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Author Topic: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost. (TurkePol Thread?)  (Read 11944 times)

Magmacube_tr

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #90 on: May 28, 2023, 01:07:08 pm »

Good luck going forward. Do you have any kind of escape plan?

no
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Strongpoint

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE TODAY!!! (IT IS NOW OR NEVER)
« Reply #91 on: May 28, 2023, 01:08:15 pm »

Few weeks ago, I expected Erdogan to lose. Naive me was sure that collapsing economy and huge casualties from the Earthquake (which would be far lower if not huge corruption in the construction sector) will motivate people to vote against, vote for anyone but the current guy. I was so wrong.


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Maximum Spin

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #92 on: May 28, 2023, 01:20:02 pm »

Good luck going forward. Do you have any kind of escape plan?

no
It might not be a bad idea. What's the border with Greece like?
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Starver

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #93 on: May 28, 2023, 01:30:43 pm »

BBC News had supporters saying as how things were better now than 20 years ago. Of course they are, we've never had a year as high as 2023 until now[1]... But how much of that is down Erdogan might be arguable/circumstancial.

They also showed him handing out actual cash to fawning[2] voters, standing in line to vote. I would actually be surprised if that was against the lcal rules, if he's doing it (and possibly then also his opponent too), but probably should be.


[1[ Though if they go Islamic, it'll become 1444! Maybe they should try Judaism, then it'll be 5783...

[2] Well, to be honest it was probably more gratitude for the handout/determination to not miss out being handed-out to when it's something being done...
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Magmacube_tr

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE TODAY!!! (IT IS NOW OR NEVER)
« Reply #94 on: May 28, 2023, 01:53:27 pm »

Few weeks ago, I expected Erdogan to lose. Naive me was sure that collapsing economy and huge casualties from the Earthquake (which would be far lower if not huge corruption in the construction sector) will motivate people to vote against, vote for anyone but the current guy. I was so wrong.

Cult of Personality around him is too strong. Also, Islam is a pervasive mind disease.

Yavşak arabın, boktan ilahı...
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The_Explorer

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #95 on: May 28, 2023, 03:40:54 pm »

Pretty sure islamaphobia is against the rules, and its at least bigoting an entire religion if it isn't...and people who believe in it.

This thread because of that just reminds me of a far right wing propaganda talk, whatever the intentions were to begin with. That is one of the #1 talking point of the far right (far right in the US, whatever that is in turkey) is how "dangerous" islam is. Blanketing an entire people+religion under one roof. (to add...it also makes me just very slightlier happy the guy won, and I know nothing about him or anywhere in that part of the world, but if the other side was based on bigotry and fear of islam, then its probably good he won. But can't really base it on one single thread and persons single opinion).
« Last Edit: May 28, 2023, 03:50:43 pm by The_Explorer »
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #96 on: May 28, 2023, 03:51:46 pm »

I expected erdogan to win. The way turkish parliament was split suggested erdogan + the far right added more than 50% of votes. Regardless of whether there was fraud or not, I feel it wasnt an unexpected result given that breakdown of votes (whether there was fraud or not)
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Magmacube_tr

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #97 on: May 28, 2023, 03:58:42 pm »

Pretty sure islamaphobia is against the rules, and its at least bigoting an entire religion if it isn't...and people who believe in it.

Sorry, man. Really sorry. I am so, so sorry that I have awful opinion of a religion which wants me dead on two separate accounts. I am so sorry. Sooooooooo sorry.

Yeah, anyone who wants sharia can choke on a fat one. Preferably mine.
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Il Palazzo

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #98 on: May 28, 2023, 03:58:55 pm »

Different countries, different contexts. Islam in Turkey occupies a similar idea-space to Christian fundamentalism in the US. Have you ever railed against Westboro Baptists, religiously-motivated abortion bans, or putting God in your everything? Same category.
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voliol

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #99 on: May 28, 2023, 04:13:29 pm »

Pretty sure islamaphobia is against the rules, and its at least bigoting an entire religion if it isn't...and people who believe in it.

This thread because of that just reminds me of a far right wing propaganda talk, whatever the intentions were to begin with. That is one of the #1 talking point of the far right (far right in the US, whatever that is in turkey) is how "dangerous" islam is. Blanketing an entire people+religion under one roof. (to add...it also makes me just very slightlier happy the guy won, and I know nothing about him or anywhere in that part of the world, but if the other side was based on bigotry and fear of islam, then its probably good he won. But can't really base it on one single thread and persons single opinion).

Erdogan is a right-wing politician with an Islamistic streak, the Putin kind of personality. Suffice to say his flavor of Islam is not a wholesome one. Magmacube will have to corroborate (and he ninja'd and already did), but the relation between any majority religion used for conservative/regressive purposes and a secular member of the same state, and a minority religion in another state.

But yeah, it's wise to not make blanket statements about Islam and also Arabs, though I am unsure about the translation of that last sentence.

EuchreJack

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #100 on: May 28, 2023, 05:12:38 pm »

Pretty sure islamaphobia is against the rules, and its at least bigoting an entire religion if it isn't...and people who believe in it.

This thread because of that just reminds me of a far right wing propaganda talk, whatever the intentions were to begin with. That is one of the #1 talking point of the far right (far right in the US, whatever that is in turkey) is how "dangerous" islam is. Blanketing an entire people+religion under one roof. (to add...it also makes me just very slightlier happy the guy won, and I know nothing about him or anywhere in that part of the world, but if the other side was based on bigotry and fear of islam, then its probably good he won. But can't really base it on one single thread and persons single opinion).
I'm getting sick of this "Beat on the victim of persecution because they're not 100% politically correct about their oppressor's dogma"  >:(

Frumple

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #101 on: May 28, 2023, 05:35:30 pm »

It's not an issue of politically correct, though. Any particular major religion is going to be heavily fractured, and they all have significant parts of their demographic that's not hateful shitgoblins, so when you paint them all with one brush you're just. Not right, y'know? It's not an issue of being PC, it's an issue of taking too broad a brush to too diverse a polity.

Everything I've seen in life indicates islam's no worse than any other religion in the conditions it's a majority presence in (which, to be clear, is less praise of islam than it is condemnation of the general behavior of religious organizations). Problem's less that islam's particularly troublesome and more than religion in general needs to be kept well the fuck away from governing or significant secular power, 'cause it bloody never goes well when it isn't. If the turkish powers that be were predominately christian, or hindu, or buddhist, or what the hell ever, you'd pretty certainly be seeing pretty much the exact same cursed behavior.

Add in a dash of not wanting someone going through a shit time to get in trouble with the forum rules on conduct and you get people commenting like that, for better or worse.

... any case, best of luck mag. It's a shit thing to be going through, hopefully something will keep it from going completely terrible, or at least you get the opportunity to escape before the worst comes about.
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The_Explorer

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #102 on: May 28, 2023, 06:24:56 pm »

I mean, no one should be targeted because of gender or who they are attracted to.

Just painting an entire people or belief system in the same brush isn't right either.

There are people full of hate everywhere, in every religion AND no religion at all. But they are (I hope anyway) a small group of people, in the grand scheme of things.

To take the bible as an example (and this is coming from someone who isn't actually religious at all but do have religious members in the family), it says God accepts and loves everyone. Yet the far right gladly and openly ignores that part. But that doesn't mean everyone who believes in the bible are the same. Same with islam and anything else. Even athiests can be pieces of junk. But most people are good people, and I know many people from the middle east who are either believe in islam (a couple are catholic I believe, dont really get into religious stuff with friends) who are amazing and don't want to prosecute anyone.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2023, 06:27:18 pm by The_Explorer »
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Magmacube_tr

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #103 on: May 28, 2023, 06:56:58 pm »

I don't care if someones an Arab. I live in Anatolia. Being an anti-Arab racist here would be like hating your neighbors.

I can, and will be bitter and aggressive about Islam though. Look, I know you guys have no completely direct equalivent, but listen. Islam is a primordial abomination that emerged from the mind of a 7th century, epileptic schizophrenic Arabic merchant with serious issues. Islam is not a good thing. Any person who looks at it from the outside and is capable of thinking will immidiately back off. Only way you can even be content in it is that if you are indoctrinated from birth and never exposed to any alternatives.

It isn't like Christianity, where a reformation has happened to mitigate and break apart some of its influence. You have to understand. You have to.
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Maximum Spin

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Re: TURKISH ELECTIONS ARE... Over. All is lost.
« Reply #104 on: May 28, 2023, 06:59:37 pm »

I'd say that Islam, taken literally, is worse than most other religions. Maybe not Hinduism, which comes with a built-in caste system, but nearly as bad. It combines the theocratic legalism of Leviticus with the by-the-sword evangelism of the Crusades (which, at least, was non-Biblical, something they had to rationalize rather than an explicit commandment). It's certainly fair to say that most adherents, especially in the West, don't take it that literally, but that doesn't excuse the holy book in and of itself. It just means that they are, in a historical sense, less observantly Muslim.

A lot of people in America and, to a lesser extent, Europe feel like disliking Islam is low-class, but they haven't actually read what the scripture itself says. Having seen both, I would say it is categorically worse than the Christians'.
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