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[Dorsidwarf]

The reference to "false flag" was in reference to the fact that it was technically possible that the ukranians shot down the plane to blame russia, according to some conspiracy theorists (Which is, I think, Russia's official position on the matter), not to the idea that the russians themselves shot down the liner.

[Reelya]

Ah, ok, I hadn't heard that particular one. That's a stupid theory though. Probably spread by the pro-Russia trolls on FB or something though, right?

However, the real irony here is that back in 2001 there was a downed Russian airliner hit by an actual Ukrainian Army AA missile during a training exercise. It seems that Ukrainians, either pro-west or pro-Russia have a thing about accidentally shooting down airliners.

So, a more plausible conspiracy theory would be that this was payback by the Russians for that one. Maybe they meant to hit a Ukrainian airliner? e.g. if there was a UIA flight plan that was close to where MH17 was meant to fly, then you could in fact have a smoking gun that some Russian elements wanted payback for the 2001 incident. However anti-Russian people wouldn't probably spread a theory like this because it would draw attention to the fact that Ukraine did in fact shoot down a Russian plane, first.

[smjjames]

Hadn’t heard about that one, which isn’t surprising given how close that was to 9/11.

If they really wanted to aim at an Ukrainian airliner, all they had to do was look at the planes transponder which I’m sure even old Soviet radar can see.

[Sheb]

Hadn’t heard about that one, which isn’t surprising given how close that was to 9/11.

If they really wanted to aim at an Ukrainian airliner, all they had to do was look at the planes transponder which I’m sure even old Soviet radar can see.

Well, they shot down a Malaysian plane, so apparently they're not that great.

[redwallzyl]

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/05/26/614655703/ireland-votes-to-lift-its-abortion-ban-exit-polls-show

66.4% that's quite the win.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

As mentioned verbatim by Varadkar, this outcome goes beyond abortion and effectively signifies Ireland's own version of the Quiet Revolution. With a difference of about 30% between yes and no, the RCC in Ireland is sitting dead in the water. Much of their political control endures for the moment, but I think this is a clear demonstration of how much the rolling controversies have turned Irish people against them.

[Strongpoint]

It's very unlikely that the Buk was fired by actual Russian troops. Sure, it was equipment provided by the Russians, but that's been pretty obvious for a while.

I am quite curious. Why do you think Russians couldn't supply crew together with the equipment? I can't find any reason not to. Their own men actually know how to fire it. Their own men will ensure that this equipment won't be lost or vandalized

[Dorsidwarf]

It's very unlikely that the Buk was fired by actual Russian troops. Sure, it was equipment provided by the Russians, but that's been pretty obvious for a while.

I am quite curious. Why do you think Russians couldn't supply crew together with the equipment? I can't find any reason not to. Their own men actually know how to fire it. Their own men will ensure that this equipment won't be lost or vandalized

Because there’s a political difference between arming a group with weapons and sending your own troops to fire those weapons, and by Russia’s frenzied denial of the Crimean “little green men” thing they seem to care about only being caught doing the former

[Reelya]

idk now, i had a look at the evidence in the bellingcat documents, and the Buk launchers are a fair bit bigger and more complex than I thought they would be. Apparently they have a command/control vehicle and separate launch vehicles, whereas I was assuming they were like single-vehicle launchers. It's probably right that they were too complex to just hand to rebels.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Bravo EU.  Bravo.

Introducing mandatory upload filtering and taxes on links between sites to the internet.  By the way, it overrides previous Fair Use laws and makes platforms entirely responsible for what the users do unless it can prove absolutely everything was tried, and even then it might not be enough.

[Reelya]

What the hell, a "link tax"? how the hell is that going to be workable in any way shape or form? forums will have to ban links from their pages then, on the off-chance that it could be linking to copyrighted news articles.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

What the hell, a "link tax"? how the hell is that going to be workable in any way shape or form? forums will have to ban links from their pages then, on the off-chance that it could be linking to copyrighted news articles.

Github's outright admitted it's operation ability would be so thoroughly gutted they don't think they could ever work in the EU, forums are noted to have serious risk, and there's uncertainty that Reddit, Pintrest, Twitch, Imgur, Wordpress, Medium, and Vimeo could function there either.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Is there an available full text of this thing out there?

Only thing I can find is a partial, as Brussels apparently hasn't released the full thing. There's a bit of it here, but that's by no means a complete text.

Still, it seems as if this would have a domino effect of causing a large chunk of the tech sector to abandon EU territory in favor of greener pastures like the non or soon to be non member states of the EU/ECC in Europe, possibly causing an economic downturn as a result.  As noted, Github has expressly stated they probably won't be able to function in Europe, indicating many sites would probably abandon ship (ie. Cutting off access to anyone to head off potential suits), and search engines up to Google could potentially be non-functional due to the link tax situation.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Yeah, there's not much to be concerned about with what you linked there; it's just a "when you collect personal information, give them a giant disclaimer about it" policy. There's definitely something missing if people are kicking up such a fuss.

The catch is, I don't know if that's the right one.  It might be, but it might not.

Edit: Used the video and went through a few news article links.  This looks to be the right one.  Seems I tracked the wrong Article 13 before.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Well, that gets me the text of a proposed amendment, which covers some (but not all) of what's being discussed here. No mention of a "link tax" in the amendment, and as far as I can tell Github does not qualify as an "online content sharing provider" under the original or the proposed change to the text given that they can either be classified as a "open source software development platform... which [does] not store or give access to content for profit making purposes" or a "private cloud repository," depending on function. Then again, I don't think that's the concern here, but I really do need some of the actual text regarding a "link tax" to be clear what's actually being said.

It seems, though, at least under the proposed amendment, that they wish to classify any public hosting service that exists to promote said hosted content as an "online content sharing provider" and hold them as liable for any violation of the many EU laws regarding speech and violations thereof, insomuch that they have not attempted to do so with "best [effort]" using methods "agreed upon with rightholders". That is to say, if you as an entity are a public content hosting entity whose content is not hosted for scientific, historical, or educational purposes and whose content is also not utilized for open-source software development, that you must police the content that you host regardless of whether you profit from said content.

Well, the link is about a month old at this point, with at least one meeting having taken place between then and now (4th of May) noted within the article.  Changes between then and now have probably manifested, but I have no idea where to track that stuff down.