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[Grek]

I had a few ideas for things that could be made at the alchemist's workshop.

Asprin- from willow trees, can be given to dwarfs by doctors to ease pain.

Iron sulfate is a byproduct of smelting iron. Copper sulfate is from copper, brass or bronze. Iron sulfate or copper sulfate can be heated to make sulfuric acid. Vials of acid and water can be made into traps by mechanics.

Chemical lanterns - Zinc sulfide (zinc ore), when mixed with trace amounts of some other metals glows in the dark. Silver makes a blue light;  Manganese makes orange-red; copper makes green.

Calamine lotion - Zinc oxide and trace amounts of iron oxide makes calamine lotion. Used by doctors. Zinc oxide is a byproduct of smelting brass.

Aluminium sulphate can be used at a tanners shop to speed up or improve leather making. Alot of other chemicals would work as well.

Silver nitrate is made from silver and nitric acid. It can be used to treat burns and prevent infection. Nitric acid is very acidic and makes fumes.

Anyone else got ideas?

[Haedrian]

I don't know anything about the extraction of sulfur, but something which explodes when the temperature goes up too high is very exploitable in traps.

Added: I'm talking about black powder, can be made from charcoal, sulfur, and a nitrate..

[ August 04, 2007: Message edited by: Haedrian ]

[Bien]

Saltpeter and some other stuff that when mixed makes gunpowder which can be used to propell bullets or for explosives.

[KrunkSplein]

I dont think DF is ready for the introduction of gunpowder just yet, but I like pretty much everything Grek suggested.  The chemical lanterns would be perfect for when Light is implemented, and Acid traps sound like heavily-damaging stonefall traps (as in it needs to be reloaded with a new vial of acid after being triggered).  For the Calamine Lotion and Aspirin to really be effective, we'd really need a Hospital, which is one of my favorite ideas.  Not sure how worthwhile the leather additives would be.

One more potential use of the Acids is to pickle jewelry or other metal works.  Once rusting or other degradation of weapons/armor is in, the acids can be used to repair the item.

[Tamren]

Explosives would be okay. Just not gunpowder.

Gunpowder is pretty much an "easy" explosive. You can carry it around, drop it and it will not just blow up on its own. Compared to say... nitroglicerin

In df i wouldnt mind having explosives, as long as they are VERY dangerous, poorly understood and in no way convenient.

[Poil]

Giving goblins gunpowder that they use to blast their way into your fortress would be pretty cool though. They arrive with a barrel of gunpowder, charge a good spot near the mountain and sets fire to the barrel. Goblin zappers.  :cool:

[Battleguy01]

I think gunpowder is a good idea.

[Aquillion]

quote:Originally posted by Grek:
<STRONG>I had a few ideas for things that could be made at the alchemist's workshop.</STRONG>

These names are all too modern...  we should stick to older ones.

quote:Asprin- from willow trees, can be given to dwarfs by doctors to ease pain.

Willow tea.  Willow extract, maybe.

quote:Iron sulfate is a byproduct of smelting iron. Copper sulfate is from copper, brass or bronze. Iron sulfate or copper sulfate can be heated to make sulfuric acid. Vials of acid and water can be made into traps by mechanics.

Oil of vitriol is its historical alchemic name.

quote:Chemical lanterns - Zinc sulfide (zinc ore), when mixed with trace amounts of some other metals glows in the dark. Silver makes a blue light;  Manganese makes orange-red; copper makes green.

Alchemic lanterns.

quote:Calamine lotion - Zinc oxide and trace amounts of iron oxide makes calamine lotion. Used by doctors. Zinc oxide is a byproduct of smelting brass.

It's worth pointing out that according to the FDA, calamine lotion doesn't actually work; what effect it has comes from the general sensation of rubbing any lotion into an itch, combined with the placebo effect.

I think dwarves should have some black-powder explosives for use in traps or mining (e.g. breaching lava or water safely), and maybe a few crude cannons (they've been around for a rather long time--for instance, a famously huge cannon with a range of around a mile was used in the final siege of Constantinople, in 1453.)  I doubt they'd have personal firearms, though.

Oh!  Maybe the alchemist could make fireworks, too.  They could be used in traps to burn, scare, and blind people, or could be used outdoors to generate happy thoughts from fireworks displays.  Plus they'd be a valuable trade good, of course.

[4bh0r53n]

cannons were used frequently before that, quite a few were used by both sides in the 100 year's war, they were totally ineffective (they could only fire 4 times a day at the best of times, and would not work in rain at all), their only real advantage was in scaring horses from the large amount of noise and smoke.

[AlanL]

As far as I've seen, dwarves seem far more advanced than the date would suggest, and although they wont be modern-day by any means, i think they would know at least the basics of 'modern' (maybe what woulda been late 1700s/early 1800s ish in reality) chemistry.

[ August 06, 2007: Message edited by: AlanL ]

[Mechanoid]

A long time ago Toady posted a list of all the new materials that are in the next version of dwarf fortress, of which sulfur and others are included... Along with pitchblende, an ore of uranium.

So uh, yeah.
The Alchemist noble and associated workshop will probably have some use, after the next version.

Also, though chemical lanterns are freakin' awsome, but they'd have absolutely zero use without a lighting system. No point in making torches /oil lanterns /etc without them being able to perform their function and actually cast light, after all.

[ August 06, 2007: Message edited by: Mechanoid ]

[Capntastic]

quote:Originally posted by Battleguy01:
<STRONG>I think gunpowder is a good idea.</STRONG>

I think gunpowder is a bad idea.    :p

[PTTG]

Mechanoid, Could you give us a link to that info about new ores? I'm curious because I am DIEING to know anything about the new stuff. Or possible stuff, or flat out ridiculous ideas that will never be in the game, at least not in this release.

Also- Personally I think mining charges and crude cannons (even if muskets are out of the question) would fit with the game world, but I have read elsewhere that the Great Toad has his own reasons against Gunpowder, and I guess that's that.

[ August 08, 2007: Message edited by: PTTG ]

[Rooster]

How 'bout some ancient chineese cannons?

they were made from a tree log and cannon bullets were made from clay!

the most suprising thing is... that it actually could work!(of course if you wouldn't place too much powder in that hole   :cool: )

[Spelguru]

I would just like to point something out. Just one tiny little detail. Which is kinda obvious, but it doesn't seem like it.

THIS IS NOT WOW! Really, it's not. There are no hippie night elves, no taurens, no orcs (why are there no orcs btw, the goblins bigger cousin?), there are undead but they don't do some crazy headbanger punk dance nor do they do warlocky stuff, there are no gnomes and finally: dwarves aren't explosives experts.

Seriously, I would bet money that every single page of the suggestions forums history has one or more posts involving gunpowder, explosives, guns or such. While I'm all for added knowledge of *stuff* for dwarves, alot of you are (in my opinion) just plain crazy. Dwarves doesn't equal chemical experts. Metallurgists are much more fitting. Making chemicals lanterns by only using metals = dwarven. Making medicines with only metals = dwarven. Making potent acids with metals + some heat = dwarven. Making a big keg o gunpowder and use it to blow up the mountain... not dwarven.

Once again: this is not WoW. There aren't guns (this aint ma' BOOMSTICK), not even arcanite ones. There aren't mechanical squirrels, even though they're cute. There aren't sophisticated sniper scopes made from ridicously expensive gems, even though they give +5 damage (even to bows for some reason).

While the dwarves might develop a gunpowder age way later into the game, like after a decent amount of time, like 500 years or so, you have to consider one thing: what about the humans? Since they are above ground, way more greedy, probably more inventive over a more broad spectrum (whereas dwarves only aim for metals and mechanics and smithing) coupled with their desire to leave a lasting mark (and amass alot of wealth) due to their short fragile lives... Isn't it more likely that they should get gunpowder weaponry sooner that the dwarves?

Also, final thing: This seems to be a fantasy game, I might be wrong, but I'm fairly certain it's fantasy. Tech and Fantasy makes *ugly* partners, unless done completely right. WoW didn't manage that. "Durrr, look at that giant charging demon, ok left group throw grenades and right group do hunters mark and shoot l0l0l0l!"

Anyways: /rant