real life you wear light armor under heavy, then why do we have multiple armor types in the game, and why don't a heavy instanly knows light armor too.

I don't mean "Why wouldn't a plate mail wearer be an expert in leather," I mean "Why is that such an interesting choice that it is worth restricting the player's freedom?" Were I arguing on a "realism" basis, I would point out characters in all Bethesda games can wear the heaviest armor in the world indefinitely without suffering from heat stroke or exhaustion or dehydration. But I don't care about that, because that would not be a fun addition to the game.

I agree with Duke. I love roleplaying. When I get the chance to actually effectively play a character in an RPG it makes me all giddy and fuzzy inside. But my character is not interesting because I had to pick between Strength and Dexterity, my character is interesting because I have a self-imposed rule that my character only has one arm and so I can only ever have one one-handed item equipped. Or my character is interesting because I've decided he hates magic and he kills all magic-users on sight. Or my character is interesting because he is magically bound to never lethally harm another living being and so relies entirely on fists and summoned creatures.

Skyrim was a little too liberal with the number of invincible characters, and I found that extremely frustrating a few times. But even though Morrowind gives me more control over the game world, Skyrim gives me more control over my own character.

Also, like I said, Morrowind isn't fun for me and Skyrim is. We are each free to have our own experiences and they are equally valid.

NINJA EDIT: Fuck yeah though, I want unarmed back. Although the Skyrim VIKING!!! Challenge is still pretty great in an unintended way.

I didn't told you: my favourite Race was always Nords (I am "nord" in real life too, Pale Pass was my favourite mission in Oblivion), so I was over-excited when I saw Skyrim is coming out. That is why I bash it the most. Too much hype to just buy another Fallout. By way because of what you said I am even more convinced, that Morrowind (despite it's semi-turn based system), gives more freedom to control your character. You can make unique spells, armor, weapons. In Skyrim spells worth shit. And perks are not consistent, they just produce a mish mash character, like in Fallout 3, a character that I couldn't place in a fantasy world. Maybe it's just me, but I think a few special abilities that are very well balanced, are better, than 100, that has 5 über perks, what everybody use, because they are the best, and ignor all the others (it's like the refined talent trees in WoW and the skill trees in Diablo 2, there are best combination, and these are only change when they nerf one a bit, then everybody sticks to another). I especially hated in Fallout 3 too, when the game forced you to pick a useless perk, because you couldn't upgrade one of your existing perks yet. And Skyrim headed in the direction of an offline WoW, I like to creat character that suck, not intentionally, but to experiment, however the Skyrim system support it less.

[Kilroy the Grand]

Unarmed was fun. Medium armor wasn't fun at all, it was only redundant.

Also, I like how I can look up Morrowind on google and get this thread.

Maybe redundant, but it could give you a challange to collect all the best medium armor. Nothing worse like creating a challange to play Adventure Mode as a pacifist, or build a fortress without digging.

Alright, I'm not seeing how this in an argument to keep medium armor though. If the goal is simply to collect it, why would it matter if the label over the armor said medium or heavy? In gameplay terms it was only redundant. One of the better decisions Bethesda made in Oblivion was to remove it.

You know its bad when the best argument you have for keeping an item is that it might be fun to pick it up. I'm sure Bethesda knew this too.

Removing features doesn't make a game better. Removing customization options, doesn't make a game better. Thinking like that is why skyrim had 16 skills, and morrowind had 27. Why morrowind had 7 weapon skills and skyrim had 3.

I find it funny that you think skyrim is somehow giving you more freedom while taking away almost all the customization and freedom earlier games had.

[towerdude]

LOL I see Oblivion and Daggerfall have a bad fight for the third place on the poll. Should I include Arena? 

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I'm pretty sure almost no one has ever played Arena.